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▲ Gemini 4 Carbon is now available(blog.google)
100 points by meetpateltech 38 minutes ago | 40 comments
▲byefruit 29 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Just checked my Gemini app, still only have 3.1 Pro, 3.6 Flash and 3.6 Thinking on Pro. Looks like it's Ultra only.

They've been so slow to update their top models and roll them out that despite subscribing to the Gemini Pro plan, I use it so rarely that this is my last month. That and their product offering was so confusing I basically gave up.

▲Murrawhip 25 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

My Google Workspace Gemini (with "AI Expanded Access") has 3.6 Flash, 3.8 Thinking, 4 Carbon.

My personal "AI Pro" Gemini has 3.5 Flash-Lite, 3.8 Flash, 3.1 Pro, 4 Argon.

Pretty inconsistent.

▲eitally 27 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I pay for Ultra and have been using Argon for a couple weeks. I just checked in both Agy and Gemini and Carbon is there for me now, too. I'll try it, but Argon is itself already so slow that I'm not sure Carbon will make sense for most activities.

▲spockz 20 minutes ago | parent [-]

On pro here and I can do about 2 design tasks a week before I hit usage limits with Argon. The usage limit with carbon is probably gone just loading the context.

▲staticman2 26 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I wonder why my consumer Gemini app has Argon and 3.8 flash with a pro plan but so many people here don't have that.

Is the issue that consumers get it sooner or is the roll out random or locked to some other factor?

▲mattlondon a minute ago | parent | next [-]

I have Carbon in my consumer Gemini too. I have a Google drive storage upgrade that I pay for that I assume is bundled with it - it's the only thing I can think of as I've certainly not gone out of my way to do anything special to get access (and so far, it is free for me to access it this way)

▲antonvs 23 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

In one case I had to upgrade my Antigravity GUI to see new models, I guess because of an API change.

At the same time, the CLI saw the new models without any change. Possibly that was just because my CLI install was newer than the GUI one. (Edit: oh, it's because my CLI autoupdates. Autoupdates for the GUI on Linux in an AppImage is... messy.)

Edit: But in this case:

> Gemini 4 Carbon is available via the API in Google AI Studio and Gemini for business for all paying developers and enterprises

I.e. Seems to be API only right now.

▲theanonymousone 20 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Same. On PLUS subscription. One of those situations where you really want a human to talk to..

▲jack_pp 21 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

considering how little you can use argon with pro, i guess carbon will be the same so why do you care?

▲irthomasthomas 12 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

They just took 3.1 pro away from me while I was asking about Cami Clark and Epstein (for due-dilligince), lol. Now I have access to 3.6 Flash and 3.5 flash-light. So I canceled my sub. Shame. I used to love using antigravity when the allowance was good.

▲5555watch 27 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Available through the API.

To add, it's actually surprisingly good. I have this unfinished paper draft that I keep feeding to various top AI's to see what it picks up on and what suggests to edit, and while Astra/Fable/Opus/Argon so far has been mediocre, Carbon's answer surprised me with some interesting points all the other AI's missed.

It's an anecdote, sample of one, but it got my attention.

▲lilbigdoot 3 minutes ago | parent [-]

I haven't tried Carbon yet, but Argon has been my favorite for asking questions or doing research on something I'm working on.

▲guidopallemans 30 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

A nice nod to simonw in one of the highlight videos;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNbkThtNzS8

▲faccacta 22 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

That's awesome. Will models be pelican-maxed from now on?

▲baal80spam 18 minutes ago | parent [-]

Obviously. The next step after pelican-maxxing is AGI.

▲adg001 17 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

If this is not the end game when it comes to bike riding pelicans, I guess we are close enough. :-)

▲bscphil 21 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Looks like it's the same price as Argon on openrouter, which is good to see. Probably was announced already somewhere that I missed.

It's interesting that Opencode Go got Argon, I'm hoping they'll get Carbon as well. They claim that Argon is ZDR on their platform. That's surprising to me because openrouter doesn't have ZDR endpoints for Google's models any more, due to a change in policy.

