| ▲ | Brendinooo 8 hours ago |
| I'm a little surprised at the price (especially when their newly-announced HomeView is the same price, and it has a screen!). I love this product: it's the one box I can (reasonably) trust to not be mining my viewing habits for data. I have two older ones and was looking to get something that supported 4K but waited for this to come out. $300 might be a decent price if you use it for all of the things that it can do, but if all you're doing is launching streaming apps, $200 was already on the high end for that. $300 seems...a bit much. Anything I'm missing here? The silver lining is that this product is almost certainly still in the "pay money then forget about it for a decade" tier, which is nice. I'm also wondering if/how the "add up to four homepods" feature compares to "getting a soundbar". In the other thread for this someone noted that the HomePods only work with this box; so if you're running a game console that's no bueno. But apart from that, if $600 on an Apple TV + two HomePods mini delivers something comparable to a ~$500 soundbar, that's a decent value proposition. |
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| ▲ | m463 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > mining my viewing habits apple tv isn't private, apple does mine your viewing habits, read their eula. You should also know that all non-apple apps like netflix have unrestricted network access and can/will do the same. It is too bad that people accept apple's marketing about privacy, because they have dark patterns, they collect telemetry, they don't let you block it, and they help apps do the same things. A privacy policy is not the same as being able to firewall your device, but apple doesn't allow firewalls. |
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| ▲ | ProllyInfamous 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Just FYI on MacOS's default telemetry: 1) By default, every word (each character, actually) you input into Spotlight/Siri gets time-stamped and sent to `smoot.apple.com` 2) Even with a Pi-Hole blocking *.apple.com (i.e. using MacOS >> Networking >> DNS Server), on boot all modern Apple Silicon reaches out to security.apple.com (i.e. bypassing the user's manual-input DNS setting), using the DHCP-issued DNS IP [0] pro-tip: use your router's DHCP to auto-issue your local Pi-Hole's IP address [as DNS] with your IP-leases; then you'll actually be able to block all *.apple.com traffic (using the PiHole which your DHCP issues to, by default) [0] this is for security chip "lockout" detection (e.g.) and it is pervasive across NICs (i.e. it REALLY seeks any attempt for DNS resolution to security.apple.com) | | |
| ▲ | IndySun 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | >...pro-tip... Thank you for the detailed suggestion. I use LittleSnitch. pi-hole previously, I must take another look. Did you catch LG spying posts? | |
| ▲ | kvuj 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > 1) By default, every word (each character, actually) you input into Spotlight/Siri gets time-stamped and sent to `smoot.apple.com` Huh? How do you expect Apple to show live search results if they don't send what you're typing to their servers? > 2) Even with a Pi-Hole blocking *.apple.com (i.e. using MacOS >> Networking >> DNS Server), on boot all modern Apple Silicon reaches out to security.apple.com (i.e. bypassing the user's manual-input DNS setting), using the DHCP-issued DNS IP [0] From a quick google search, it seems to be if you enable "Find my" or pass word recovery with an Apple account. I think that's reasonable to expect if you enable these features. | | |
| ▲ | gambiting an hour ago | parent [-] | | >>Huh? How do you expect Apple to show live search results if they don't send what you're typing to their servers? I don't want spotlight to show any online results in the first place, is there anyone here who does? | | |
| ▲ | jmb99 35 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Settings -> Spotlight -> Turn off everything you don't want. The first few times you open it it even tells you this. Admittedly I haven't confirmed that this results in no API calls in the latest few macOS releases but it definitely used to stop them, at least a few years ago. |
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| ▲ | eli 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I'm comfortable with the idea that Netflix can collect data about what I watch on Netflix, and that Apple can track what I buy in the Apple app. I'm not comfortable with my TV or streaming stick manufacturer collecting and mining data about everything that appears on the screen. | |
| ▲ | GeekyBear 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Privacy advocates recommend Apple TV for a reason. > Breaking down why Apple TVs are privacy advocates’ go-to streaming device https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/06/all-the-ways-apple-t... | |
| ▲ | Sir_Twist 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Apple (mostly) isn’t in the business of selling ads. I’d certainly trust this over most other options. | | |
| ▲ | a123b456c an hour ago | parent [-] | | Actually, they sell lots of ads in the app store. I will not be surprised if they sell video ads, display ads or search ads in the future. They could earn tens of billions in revenue per year; the main business question is how that trades off against the various downsides of advertising sales. | | |
| ▲ | pooloo 9 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Apple generated $416 billion in total net sales in 2025. Of that total, $307 billion (about 74% of total revenue) came directly from their hardware ecosystem. The services segment generated the remaining $109 billion (26%); including their advertising platforms, AppleCare, cloud services, and Apple TV... Seems like their advertising might not be a focus... |
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| ▲ | neya 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > it's the one box I can (reasonably) trust to not be mining my viewing habits for data. It's mind-blowing how one of the most advanced technology forums on the internet can take privacy for granted just because the marketing of a for-profit corporation with previous histories of privacy violations (there's even lawsuits) claims their closed source device connected 24/7 to the internet, is private. |
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| ▲ | Brendinooo 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | >It's mind-blowing how one of the most advanced technology forums on the internet can take privacy for granted that's not what I did > just because the marketing not just because of the marketing > of a for-profit corporation with previous histories of privacy violations (there's even lawsuits) claims their closed source device connected 24/7 to the internet, is private. in other words, they are being watched and held accountable when they do screw up, which obviates a lot of the "well maybe they're stealing your data and we don't know about it" nonsense elsewhere in the replies. I'll ask something specific: We know that Rokus and built-in smart TVs are actively tracking and monetizing everything you do on your television. People can prove this by looking at what calls are made on your network. Does Apple do the same thing? | | |
| ▲ | halJordan 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Apple literally does do the same thing. Especially (!) with Apple TV. Go read the eula's again. Apple TV, Apple Maps & Apple News all perform data mining largely akin to how their competitors do it. There are specific carve outs for those three services. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | A quick search suggests that Roku does ~380 network requests per hour. LG smart TVs running webOS typically generate regular hourly background checks, plus periodic or continuous telemetry and Automatic Content Recognition requests. Does Apple TV even do ACR in any form? Is it scanning my network and phoning home about it? | | |
