| ▲ | Israel is running critically low on interceptors, US officials say(semafor.com) |
| 44 points by inaros 3 hours ago | 73 comments |
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| ▲ | Zaheer an hour ago | parent | next [-] |
| Keep in mind who pays for the replacements - U.S. Citizens to the tune of $317.9 billion over the last 70 years [1]. https://taxpayersforpeace.org/ |
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| ▲ | alephnerd an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | [flagged] | | |
| ▲ | spaghetdefects an hour ago | parent [-] | | There were plenty of other alternatives, starting with sanctions against Israel and followed with military action. The boomer generation's support for Israel created a very odd relationship that was entirely one way. Younger generations will certainly reverse this. | | |
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| ▲ | IncreasePosts 27 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | [flagged] |
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| ▲ | thisislife2 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Interesting that Iran has started using cluster munition missiles to strike Israel. Apparently Iran, Israel and US are some of the few countries that haven't signed the international convention banning cluster munitions. Israel has also used cluster munitions against the Hezbollahs. |
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| ▲ | Qem 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Israel has also used cluster munitions against the Hezbollahs. Estimated around 4 million of them against south Lebanon: https://imeu.org/resources/key-issues/quick-facts-israels-il... https://www.hrw.org/report/2008/02/16/flooding-south-lebanon... | |
| ▲ | XorNot 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Countries tend to sign munition restrictions when they don't use those munitions or are in a position where they wouldn't be useful. The map of countries which sign the convention against landmines is extremely obvious in that context. | | |
| ▲ | spwa4 an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | You also have the large number of countries that sign treaties, then just ignore them. Iran is an example of a nation that signs UN treaties, then openly boast about violating them. Iran signed the human rights treaties ... and openly executes gays and minors. They boast about this publicly. | |
| ▲ | markdown 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > are in a position where they wouldn't be useful. No such country exists. So long as enemies are likely to put boots, wheels, or tracks on the ground in your country, landmines are extremely useful, extremely cheap, and extremely effective. | | |
| ▲ | cpgxiii an hour ago | parent [-] | | The point is that almost all of the signatories considered themselves to be immune to a "real war" in their futures at the time they signed. E.g. basically all of the European signatories assumed that the end of the cold war and existence of NATO would ensure the end of any possible threat. Given that assumption, as obviously flawed as it was, signing on to a ban was cheap PR (literally cheap, too, because it meant they could divest those weapons and their delivery mechanisms to reduce defense expenditures). | | |
| ▲ | breppp an hour ago | parent [-] | | which is exactly why european countries threatened by russia are starting to withdraw from the treaty, five had recently announced so |
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| ▲ | Qem an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I hope they have their Cuito Cuanavale[1] moment and follow the steps of South Africa in replacing their own version of the apartheid regime with democracy. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cuito_Cuanavale |
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| ▲ | coldtea 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Nothing that saying they're sorry for being offensive and seeking a peace deal can't fix... |
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| ▲ | breppp an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| On the other side, iran's launch capability had fallen by 92% since the start of the war https://www.jpost.com/defense-and-tech/article-889435 Iran is actually attacking their former close friends at the gulf uninvolved civilian population centers more often than it attacks Israel EDIT: fixed to 92% |
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| ▲ | wodenokoto an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | They are attacking close friends who literally harbor the armies attacking Iran. The logic seems very straight forward imho. Attack the US army bases and pester the nations that allows those bases in hopes that they might ask the us to get bend. | | |
| ▲ | spwa4 an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | They've attacked everyone they possibly could with ZERO regard for anything. They attacked Cyprus! They've attacked Turkey. They've attacked Afghanistan (are you seriously going to claim Afghanistan is harboring the US army?) They've attacked everyone they possibly could attack, zero exceptions. Next time all the gulf countries will know: get America and everyone else to launch attacks against Iran from your soil. Make sure to participate. Why? Iran will attack everyone regardless of alliances, who attacks, whether anyone attacks at all, what bases exist, whether or not they participate, or whether they avoid hostilities. So obviously, it's better to be part of the hostilities against Iran, to have an army on your soil that will protect at least some of your territory. | | |
| ▲ | chomp 28 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | The US is keeping aircraft in allied bases in Cyprus, and a permanent one in Turkey. Haven’t seen anything about Afghanistan. Iran’s attacks make sense to some degree. | |
| ▲ | spaghetdefects an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | They're attacking US/Israel assets in all of those countries. It's effective too, the US is pulling out and showing that they are not a reliable ally. Just today the US told all US citizens to leave Iraq. |
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| ▲ | breppp an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | > The logic seems very straight forward imho. Attack the US army bases and pester the nations that allows those bases in hopes that they might ask the us to get bend If only they attacked the American bases as opposed to also attacking civilian infrastructure such as oil facilities and residential neighborhoods If only they had skipped gulf countries who had pushed the US not to strike and refused to let the US use their bases to attack Iran (all of them) If only they hadn't attacked countries without any bases such as Azerbaijan Then I think your arguments would have had more merit | | |
| ▲ | gravisultra an hour ago | parent [-] | | They've attacked many US bases. They've also retaliated against US/Israeli business interests when the US/Israel did the same to Iran. Iran is waging a very strategic war and quite a moral one I might add. They even gave evacuation orders to Tel Aviv neighborhoods they were targeting military installations in. | | |
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| ▲ | spaghetdefects an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Where are you getting that 95% number from? Given that Trump has announced multiple times that the US has "won the war", I don't see how that could possibly be credible. Iran continues to launch successful attacks against Israel and Israel/US assets across the entire region. | | |
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| ▲ | jazzpush2 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I.e. time American tax dollars to save the day! |
