| ▲ | ADHD as a circadian rhythm disorder: evidence and implications for chronotherapy(frontiersin.org) |
| 52 points by bookofjoe 2 hours ago | 32 comments |
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| ▲ | baoooooooooooo 33 minutes ago | parent | next [-] |
| > walk in > see this title > oh man that would explain a lot Ok after reading a chunk of this the correlation is pretty wild. Having the data it’s quite striking. Sleep intervention as a form of ADHD treatment has always seemed reasonable to me but this gives a lot more clarity to the approach and mechanisms. For me, the seasonal aspect of it aligns with their blue light findings (both driving symptoms and aligning with improvement under the intervention of having a grow-LED garden setup on my desk), and in a second maybe related matter we’ve found using blue light blocking glasses an hour before bed to be the most impactful single intervention around sleep quality and onset (the ones that are like orange laser safety glasses, not the mildly reflective desk-work glasses) |
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| ▲ | Nevermark 6 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I had great success reflecting 80,000 lumens of work lights off my living rooms ceiling during winter for a couple years. At a new home, I remodeled four rooms to have LED lighting, surrounding the ceilings, hidden from below by cove molding. It is an actual sunny day, with an “an actual” sunny sky inside. Winter, midnight, eclipse? Not a concern. Having all that intense light reflecting off my entire ceiling creates soft diffuse lighting, no shadows, even though it is extremely bright. Helped a lot with waking up and avoiding depression, all year round. On the sleep treatment, anything that can help sleep is good, my body has always operated well on a 30 hour day, which means terribly almost all the time, by default. But I do a lot of things that help, so my sleep is pretty good most of the time. I would see sleep aids as a pretty narrow interventions relative to my ADHD. Correlation would be nowhere near equivalence. | |
| ▲ | TeMPOraL 26 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > walk in > see this title > think authors are reversing causation hard -- signed, a deep Night Owl | | | |
| ▲ | oliyoung 16 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Almost my exact response. And the cruel tragedy is that it becomes this self-reinforcing cycle. Sleep bad > "Bad" ADHD day > Harder to fall asleep. Rinse. Repeat. |
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| ▲ | whimsicalism 3 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| adhd is a socially constructed disorder with significant heterogeneity and is only becoming moreso with the advent of scrollable video media and patient communities/advocacy. i am highly skeptical of results pointing to an easily identified physiological cause. the studies cited in this paper are generally low quality and fall apart under scrutiny. |
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| ▲ | herf 15 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Dr. Sandra Kooij is a good person to look up if you are interested in adult ADHD and sleep. She has a book about it. From what I remember, there are a few things that are known: 1. a large majority of ADHD sufferers are phase-delayed and struggle with insomnia 2. you can induce ADHD-like symptoms in normal people by restricting sleep 3. Some of the interventions that improve sleep timing and quality affect ADHD (but it isn't a total cure) |
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| ▲ | falcor84 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| There seems to be almost nothing new here. I see that the main studies the they cite are actually from the 2010s: https://www.bmj.com/content/350/bmj.h68.abstract https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S13899... I'd be curious to see if there's been any larger scale follow up on this since. |
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| ▲ | skupig 28 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I've been using a smart switch to fade in a light (one of the "sun-like" full-spectrum ones) over my head in the morning and it's been really effective for regulating my circadian rhythm. Even with little sleep, I will naturally wake up in the morning at a much more regular time. |
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| ▲ | neckardt 21 minutes ago | parent [-] | | If the light turns on too quickly for me it’s super jarring and I hide under the covers. Did you find one that goes bright over the course of 30m or something? Or can you handle the quick increase in brightness? | | |
| ▲ | skupig 11 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | It's a controllable dimmer switch that I fade in over the course of an hour or so using a Home Assistant script. | |
| ▲ | ThrowawayP 13 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Google for "wake-up light". Philips is the brand I'm familiar with but there are others. | |
| ▲ | servo_sausage 17 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | I do the same with a lifx bulb, it can be set up to fade and colour shift over any duration you like. |
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| ▲ | Aboutplants 30 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Disruptions to sleep aggravates underlying issues, mentally or physically. |