| ▲ | halJordan 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Ah nice. You know Apple literally invented Bonjour and mDNS? They know what's on your network. The only difference is that we applaud them for it. Does the apple tv do acr? It has to, to do the first party "magic" it does. Again, we just applaud them for it because they "only use it for first party services." Why are you so offended that Apple is just another for profit megacorp. | | |
| ▲ | CharlesW 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Does the apple tv do acr? It has to, to do the first party "magic" it does. You're just making stuff up. Apple TV does not do ACR. Apple does provide a TV App API that allows select app developers to get a special entitlement allowing them to contribute viewing data. Read this carefully: https://developer.apple.com/support/terms/apple-developer-pr... "Apple will obtain user consent based on the user’s Apple Account before including Your Licensed Application in the TV App Features displayed under that Apple Account. Apple will also provide users with the ability to withdraw such consent at any time thereafter and to delete their TV App Data from Apple’s systems." | |
| ▲ | HelloMcFly 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > Does the apple tv do acr? It has to, to do the first party "magic" it does. I'm sorry, you're stating this like some obvious fact. Apple has previously said this is not the case and they do not do ACR. The Apple TV is the only Apple device I have, so you can set aside any reflexive critiques of my brand loyalty. What is your precise claim? Why am I a dullard for reading that Apple TV does not use ACR and believing it? The entire reason I bought an Apple TV was to reduce the amount of data skimming happening in the background and ads being shoved in front of my face in the foreground, it's not like I'm lousy with options. | |
| ▲ | andylynch 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It’s quite a take to make lan sharing some kind of grand conspiracy. Is LAN manager sus too? | |
| ▲ | kakacik 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I just cant have a rational discussion with apple folks. Not here, not anywhere else. Its emotions and double values all way down. For profit org that has its personalized ad part of business growing massively, is scanning all your photos, gives all data to NSA like there is no tomorrow is somehow better, becase carefully crafted PR said so. Especially if one is not US citizen, or multinational, or US citizen not on US soil, and so on. They make great, hard vendor-locked hardware and mediocre software. Lets keep them at that and not some magical privacy champions when they are not, not where it actually matters. | | |
| ▲ | zapzupnz 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > I just cant have a rational discussion with apple folks. Not here, not anywhere else. Its emotions and double values all way down. Your post doesn't sound any different, what with the tarring a group of people with the same brush. You've decided that your feelings about a type of company trump anybody else's opinions about a particular company. With a fairly derisive tone, at that. | |
| ▲ | nntwozz 44 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | I'm not piling on, just an honest question. Do you consider Final Cut Pro and Logic Pro as mediocre? |
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| ▲ | eli 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Unlike their competitors, Apple does not do Automatic Content Recognition (ACR). That matters to me. | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Apple literally does do the same thing. ... all perform data mining largely akin to how their competitors do it. Funny how the OP carefully skimmed this part out in their reply, but BINGO, I think this is the attitude we should have towards privacy. Sometimes I just feel like we're talking to a bunch of bots on here when it comes to privacy with their blind support towards for-profit corporations that doesn't give a shit about them. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | > the OP carefully skimmed this part out lol >we're talking to a bunch of bots on here Ah. Okay. In a different tenor of conversation I'd be happy to clarify but...not when I'm up against this. |
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| ▲ | andsoitis 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The distortion field is powerful. Keep the firewall of skepticism high. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | What is a better solution here? What is something that lets me stream from the major services, has a good-enough remote, and doesn't require any fiddling on my part? I've always seen Apple TV as the least-bad option compared to Roku/Fire/whatever Google is doing these days/literally any built-in solution. | | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > I've always seen Apple TV as the least-bad option compared to Roku If this was your original statement, I think we all would be on your side - I even use an Apple TV 4k personally and love it. It definitely is the best in the market for what it does. > it's the one box I can (reasonably) trust to not be mining my viewing habits for data. Instead, you framed it as the only privacy-friendly option and that is logically and factually incorrect. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | I think you read a bunch into my stuff and then responded to the arguments you thought I was making, then accused me of craftily dodging things, then implied I was a bot. |
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| ▲ | andsoitis 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think it depends on what you prioritize. I have an Apple TV, but also LG and Samsung smart TVs as well as Google TV Streamer. They come with different tradeoffs wrt price, A/V quality, user interface, privacy, etc. For me, the #1 thing is A/V quality. I don’t care about price, but most people do. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | I want something that's capable, not fiddly, and reasonably respects my privacy. I haven't found a better product in this segment yet. |
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| ▲ | derefr 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I believe you could buy a random Android streaming box with an unlocked bootloader, and then install LineageOS on it. Not sure about the “streams from all the major services” part re: LineageOS, but last I heard it’s improving. (There are also some boxes made specifically for this, usually sold as development platforms for STB products, marketed based on what SoC they contain. Though they’ll tend to be $200, while the random “finished product” streaming box will be more like $30. Both come with decent remotes.) | | |
| ▲ | kybernetikos 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | LineageOS on a cheap box will be L3 widevine, and fail play integrity, which means netflix and a bunch of other streaming apps won't even install. Even if you can get them to install, the L3 will stop you from viewing Prime, Disney+ or other similar services at anything better than SD. I'm also interested in alternatives, but LineageOS on a cheap box isn't really one. |
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| ▲ | colordrops 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > I can (reasonably) trust to not be mining my viewing habits for data That's precisely what you did. | |
| ▲ | steele 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | One of the products you mentioned is named Home View. It's right there. Both new SKUs ship with their voice assistant interface to Google Gemini (and friends) in an environment where memory and storage availability is being monopolized by cloud infrastructure. | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Does Apple do the same thing? Yes, they did: https://www.reuters.com/legal/apple-pay-95-million-settle-si... Apple routinely recorded their private conversations after they activated Siri unintentionally, and disclosed these conversations to third parties such as advertisers.