▲BeetleB 16 minutes ago | parent [-]

I wish they would either reduce the price of Argon, or provide a "weaker" model at a decent price.

At my work, Argon is deemed to be too expensive, and gemini-3.8 flash is just not good enough.

▲bscphil 8 minutes ago | parent [-]

Deepseek is good enough for me that I use it for everything cost sensitive. I tend to switch to Google's models for world knowledge, planning, and complicated bugs that Deepseek gets stuck on. Argon is also a great writer in my experience, hopefully Carbon is the same. Seems like RL for code generation ruins most model's communication abilities. V4.1 Flash 1017 is a significant step back from the previous Deepseek model in that respect, despite being a noticeably better coder.

▲ftchd 13 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I needed something to switch the account where the usage is taken from, not the configuration.

I made something simple & transparent named Switcheroo: https://github.com/FTCHD/switcheroo

Works with other AI CLIs like Gemini, and other various CLIs like Vercel (if you're managing multiple accounts like me), Netlify, Github etc

▲iamgopal 2 minutes ago | parent [-]

Does it work with antigravity?

▲drivebyhooting 14 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

What’s the difference between /boost, /teamwork, and now /swarm?

Anecdotally with Argon it would cut corners when attempting to one shot complicated prompts. Adversarial review would find hardcoded hacks and even bugs in physics code.

/teamwork did help with that but made it take EVEN LONGER

I’m hoping Carbon (with /swarm?) is going to help me with my physics and engineering. I don’t like having to cross check with Claude or Sol just to trust the results.

▲tuskie 19 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Is this an intentional naming clash with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_(programming_language)?

▲dude250711 3 minutes ago | parent [-]

Maybe a stark reminder about growing data centre carbon emissions?

▲nothercastle 31 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Is it 100$ a month for the minimum plan that has access

▲kingstnap 26 minutes ago | parent [-]

Yes.

> It is also rolling out to all Google AI Ultra subscribers

However for what its worth the $20 plan got Argon like a day or so later.

▲vardump 5 minutes ago | parent [-]

Yes, and it worked for a chat query or two. Then 5 hour wait.

▲Latitude7973 10 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It uses more tokens than Argon? I already get very little out of my Pro subscription (using Antigravity) with Argon.

▲cyrusmg 19 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

With Plus subscription this is in the list of available models, but says: "Unavailable - Gemini 4 Carbon is currently available to Ultra plan subscribers."

▲hmokiguess a minute ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Using Google Antigravity’s /swarm feature, Carbon built an open-world 3D game where you explore Google’s Mountain View campus as a pelican riding a GBike — coordinating subagents to model 3D assets in Blender from Omni and Nano Banana references, build the browser game in Three.js with WebGL shaders, and pair procedural Web Audio sound effects with Lyria music.[1]

Amazing, can we now close this pelican benchmark and move on to different things?

▲FacelessJim 4 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Maybe they had insider knowledge that anthropic was about to release fable 5.2? The timing is a bit too convenient.

▲spider-mario 27 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Using Google Antigravity’s /swarm feature, Carbon built an open-world 3D game where you explore Google’s Mountain View campus as a pelican riding a GBike

pelicanmaxxing is here.

▲boodleboodle 7 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Just want to say I find Carbon waaay better than Argon. I keep noticing google model sumbissions on hackernews getting targetted by systematically negative comments.

▲doctoboggan 26 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That was faster than the previous announcement -> release cycles, right?

What's the recommended coding harness I should be using to test it out? (Recommended by folks here, not by Google...)

▲bscphil 5 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

No, just like Argon it was released 14 days after the announcement.

Argon was announced 30 September, publicly available 13 October. Carbon announced 28 October, publicly available 10 November.

▲drivebyhooting 13 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Surely it should be antigravity?

▲lisenKaci 22 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This has been available in AI studio via api for a while now.

▲catigula 10 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Gemini vis-a-vis Claude and GPT seems to have substantial unsolved hallucination problems. Hope it’s solved or it can’t be used for agentic coding.

▲jgbuddy 28 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Still don't see it!

▲gimlichgu 33 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Maybe add (2026)?