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| ▲ | tombert 6 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I still have problems, but my life categorically improved once I got diagnosed and treated for obstructive sleep apnea. I focus on things much better, I'm better at juggling tasks, and I'm just nicer to people, or at least my fuse is considerably longer than it used to be. Also I'm sure my wife is grateful that I'm not snoring or gasping for breath every night. I would highly encourage anyone who can get a sleep study done to do it. Most insurance companies will at least cover the sleep study and sleep sleep apnea can lead to a lot of considerably-more-expensive issues later down the line. It's not very invasive anymore, all they had to do was have me sleep with a pulse oximeter for a few nights and apparently that was enough. | |
| ▲ | psygn89 27 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | I am lucky I don't have disruptive sleep issues, but my brain still feels slightly foggy and my battery feels 75% charged in the morning. I imagine if I had disruptive sleep issues I might as well be toast. Or maybe I'm just not aware of disruptions in my sleep... | | |
| ▲ | toast0 25 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | What's wrong with being toast? :P My sleep issues are at least manageable. | |
| ▲ | anon291 13 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | I was like you. A year ago, I was tired as hell despite sleeping (well, not enough, but I've never slept 'enough'). A few people said sleep apnea but i was not overweight and didn't snore. I tried the test anyway, and it turns out I wasn't breathing. I used an oral appliance and a year later, it's gone and I feel better. Also, without doing anything my triglycerides, LDL cholesterol and blood sugar which had gone way out of whack, went back to normal. I started using my oral appliance on a Monday. That Friday I was so energetic I ran 12 miles in one go. I hardly ever run or even practice that much, but I was just so wired that I couldn't help it. It was an amazing feeling. I highly suggest sleep apnea treatment even if you don't think it sounds like you. |
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| ▲ | bbor 36 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Oh cool so now people will be told to go to sleep earlier and get more sun before you can prove that you deserve actual treatment. Fun... |
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| ▲ | gchamonlive 31 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Another way to look at this is how many people need more sun and regular sleep and instead are doing unnecessary treatments? | | |
| ▲ | ctolsen 2 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | ADHD is highly treatable with medication, and any other intervention is at best mild mitigation. So how many? Amongst people with ADHD, basically nobody. Sun and proper sleep is certainly helpful for people with ADHD but the likelihood of them getting that is vastly increased if they’re medicated correctly. | |
| ▲ | gregoryl 18 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Roughly, zero. Stimulants are not a fun dependency, come with a bucket list of side effects and downsides, and only mitigate one aspect of ADHD. | | |
| ▲ | gchamonlive 11 minutes ago | parent [-] | | ADHD treats with Lisdexamfetamine. Amfetamines, I repeat. People use this to study, to get high at parties, to be functional at work, so I really doubt there aren't patients out there abusing these drugs with valid prescriptions. | | |
| ▲ | jplusequalt 4 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Yes, some people will abuse their prescriptions. But the majority will not. Treating ADHD through stimulants usually has fantastic outcomes for patients. | | |
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| ▲ | btilly 20 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | That is doubly important given that one of the effects of the medications, is to disrupt sleep. | |
| ▲ | jplusequalt 7 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Any psychiatrist worth a damn already considers these things. "ADHD" symptoms can manifest for a variety of reasons, and that's why good ADHD testing involves multiple exams alongside the traditional ADHD ones to help figure out what actual issues are present. Also, comorbidities make this all the more complicated. Your assertion that people need "more sun" and "regular sleep" could very well be true, yet someone can still have ADHD. | | |
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| ▲ | 44mkultra69 24 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| lists Melatonin, first, then behavioral pseudo-interventions. stay tuned for more monthly product placements on frontiers in, best digested post prime time. Welcome to your readjustment.
Willkommen beim Nachrichten. hey, is anyone wondering if kleine & grosse Lauschangriffe are shared with private people or the guys working for these institutions are trustworthy enough and whether they actually deserved their Bachelor degrees or someone somehow decided they are worth it anyway? wait ... it's just a fucking Bachelors degree |
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| ▲ | mplemay 34 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Be me. Too AHDH to even open the article, let alone read the article before moving to the next HN post. |