Can you prove they aren't actively doing it now?edit: link | | |
| ▲ | matwood 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | https://www.reuters.com/technology/apple-clarifies-siri-priv... "Apple has never used Siri data to build marketing profiles, never made it available for advertising, and never sold it to anyone for any purpose," Apple said on Wednesday. Unintentionally activating Siri and then recording is very different from the active listening things going on. Shared with advertisers was speculation. | | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | A billion dollar company's public statement defending itself of a crime it was accused of committing and is sued for, is the source of truth now and what it was actually accused of doing is considered speculation? Sure. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Since you clearly know something the rest of the world's regulators do not, you should file a multi-billion lawsuit and get your money. | | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Since you clearly know something the rest of the world's regulators do not, you should get an unpaid employee of the year award and get your money. Again, you don't know they aren't doing any of these privacy violations again right now. You are just vomiting their marketing BS again and again "Apple means privacy". Historically their shady acts weren't discovered until much later - battery gate, siri lawsuit, etc. You're starting on personal attacks and sounding more like a bot, so I'm going to stop here. | | |
| ▲ | zapzupnz 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | > You're starting on personal attacks and then > and sounding more like a bot Pot, kettle, etc. Per HN guidelines: "Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes." |
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| ▲ | Brendinooo 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | >Yes, they did This has nothing to do with the specific question I asked, and I'm not sure why you'd think so unless Roku has some kind of Siri-like feature (which wasn't what I was intending when I asked regardless). (also, that's a dead link) | | |
| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | You did mention "monetizing everything you do (on your television)", my answer was for that part. Again, my question to you is - it's closed source, do you have proof they aren't actually doing it? Or are you going to wait for another half a decade for another lawsuit to find out? My point is, it's a for-profit corporation. And a really efficient one. They don't care about anyone's privacy or anything else. Only profits. History has proof - battery gate, siri lawsuit, etc. | | |
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| ▲ | HeavenFox 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Of all the major tech companies around the world, Apple has the most incentive to actually deliver privacy, and has the best track record. | | |
| ▲ | Synaesthesia 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | The Snowden PRISM revelations showed that all the major tech companies work with the US government and its spy agencies. Can't trust anyone. | | |
| ▲ | dpark 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | Snowden’s PRISM leak seemed largely to be an overhyped internal PowerPoint. The claim was that they have access to data from Apple, Google, Microsoft, et al. But I’ve never seen any evidence that these companies were giving the government access to their servers or some general data pipe. But rather than they were cooperating with legally served warrants. Is there some actual evidence of collusion with the big tech companies? Because I haven’t seen it. (Telecoms I’ve heard were and are much more integrated.) | | |
| ▲ | nostrademons 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | PRISM was FISA, and was overhyped. There's a known (and legal) procedure for law enforcement agencies to go to major tech companies with a warrant and say "We need all the information for the account holder of xyz@gmail.com, because they are the subject of an active investigation." There are some concerns about how FISA courts are just rubber-stamps and don't actually read or challenge the warrants for validity, but at least nominally, the procedure is above-board and legal. The next Snowden disclosure (MUSCULAR) was significantly more concerning though. It was that the NSA was tapping the internal fiber of Big Tech companies. I was at Google when the Snowden disclosures broke, and read the SRE postmortem. They found 2 fiber cuts underneath the English Channel, an hour apart, lining up with the start of the program as disclosed by Snowden. My inference is that the NSA paid off MI6 to send a submarine commando team to cut and tap the fiber of an American company, without consent, and then all the data was shared through Five-Eyes reciprocal data sharing agreements. Google leadership was hopping mad after this, but it would've been impolitic to bring it to the public. They started encrypting all internal traffic soon after, assuming that their internal network was compromised by various nation-state actors, which had some unfortunate effects on their internal culture of openness. | | |
| ▲ | SoftTalker 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | Good practice in general to not trust your internal network. The head security guy where I worked 20 years ago was already saying this. | | |
| ▲ | mr_toad 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | I have to say your head security guy was way ahead of the curve. Anywhere I’ve worked it was firewall everything and use VPNs, and most places still do this. SFTP was in the too hard basket. And of course that led to people emailing files around as standard practice (and the only option) and inevitably some got emailed to the wrong recipients. |
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| ▲ | HumblyTossed 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > Of all the major tech companies around the world, Apple has the most incentive to actually deliver privacy, and has the best track record. Honestly, based on what? That they haven't been caught? | | |
| ▲ | vallerie 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | It's a major selling point, for one. They actively sell their products on privacy to the average person and an exposé would harm their image quite significantly. That said they are not perfect - e.g their wording in their own tracking consent prompts vs the ones they force on others. | | |
| ▲ | Rohansi 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | > It's a major selling point, for one. That's marketing. Do you always trust everything in marketing material? | | |
| ▲ | stouset 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Apple has done more than literally any other technology company to limit their own ability to ever access your personal data. Always missing from the paranoid lunatic side of this discussion: what devices do you use? I presume you do all your computing on an abacus? | | |
| ▲ | Rohansi 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Personally I don't deny those claims. I question their motive. Most people don't care much about anything except camera/microphone/location access, so why invest so much into engineering all of these solutions? Are they just morally superior to others? Or are they using the reputation they created for themselves to justify locking down their platforms? Because there are things only Apple can be trusted with? | | |
| ▲ | stouset an hour ago | parent [-] | | They sell their own products to you and that’s all they care about. Google, Meta, Amazon and others want to collect a profile on you in order to target ads or more products to you. With Apple, you are the customer. With others, you’re the product. It’s an easy differentiator for them, plain and simple. | | |
| ▲ | Rohansi 4 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Apple has their own ads and personalization is enabled by default. Why not make it opt-in? > They sell their own products to you and that’s all they care about. You can also extend this to say that they want you to only buy their devices/services. If you have an iPhone then non-Apple smart watches are missing basic functionality such as replying to text messages. Force everyone to use Safari and limit it's functionality to force apps onto the App Store (30% cut!). | |
| ▲ | computomatic 23 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | It’s more of a fun anecdote, but people forget that there was once a plague of stolen Apple devices. Apple customers were frequently targeted by pickpockets, etc. because of the value of the devices. I have no evidence but I’ve always believed this was the root of the privacy focus - Apple could lock devices to biometrics and eliminate various workarounds, making stolen devices worthless, and the thefts evaporated practically overnight. Phone theft is a growing problem again, but it’s still less common than it was because they need to get an unlocked device, and I don’t hear them targeting Apple in particular. |
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| ▲ | HumblyTossed 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It's paranoia now to question a 4 Trillion dollar company? I presume truth and facts are important, no? | | |
| ▲ | stouset 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | It’s paranoid lunacy to ignore the irrefutable, demonstrable work that they’ve done to minimize the data they can ever collect or access while conveniently ignoring the miserable track record of every one of their competitors, and to ascribe intentions to them that are in direct conflict to every intentional action they’ve taken in at least the past decade. |
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| ▲ | HumblyTossed 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Apple has done more than literally any other technology company to limit their own ability to ever access your personal data. I mean, it's what they _say_ they do. Do we know? | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | What's the claim here, that they are doing nefarious things that are undetectable? Because we know that this is probably the most scrutinized tech company on the planet, and we know that they've been caught and penalized for errors in the past. Do you have any evidence to present, or is this pure FUD? | | |