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| ▲ | Drupon 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Good. Perhaps they will pay the ultimate price and face irreversible consequences that are decades overdue. |
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| ▲ | themafia 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Then it was a very strange choice to go to war with a neighbor that's known to have massive stockpiles of missiles. Maybe it's just me, but if I were in such a suboptimal defensive materiel position, I would try diplomacy first. In fact, I would make it my mission to be the world recognized leader in diplomacy. |
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| ▲ | Spooky23 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Arrogance, and using war to avoid consequences for personal bad behavior of the leader. | |
| ▲ | cindyllm 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | [dead] | |
| ▲ | spwa4 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Do you honestly believe Israel hasn't done that for decades? | | |
| ▲ | dr00tb an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | You seriously believe Israel has conducted good-faith diplomatic endeavors for decades? A history of terrorattacks and extrajudicial killings in neighboring countries and even European[1] countries tell a different story. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair | | |
| ▲ | UltraSane an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | I think Israel is fighting for its survival against enemies that would absolutely destroy it if they could. | | |
| ▲ | yongjik 9 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | A nation fighting for its survival doesn't randomly escalate by attacking a much bigger enemy. Instead, we frequently see it from dictators with a delusion of grandeur. | |
| ▲ | tastyface an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Is continuing to apply extreme violence against these enemies likely to lead to a good result? What is the end state? I think we are fast approaching an era where weapons of mass destruction, by way of cheap killbot swarms, are trivially accessible to any government. Without radical diplomacy, I fear the entire Middle East -- Israel included -- is on a path to annihilation. | | |
| ▲ | steve-atx-7600 an hour ago | parent [-] | | I think it can be as simple as if you defeat your enemy first, they can’t defeat you or continue to threaten you. | | |
| ▲ | wolvoleo an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | That only works against nation states. After what Israel have done in Gaza there's thousands of people who have lost family in a gruesome way and now have an axe to grind against Israel. This way it'll never stop. The best way to prevent terrorism is to not give people reasons to want you dead. Look at all the ethnic conflicts in the world. Like the troubles in Ireland. Did that stop because one side threw more bombs? No, it stopped because both sides agreed to talk. | |
| ▲ | tastyface an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Defeating an enemy to the extent that they can't drive a truck full of AI killbots into a busy city center is an impossible task barring a scorched earth approach. And if that option is on the table -- killing millions to secure Israel's future -- then Israel seals its fate regardless. Live by the sword, die by the sword. Old advice that continues to ring true. | | |
| ▲ | hollerith 42 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Non-Israelis also have people that would kill them if they could, so why are you restricting your comment to Israel? | | | |
| ▲ | 44 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | gravisultra an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Just like Nazi Germany. |
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| ▲ | spwa4 an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | So wait ... you're going to use terror attacks and extrajudicial killings in foreign countries as an argument to defend Iran? Iran is responsible for the civil war in Lebanon, and thus for at least hundred thousand dead in extrajudicial killings. So your argument, even if we accept everything as 100% true ... Iran is at least 1000x more guilty than Israel. Or just take [1] ... So it seems strange to use this as an argument to defend Iran. Bad faith, even. As for diplomacy: Iran signs treaties ... then just refuses to uphold them. For example, Iran signed, then pretty openly violated it's nuclear non-proliferation treaty obligations [2], same with the famous nuclear deal. But, even where it comes to pretty basic things: Iran signed the human rights treaties, including the Geneva convention, and hangs gays and minors as a matter of course (according to amnesty #1 worldwide with hundreds of minors executed, and actually increasing the rate over time), attacks religious minorities, women, the government has a side business in kidnapping foreignors ... Or other treaties. Iran signed freedom of navigation treaties, and has for decades violated them. Hell, Iran violates the international telecommunications union treaty. The problem: Iran cannot be negotiated with, for the simple reason that they do not respect deals they make. There's no point in negotiating since their behavior does not change when they make deals. They make promises, and ignore them. They sign treaties, and boast openly about violating them. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_diplomat_terror_plot_t... [2] https://www.iaea.org/sites/default/files/25/06/gov2025-38.pd... | | |
| ▲ | Hikikomori an hour ago | parent [-] | | You failed to mention that Iran violated the deal only after Trump withdrew the US from it... Its hard to negotiate with Iran when Israel keeps killing their negotiators. |
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| ▲ | spaghetdefects an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Since its inception, Israel has waged war and acts of terror on all of its neighbors (and much of the rest of the world). | |
| ▲ | saint_yossarian an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Do you honestly believe they did? > Iran and Israel have maintained no diplomatic relations since the 1979 Islamic Revolution, and their relationship has been characterized by hostility ever since. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Israel_relations | | |
| ▲ | breppp an hour ago | parent [-] | | that's untrue by the way, Israel sold weapons to Iran and supported it with intelligence against Iraq after 1979 |
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| ▲ | Nevermark an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I am certainly not defending Iran, but one of their gripes had merit. Israel’s illegal annexation and settling of land that wasn’t theirs. And their policy of overlooking violence against the previous inhabitants. Genocide slow burn. So I don’t know what good any diplomacy could have been in that context. | | | |
| ▲ | Hikikomori an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Israel killed Irans negotiators just last year. How can you be this deluded. |
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| ▲ | mohsen1 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Neighbor?! | | | |
| ▲ | glob_roman an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | "Iran is close to nuclear device, diplomacy doesn't work, should we attack?" -"no, we don't have enough interceptors. let them become nuclear." That's what your logic sounds like | | |
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| ▲ | mcs5280 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Sounds like they only went into this with concepts of a plan |
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| ▲ | excalibur an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Let's send them thousands of tiny violins. |
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| ▲ | shablulman 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| [dead] |