| ▲ | HumblyTossed 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | If you read what I have written, I have not made a single claim. I'm only asking if people put faith in Apples claims because they're, well, Apple, or do we _know_ their claims are valid. | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Having spent a lot of time in the open source world, I'm aware of the concept that I can never know for sure if I can't see the code. (And even if I could, that wouldn't tell us with certainly how that the data that code creates/captures is used by the people using it.) But I do think that, in general, Apple tends to be the least-bad actor among its mainstream competitors: its primary business model does not depend on harvesting and selling data, and it has made this value proposition a part of its marketing, and people high up in the company have spoken about ways that they personally value it. And, for any story about ways in which Apple has failed here, there are certainly twice as many for any other company they compete with. I mean, step back: Who cares more about my privacy - Apple or Google? Apple or Roku? Can anyone seriously argue the latter for either? > I'm only asking if people put faith in Apples claims because they're, well, Apple, or do we _know_ their claims are valid. If we _know_, then there would be no need for faith. Given the lack of options and the lack of certainty, people must place their faith somewhere (or take on a lot of technical burden to roll their own); given everything I've seen, it's more reasonable to place faith in Apple than basically anyone else in "Big Tech" in this regard. (But again: if there's a product out there that is very similar to Apple TV in every way except that it is more private: please tell me what that product is. I'd be thrilled to consider it.) | | |
| ▲ | HumblyTossed 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > I mean, step back: Who cares more about my privacy - Apple or Google? Apple or Roku? Can anyone seriously argue the latter for either? I don't know. But I don't care about Google or Roku. I'm simply asking, are we sure Apple keeps things as private as they say. HN apparently hates to question Apple... | | |
| ▲ | Brendinooo 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | If you read my lengthy reply and came away with "this guy hates to question Apple", you are not reading my reply at all. | |
| ▲ | stouset 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | HN hates when people are “just asking questions” but haven’t bothered to make any attempt whatsoever to answer those questions. Yes, Apple has actually put work into designing, building, and shipping secure enclaves. Yes, they have put a gargantuan amount of work into PCC to uphold the claims they make about its privacy. Yes, they employ differential privacy. Yes, they have shipped a feature that enables privacy-conscious users to be the only ones to hold the keys to their iCloud account. And on and on and on. Nothing will ever be enough for you. You aren’t asking these questions in good faith. If you were, you’d have your answers already. | | |
| ▲ | HumblyTossed an hour ago | parent [-] | | > HN hates when people are “just asking questions” but haven’t bothered to make any attempt whatsoever to answer those questions. I have and don't see much evidence at all except a bunch of influencers saying Apple is tops in privacy. Apple has plenty of default settings gaps that allow THEM to collect your data. They capitulate in certain markets. And who knows what Trump made them do? |
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| ▲ | alsetmusic 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | They invited security researchers to inspect their implementation of Private Cloud Compute. I expect there’d be a news story worth a good amount of traffic if they said it and didn’t allow people to do so. That there has been no such story suggests that there hasn’t been scandal. |
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| ▲ | dd8601fn 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I trust that when they don’t do it perfectly, a million nerds are going to scream “finally! Gotcha!” …while running far worse stuff themselves, the whole time. | | |
| ▲ | microtonal 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yet, most people fall for the E2E-encrypted iMessage story, while the Messages are only encrypted at rest when you have iCloud Backup enabled (I’d guess most people) and ADP disabled (I’d guess most people). The fact that I have ADP enabled doesn’t matter because most people I communicate with don’t have ADP enabled (or know what it is). This is all only mentioned in the footnote of an iCloud security document [1]. Apple cares about your privacy, so much that they made a backdoor through bad defaults, well in reach of the CLOUD Act. [1] Footnote 9 in https://support.apple.com/en-us/102651 | | |
| ▲ | HumblyTossed 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > Yet, most people fall for the E2E-encrypted iMessage story, Most people don't even understand that when their favorite app that says E2E that that app still has access to the clear text before it's encrypted... |
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| ▲ | flanz_10 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | No, but when they make claims in marketing material and then lie, it opens them to huge liability. So there is an enforcement path. | | |
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| ▲ | 0o_MrPatrick_o0 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Apple perceives itself as a prestige brand. That perception depends upon consistently high execution and a perception that they’re trying to create beautiful experiences for users. They want the device to be a mechanism for you to purchase things. Hence the “Apple card” and all the hullabaloo around that. You’ll only use your phone if you perceive it to be secure. Apple’s investments in Secure Enclave’s, sandboxing are all directly linked to their belief that this will help the consumer perceive the safety of the product- and again, it goes back to the perception of the brand. Quality craftsmanship has properties that outsiders can perceive- even if they don’t understand it. Apple makes those investments. Google- well, they just make things and then abandon them. Android’s bizzaro world open source is a chaotic mess that reflects the lack of discipline in Google’s leadership. | | |
| ▲ | HumblyTossed 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes, they make great devices. I have many. But do we _know_ that what they claim is fact? And I don't know what Google has to do with this. | | |
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| ▲ | Matl 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | My question is what do you connect this TO that doesn't spy. I get you can use a Smart TV and switch to HDMI input but there's no guarantee the TV is not spying on you in some way, if not today then tomorrow these things will come with eSIM support to upload ACR data even when 'disconnected' or connect to your smartphone over some ad tech protocol to do the same. | | |
| ▲ | jmb99 25 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Today, just don't connect your smart TV to a network, and you should be fine. (Assuming there's no open/passwordless WiFi networks nearby.) If/when devices start shipping with cellular modems and eSIMs... honestly not sure. Faraday cage? Physically remove the modem? (If that doesn't prevent the device from booting.) | |
| ▲ | dd8601fn 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yeah, this is certainly already a problem. I trust Apple for a number of reasons, but I really had to be really aggressive about the TV it’s connected to. But also, a smaller footprint is a smaller footprint. I’ll take “better” where I can get it. | |
| ▲ | cyberpunk 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | ..: Surely the specs (or … whatever compliance paperwork, CE etc?) of the device have to state if it includes a modem or not? If it does then don’t buy it? |
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| ▲ | NoahZuniga 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Apple has their own ad targeting program, and they only need to seem to deliver privacy. | |
| ▲ | lern_too_spel 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If you want privacy (or anything for that matter), the only way you're going to get it is by user choice. A device that doesn't let you install your own apps is not going to deliver what you want. | | |
| ▲ | tosti 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | You can install your own apps on a Samsung Galaxy. For privacy, I'd recommend hardware with as few blobs as possible and of course an unlocked bootloader. |
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| ▲ | skydhash 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I don’t trust them for privacy. I like them for the lack of annoyance. All their competitors seems to want to hinder any activity I want to do. Ads, nagging, notifications, … It’s basically a mental tax. | |
| ▲ | namanaggarwal 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > and has the best track record Or maybe they are just not caught yet. They are now running ads, where is the data coming for that. They stop others from using the APIs but nothing stop their first party apps to snoop and use the data. Apple AirTag is the biggest privacy nightmare out there and I am not sure why people keep Apple separate from other data hungry companies | |
| ▲ | neya 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > and has the best track record. https://www.reuters.com/legal/apple-pay-95-million-settle-si... Apple routinely recorded their private conversations after they activated Siri unintentionally, and disclosed these conversations to third parties such as advertisers.
Yeah, great track record there. | | |
| ▲ | enraged_camel 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | How does this one instance refute the argument you quoted? | | |
| ▲ | stouset 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | You will never silence the paranoid lunatics who come out in droves whenever Apple is discussed. The only standard they will accept is absolute perfection. It doesn’t matter all of the drastic steps they’ve taken to ensure that past mistakes are never made again or that their hands are tied when governments make demands of them in the future. It doesn’t matter that they’re demonstrably orders of magnitude better than everyone else. | | |
| ▲ | dd8601fn 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | > The only standard they will accept is absolute perfection. Only for internet comment purposes. I’ve found that these same jabronis actually tend to run crappy and wildly unsafe home rolled kludges, for themselves. |
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| ▲ | neya 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Hopefully you do understand what "track record" means, especially when it isn't really a clean one. | | |
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| ▲ | mhb 21 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | What's the relevance of it being for-profit? You're assuming that non-profits necessarily have less of a hunger for data? | |
| ▲ | GeekyBear 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > It's mind-blowing how one of the most advanced technology forums on the internet can take privacy for granted just because the marketing of a for-profit corporation... This is a common judgement among the technically literate. > Breaking down why Apple TVs are privacy advocates’ go-to streaming device https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/06/all-the-ways-apple-t... | |
| ▲ | jmull 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | On the contrary. This is a place where we don’t have to substitute FUD for facts and analysis. To me, it doesn’t make sense to rate all levels of imperfection the same. Of course Apple isn’t perfect. But that’s not am important question. Apple’s the only major purveyor of these kinds of devices whose existential business model is not predicated on privacy violations. Hardly a guarantee of good behavior (and we’ll see what happens in the future). But a lot better than the alternatives. | |
| ▲ | adrr 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Isn't Apple building an ad network? Its only a matter of time. | |
| ▲ | EA-3167 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Why would you assume that because they disagree with you, they must be ignorant? |
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| ▲ | jonpurdy 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I've literally been waiting since 2022 for this. I purchased the 2021 ATV just before the 2022 was released. It struggles with AV1 and VP9 (Infuse really struggles, VLC is better but still a problem). I just wanted the faster CPU (for software decoding AV1 and VP9). Almost bought the 2022 version in 2024 for that but didn't want to buy a 2 year old product. Didn't expect to have to wait 4 years, and now the price is more than doubled. I can afford it but refuse to do so, especially since I don't use any of the onboard storage for anything. |
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| ▲ | Jeremy1026 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I'm still using the Dev Kit version that was shipped out before the 3rd Gen launched. tvOS26 was the last version supported so I'll be updating finally. I'd consider 14 years a pretty decent run. | |
| ▲ | 404mm 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think we’re wanting the same thing/ use here. I agree the price is outrageous but I ended up preordering anyway because at the end it’s still a good deal if you do the math. I’m excited for the AV1 (hardware now) and more horsepower for VP9 (software). | |
| ▲ | 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | [deleted] | |
| ▲ | mdasen 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The new CPU (A19) should have hardware decoding for both AV1 and VP9. Apple doesn't advertise the latter, but Safari supports VP9 on the A17 Pro and newer. You shouldn't have to rely on software decoding with the new Apple TV, though it might depend on your apps supporting it. | | | |
| ▲ | joshstewart 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I'm in the same boat. I guess I'll buy the older one -- can't justify the $300. | |
| ▲ | 1317 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | you're downloading youtube videos to watch in vlc? | | |
| ▲ | jonpurdy 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes. YouTube still thinks my partner and my accounts are in different countries so we couldn’t get Premium Family (for the past 4 years) and I’m not about to purchase separate subscriptions. So I have a backend that I can send YouTube URLs to running on my Mac Mini that gets the videos with yt-dlp. | | |
| ▲ | dd8601fn 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > So I have a backend that I can send YouTube URLs to running on my Mac Mini that gets the videos with yt-dlp. I do this too with a mac mini app that does it on schedules across all the channels I like, dumps them in JellyFin with channel art, culls old videos, and uses the Jellyfin api to reindex that category when done. I just like the lack of ads and no separate YouTube interface… YouTube is just a category in JellyFin. yt-dlp has gotten spotty about YouTube blocking it, from time to time, though. | |
| ▲ | frantathefranta 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | If you don't mind me asking, how does your YouTube video discovery looks like? | | |
| ▲ | jonpurdy 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | I don't mind at all. So I had ~100 subscriptions as of a few years ago and I tend to just look at the Subscriptions page, view what's been released since the last time I checked, and download those. I sometimes see the homepage, or see thumbnails when I click to download individual videos. I've previously found interesting channels that way, or recommended by creators in videos I watch, or even on HN. (I've found their algorithm has gotten worse over time, and nosedived recently with AI slop propagating like crazy in 2026. Even for niche topics it'll recommend channels that are a month old, already have 60 videos (mostly with low views but one video with 100K+ views), and obviously AI generated when closely inspected. It's worse now because half the channels use AI thumbnails for non-AI content.) So after that long answer, I don't have a great recommendation for discovery if you don't already have an existing list of channels you like and trust. | | |
| ▲ | chocochunks 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | There's a tool built on top of yt-dlp, ytdl-sub that can automate it for you. It will check if there's new vids in the channels you're interested in and download them and can make metadata for Kodi, Plex, etc. for them too. It can also delete old ones if you want. |
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| ▲ | avdwrks 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I bought one earlier this year right before they announced the $70 price increase. Going from $130 to $200 to $300 in the same year is crazy. |
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| ▲ | dstroot 8 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | At $130 it was an impulse buy and well worth it. Given a new price and features, I don’t see myself upgrading. | | |
| ▲ | Maxion 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Yeah I think this is the price for my soul, I'll keep using the data mining LG TV. Perhaps I ought to just throw it on a vlan that i turn off whenever i dont watch the tv. | | |
| ▲ | clickety_clack 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | Interestingly, Apple just released a “home collection” of LG products. I wonder how private they’re going to be. |
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| ▲ | Brendinooo 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | For what it's worth, depending on when you bought it, if $130 was an impulse buy in the year you bought it (and your financial situation is similar), a sizable chunk of that price difference is just inflation. For example, a $130 impulse buy in 2015 is a ~$184 impulse buy in 2026. | | |
| ▲ | hurfdurf 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Apple TV 4K 3rd Gen was $129 (4GB/64GB) resp. $179 (4GB/128GB) up until four months ago. | | |
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| ▲ | mdasen 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Go back a year and 8GB of RAM would cost around $30. Today, it's going to be $120. Apple really wanted to increase the amount of RAM from 4GB to 8GB to support on-device Siri AI, but RAM isn't cheap at the moment. The move to the A19 also meant that they couldn't go with LPDDR4X RAM and instead had to use more expensive LPDDR5X (IIRC). It is crazy. I expect the new Apple TV to be a flop because $300 is just a lot. The problem is that Apple is a little boxed in on this device. Apple wants to re-use the A19, but that locks them into expensive DDR5 RAM. They want to push Siri AI, but that locks them into 8GB RAM. Unlike the iPhone, there aren't as many other opportunities with the App Store, Apple Pay, search engine placement revenue, etc. Storage has also gone up a lot and Apple is no longer selling a 64GB model. Most streaming sticks have 4-16GB of storage and it's usually really slow/cheap storage. The new Apple TV has 128GB of storage and the price for that has probably gone from around $25 to $50. You say that it's fine from "$200 to $300", but that's not really true. It's gone from $250 to $300 when you look at the 128GB model. I still think it's crazy that it went from $150 to $300 in the same year, but the outgoing 128GB model was already $250 after the price hikes earlier this year. The problem is that Apple didn't want to reign in their product for the current market and I somewhat get that. What's the point of a new Apple TV if it's just "we updated the processor." For me, the point would be AV1 and VP9 decoding, but Apple wanted to push Siri AI. Other high-end TV devices have also seen big increases in price. The Fire TV Cube went from being $110-140 to now $200 - and with the Fire TV Cube you're getting Cortex-A73 processor cores from 2016, 2GB LPDDR4X, and 16GB storage. At least Apple is giving you 8GB LPDDR5X and 128GB of storage and a processor that is way better. The Google TV Streamer is $150 now with 4GB RAM and 16GB storage, but with LPDDR4 RAM and Cortex-A55 cores - and it's still $150. A Roku Ultra is 2GB RAM and 4GB storage with Cortex-A55 cores and costs $150. I think we're seeing that there's still some really old stock out there that's cheap, but we're seeing the prices climb on competitors too. Google raised its price 50%. Amazon has raised its price 40-80%. Apple raised its price 54-67% on the same-model and launched the newer model with double the RAM, more expensive RAM, a processor that's 4 years newer, etc. I think it's likely that Google, Roku, and Amazon simply don't upgrade their streaming devices during this parts shortage. I think a lot of people will be fine with a 12nm Cortex-A55 based TV streamer with limited RAM and storage (and slow RAM and storage). I love how fast my Apple TV is. It's amazing the difference in UI lag. But I think most companies aren't going to prioritize that premium experience, especially during a parts shortage. | | |
| ▲ | signal11 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > the outgoing 128GB model was already $250 after the price hikes earlier this year This is a great point, a lot of the press coverage missed this. Not having a cheaper alternative (eg a stick) was curious though. The baseline price of $300 might cause sticker shock. | | |
| ▲ | moepstar 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | Ok, but what do you actually use the storage for on an Apple TV? I still don’t quite know why i actually got a 64GB 4K first gen ATV when, in practice, a 32GB would’ve sufficed? Do people really play games on these? Install that many apps on them? |
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| ▲ | Brendinooo 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | This is the kind of analysis I was hoping to get when I posted my original comment, thanks so much for this info. | |
| ▲ | compounding_it 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | apple probably was losing money on the old Apple TV with old 4gb ram and 64gb storage in low volumes anyway and they probably would have to pay even more going forward. the upgrade seems to make sense from supply chain standpoint to standardise storage and chips across devices. If anything apple is probably bring value to new buyers of Apple TV in this market. At 299$ you are getting hardware that will last quite some time as opposed to a 200$ device that might cost maybe 250$ in six months and give you lot less hardware capabilities. | | |
| ▲ | mingus88 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | Apples services division broke records for revenue so there’s a way to look at the TV hardware as a kind of loss leader for subscriptions But everything is way more expensive than it was a year ago. Nothing escapes this inflation we are going through | | |
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| ▲ | FireBeyond 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I was going to say “to be fair”, but it’s still ridiculous but my understanding is that the 130 one was wireless only and the higher one and new one are Ethernet too (not that a NIC adds that cost…) |
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| ▲ | jon-wood 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The person in the other thread is incorrect, an Apple TV connected to HomePods can be configured to advertise HDMI Audio Return Channel so that anything your TV is displaying has its audio routed through it. Having said that I eventually replaced my pair of HomePod Minis with a Sonos soundbar because I wanted something with a bit more oomph to it, although I'd maybe have considered getting a pair of the big HomePods and using the Minis as rear speakers had this been available at the time. |
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| ▲ | gen220 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I can confirm! I have an eARC setup with an AppleTV, 2 big homepods, a gaming PC and a projector. I had to buy a special HDMI switch because my projector is eARC-naive, but my understanding is that a lot of modern TVs are eARC-aware and a special switch is not required. The one downside to my setup is that I have to press a button on the HDMI switch to toggle between the PC and the AppleTV, no remote control, but hey it's good to stretch your legs now and then right? Re audio quality, I really like my big HomePods and find they fill the room quite well and have a solid low range to them. I'd also agree that the HomePod Minis are not suitable for a living room entertainment experience. | | |
| ▲ | simonklitj 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yup, using eARC with ATV and HomePods, and it just works. Just switch input on tv to my PS5 and audio comes right through the HomePods No issue whatsoever, latency is fine, but a little too high for shooters and the like—but I use headphones then anyway. |
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| ▲ | ctkhn 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Dumb q but did you ever have apple tv -> tv -> sonos soundbar set up in a way where you were able to control the sonos soundbar audio from the iphone remote app? | | |
| ▲ | wnissen 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yes, LC OLED to Sonos Arc. Works a treat. At one point the remote started malfunctioning and I had to cover the IR transmitter with tape, but otherwise extremely reliable. Remote on iPhone works fine to control volume. The only thing is that if you add other Sonos speakers (say, in the kitchen as well as TV room) the mute only mutes the TV. |
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| ▲ | Brendinooo 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Good to know, thank you. How is life in the Sonos ecosystem? I vaguely recall there being some controversy around them a few years back, and I'm generally distrustful of third party hardware companies attempting to write software. | | |
| ▲ | azinman2 8 hours ago | parent [-] | | It’s ok. Their app isn’t great, but the underlying technology is. Spotify can directly play to one of their speakers. Their local protocol is also well understood and you can do most things with it, so you can vibe code your own replacement app pretty easily. The problem is once you hit their cloud APIs the latency is way too high for something like a speaker. | | |
| ▲ | jon-wood 8 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yeah, the hardware is great. I honestly couldn't tell you much about the app because I exclusively use the speaker via HDMI-ARC and AirPlay, both of which work really well. |
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| ▲ | drcongo 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I have full size HomePods beside the living room TV, and the one in my studio, and I've never been able to get this feature to work. | | |
| ▲ | floydnoel 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | works for me on quite a few different TVs and setups. but my current TV requires using HDMI port 3. maybe an Ai can help you troubleshoot it! |
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| ▲ | kqp 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Others have already pointed out that your assumption of Apple TV not spying on you is wrong, I’d like to make a meta-comment on that. Apple regards privacy as a feature, and I mean that precisely: some places they implement it, other places they decide it’s not worth it, and they only ever tell you about the former. A good example is iMessage: everybody in tech knows it’s E2EE, many fewer realize that the other three copies of your iMessage data on Apple’s servers are just, uh, not encrypted. You can’t have the same intuition for Apple and privacy that you would for a group like Signal. You need to instead ask yourself whether you fully understand what you need, then whether Apple has guaranteed precisely and fully that, without weasel words. |
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| ▲ | Terretta 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > many fewer realize that the other three copies of your iMessage data on Apple’s servers are just, uh, not encrypted With Advanced Data Security enabled? Of course, then there's the persons you're talking to. I figure they are one of your "other three", another is the iCloud copy (deduped from backups) ostensibly resolved by advanced data security, what's the third? | | |
| ▲ | kqp an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | I was thinking of push notification data and skipping several other significant partial leaks. After a little research, I think I overstated the push data leak, though it’s still significant. Anyway, framing it as copies was a rough approximation, the issue is many high probability partial copies resulting in virtual certainty of unencrypted access to any desired data. iMessage leaks I know about: - iCloud backups. While I appreciate Advanced Data Protection, I still count this because it’s not available everywhere, most people have it off, and most people with it off are unaware of it backdooring the E2EE marketing they still saw. - Recipients’ copies, and all the ways their copies get copied. Yes, tricky to address, that’s the comment. While no app can guarantee no unencrypted recipient copies, privacy focused apps do make it not happen unintentionally and by default. - APN leaks the timestamp, sender, and recipient of every message. Especially powerful in combination with recipient copies. - Apple controls the key directory and can MITM at will. As usual, see Signal for a high profile attempt at a centralized key directory that’s resistant to controller abuse. - Contacts, Siri, and Apple Intelligence all ingest then upload iMessage data. - No source code or reproducible builds. Obvious reasons, still a real hole. | |
| ▲ | zchrykng 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The other person's iCloud backup I assume. Avanced Data Security keeps your copy in iCloud safe, but doesn't help with the people you are messaging's copy. | |
| ▲ | gambiting an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | If you live in the UK you can't enable ADS at all, apple cares about your privacy but not enough to piss off the UK government it seems. |
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| ▲ | chocochunks 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Doesn't seem like it. Siri AI is not even available in all languages yet either. $429 CAD is crazy. You can get a whole mini PC and a Bluetooth remote for less and slap LibreElec on it even at today's crazy prices. And it'll be a better remote too. |
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| ▲ | frmrtntn 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Last time I tried the Media PC thing it ended up being somewhat of a nightmare. Had to spend significant amount of time setting up MadVR with my video player and get HDR HDMI passthrough working, but it was always very flaky. Occasionally an Nvidia driver update would break it completely. Dolby Vision wasn't even an option. I really wanted to make it work, but it ended up being an annoying hassle. I got a Shield TV and it has been a much better solution. Not sure if things have changed since then (~5 years ago). | | |
| ▲ | ndiddy 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | The way I use mine is just running a standard desktop (with the scaling turned up so it's a bit more readable) and then browsing for the video files on my NAS in the file explorer. I have one of those Logitech wireless keyboard/trackpad combos for input. Obviously this is pretty clunky, but it's a hell of a lot less flaky than something like Kodi. I use Linux on mine, but you could do the same thing in Windows if you wanted. |
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| ▲ | doublepg23 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | $429 CAD is crazy for sure but there's a running joke in my group chats of me sending a link to an Apple TV every time someone posts about their Kodi box breaking. It's not set and forget like an Apple TV at all... | | |
| ▲ | protimewaster 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | My Apple TVs have not been set and forget. Apple's aggressive storage saving makes it so that it resets storage for, and I get logged out of, apps that I don't use frequently. It'll also randomly need a reboot to solve the problem of some videos not playing correctly. It's definitely not the most troublesome player I've dealt with, but rebooting and logging back into apps randomly can be frustrating. | |
| ▲ | chocochunks 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think the only problems I've had on mine were network related and I would have had the same problems with an ATV since it can't magically fix DNS or my NAS being off. If you want a privacy focused solution it's probably the most private. Yeah, admittedly harder to use but I'm not recommending it to my parents. | |
| ▲ | loloquwowndueo 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | At 429 you can get a whole new tv. | | |
| ▲ | piva00 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I have an Apple TV exactly to not deal with any Smart TV feature and to avoid connecting a TV to the internet, mine is the first gen 4K from 2017 and is still chugging along fine. I don't plan on upgrading it to this new version yet so I'll probably get 10+ years of use out of it, great value overall. | |
| ▲ | mypalmike 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Or 8 pairs of jeans on sale. | |
| ▲ | Hamuko 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Although not a particularly good one. Especially if you want to stream (which I presume Apple TV buyers would) and care about privacy. |
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| ▲ | 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | [deleted] | |
| ▲ | nozzlegear 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Siri AI is not even available in all languages yet either. Siri AI is increasingly looking like a product that's exclusively for Americans. An unfortunate side effect of the EU attempting to become a regulatory superpower but failing to export its rules to the rest of the world. | | |
| ▲ | jeffgreco 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Don't worry Europeans: you aren't missing out. | |
| ▲ | Maxion 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Nah, Apple are just holding out on features from the EU so that they try to force their hand in other regulation. It's just blackmail. | | |
| ▲ | miskin 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I’d say they really like this situation: - They don’t have to support European languages. Historically, they were horrible in this area, supporting only major languages and ignoring others for years. It’s almost impossible to ask Siri to play a song whose title is in one of these languages. Contact names are pronounced badly, and it’s sometimes tricky to ask Siri to call a person with a non-English name. This way, even though LLMs support these languages quite well, Apple doesn’t have to invest in development and testing. - They announce the product with US features and keep the EU price the same, but disable features that cost them money, such as those requiring server-side compute. - Satellite features only work in some EU countries, and there seems to be absolutely no progress in many markets. These markets are simply too small for Apple to care about. Yet the price is the same. - They blame the EU for this. | |
| ▲ | nozzlegear 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Are they? If I were a gambling man, I'd bet that Siri AI never comes to the EU. I think Apple saw what happened with Google's on-device AI in the EU and noped out. |
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| ▲ | rramon 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| HomeView, HomePod and AppleTV should be one device. A powerful home server + a bunch of low powered clients and receivers all over the home. No need for 8gb RAM in all of them.. |
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| ▲ | asdfman123 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| This has been Apple's niche forever. Create a product with a few extra bells and whistles, better craftsmanship, and charge a fat premium that people who care about those things are willing to pay. |
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| ▲ | wombat-man 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I was watching stuff on my Chromecast 4k or whatever. That occasionally stutters or frameskips, so I moved to my PS5 pro. The PS5 pro has plenty of horsepower. Fewer problems, but I see it occasionally skip or freeze slightly when playing back from some providers. I've read Apple TV somehow has this figured out, and since I expected a new model I've been waiting for this one. It's not cheap but I want to be able to stream TV/film without any of those issues. I'm not quite ready to go the super premium route by getting a kaleidescape. I also want to use the bluetooth functionality from time to time. |
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| ▲ | pier25 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Yeah it's way too expensive. I would like to upgrade my 4K ATV to a more powerful chip but not for $300. I only use mine for streaming and already have a home theater Atmos setup. Couldn't care less about Siri, AI features, microphones, etc. |
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| ▲ | softwaredoug 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| At this price I’d also want a Dolby vision Blu-ray player. Strong overlap with this product and physical media people. |
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| ▲ | grim_io 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Maybe they'll release a 32/64 GB version once they have harvested the whales. |
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| ▲ | supertrope 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Nvidia Shield now costs $300 too. |
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| ▲ | cromka 8 hours ago | parent [-] | | The same old laggy device from like 8 years ago? They still make and sell those? | | |
| ▲ | alasano 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | What's crazy is that it's still close to the best device you can get. I'd upgrade my Shield Pro to something else but there's nothing to upgrade to that doesn't have some compromise on formats or capabilities. | | |
| ▲ | js2 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > What's crazy is that it's still close to the best device you can get. Unless you prefer an Android TV device, I don't get the appeal of the Shield Pro. I bought one years ago and resold it a few months later. For me the only things it did better than an Apple TV (playing certain ripped blu-rays) are better done by the Ugoos AM6B+. So those are the two devices I use nowadays. | | |
| ▲ | kllrnohj 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | The appeal of the Shield Pro is you don't have to deal with custom flashing a "no-name" device and you don't have to dual box to keep streaming services happy. It's frustrating that nobody else seems to care about attempting to be the all-in-one box given how much Shield is showing its age now. It's really sluggish I don't get why Apple just refuses to allow audio pass through or DV Profile 7. They're clearly on board with DV in general and don't hesitate to play Dolby's branding games, so why not profile 7 support??? | | |
| ▲ | jmb99 13 minutes ago | parent [-] | | It wouldn't surprise me if there's pressure from Dolby or the media companies to not do so, since Profile 7 is only used on BluRay (and the primary use case for playing back BluRays on Apple TVs I'm pretty sure is not playing backed-up personally-owned media). And, I'm sure Apple isn't losing many sales to not supporting it. Lack of pass-through could probably be argued the same way, although it is a bit more surprising. |
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| ▲ | protimewaster 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It depends on what you're looking for exactly. Some models of FireTV Cube have pretty beefy processors and can handle some things the Shield can't, like Dolby Vision FEL. | |
| ▲ | lossolo 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Same here. I just ordered a new one because there's basically no better alternative that supports so many formats. My TV, for example, doesn't support TrueHD 7.1, but the Nvidia Shield Pro does. I guess the new Apple TV 4K is also worse in this regard. |
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| ▲ | buu709 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I have the 2017 model and haven't noticed any lag as of yet? | | |
| ▲ | cromka 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I saw a YT video that showed how laggy the interface is. In comparison to Apple TV. But also how it indeed is very good with formats. | | |
| ▲ | moepstar 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | Laggy / stuttering interface may well be a unsuitable HDMI cable… Yes, really - switching cables instantly got rid of any stuttering in the UI no reboot or setting could fix for me - if I wouldn’t have experienced it myself I probably wouldn’t have believed it.. | | |
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| ▲ | theshrike79 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | AFAIK that’s the only model that exists. It literally hasn’t been updated in a decade. | | |
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| ▲ | crossroadsguy 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| If it has decent RAM and had it been cheaper, OpenAI alone will keep this product out of stock. This is Apple's love for the retail consumers that they were forced to increase the price just so that Sam would think twice before hoarding them. |
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| ▲ | mjmvisser 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It’s worth it for me because I’m still using an Apple TV 4K 2017 that I bought in 2019. It struggles with a lot of Plex content. The price tag does feel high, but taking into account post-Covid inflation and component cost increases due to the AI bubble, it makes sense. An Nvidia shield pro cost exactly the same (in Canada, at least). My home theatre set up is through a Denon receiver. I love my gen1 HomePods for listening to music, but I can’t understand why anyone would buy four HomePods rather than a proper surround setup. |
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| ▲ | conductr 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I use mine for average of ~7 years, so that helps justify just biting the bullet and paying for whatever is best at the time. |
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| ▲ | troupo 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > $300 might be a decent price if you use it for all of the things that it can do What exactly can it do besides launching streaming apps? |
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| ▲ | steve1977 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | It's also a hub for Apple Home and a Thread border router. And it works with HomePods. | | |
| ▲ | troupo 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | It's a barebones barely functioning hub with hardly any functionality (because HomeKit itself is barely more than that). Thread border router is nice I guess. Integration with HomePods is ... well, if you have HomePods. So... No real functionality to justify the price. |
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| ▲ | 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
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