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atonse a day ago

More and more evidence that the a-holes with spreadsheets are taking over at Apple and they’re completely devoid of any ideas on the software side.

I heard someone randomly say that they should replace Tim Cook with Scott Forstall. I chuckled at the idea but this might be a great idea.

Apple is having its Ballmer moment. Google did too before AI lit the fire under their feet.

Who is going to be Apple’s next Nadella? Steve Jobs was the original.

yomismoaqui a day ago | parent | next [-]

Can we use "ensheetification" to describe this phenomeon? (sure I'm not the first to use this word)

rwoerz 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

That description really excels

caminanteblanco 20 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I think the other replies are missing your 'sheet' pun, from my knowledge and a quick search, I think you coined it

calf 10 hours ago | parent | next [-]

For a second I thought it meant the novel sheets UI Steve Jobs showed off in the original Mac OS X.

6510 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I hate to quote an AI but I got this....

>Ensheetification is a newly coined, informal term, likely from Hacker News, describing the trend where web/app interfaces become dominated by large, card-like "sheets" or panels that slide up, covering content, similar to how apps like Google Maps, Instagram, and Apple's iOS use full-screen or partial-screen overlays, effectively "sheeting over" previous views to present new information or actions.

I propose MSDS in stead, short for My Sheet Don't Stink.

imagetic a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/offline-with-jon-favre...

sonofhans 18 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah, I love this :)

fsflover a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes, https://pluralistic.net/2025/02/26/ursula-franklin/

GrowingSideways a day ago | parent | prev [-]

What does it imply that the other term does not? Enshitification is the inevitable result of the tendency of profit to revert to zero. This is basic schumpeter (not to mention marx).

6510 6 hours ago | parent [-]

One is the result the other is the process.

GrowingSideways 9 minutes ago | parent [-]

Ok, but what is the distinction between the two terms?

asadotzler a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That is what's expected when you put a glorified accountant in charge and he decides Wall St. is the real customer and the stock price is the real product and users and consumer technology are an afterthought.

bee_rider 21 hours ago | parent [-]

He’s been in charge for a while, even during some good times. I dunno. It definitely seems like the company is trending in a bad direction, though—maybe he was able to extrapolate from the good points well enough. But now that they are far past those points, the higher order terms are going bad…

valleyer 9 hours ago | parent [-]

Big ships are hard to turn, even in the backwards direction.

leokennis 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I have slowly but steadily made myself not rely on Apple anymore: files moved to NextCloud, mail and calendars moved to Fastmail, etc.

Platform agnostic choices, because clearly Apple is not to be trusted anymore as the guardian of good taste, and also not anymore as the guardian of acceptable morals (i.e. the insane sucking up to the Great Orange leader).

There are still some services I need to move (mainly, music and reminders) but once achieved I am ready to jump to another platform without it impacting my daily life.

retired 6 hours ago | parent [-]

[dead]

k2enemy 19 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I could not agree more.

It probably doesn't help that I just spend an hour trying to figure out how to update to 18.7.3 on my iphone. It turns out you can't. The only way to get security updates now is to upgrade to iOS 26. Apple no longer supports security updates to old major versions if the device is capable of running the new major release. Apple is no longer making choices that benefit customers, but ones that benefit project managers.

asdff 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Wow, I just checked and looks like I'm stuck on 18.7 for the rest of the life of this iPhone I guess. That being said it looks like I can opt into ios 18 beta. I wonder if that would include security patches? Actually maybe I don't want security patches. It would be nice to have a jailbroken iphone again one day...

gverrilla 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If in the past it has, it was precisely to reach the present situation. It's naive to expect these companies to be pro-costumers. They would rape your mother if they could - the only reason they don't is because that would make you not buy their product and falsehoods.

alt227 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> It's naive to expect these companies to be pro-costumers.

For the last 20 years this is exaclty what Apple fans have believed. Its refreshing to see people finally realise that they are just a normal company, making money at the expense of their customers. Its just they dont hide it as well anymore.

latexr 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> the only reason they don't is because that would make you not buy their product and falsehoods.

I’ve seen enough people defend these companies and their billionaire CEOs often and fervently enough, even in response to news that unilaterally fuck customers, that I’m not convinced people would stop buying even in your scenario.

MaysonL 19 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

18.7.3 is still available for download via a paid developer account, not sure about a free one.

KellyCriterion a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Google was killed when Pichai took over - in his first speech, he said: Everything is AI now.

From moment on, Google search tanked: from a userexperience perspective and a useracquisition-vehicle perspective. Lots of companies could have been built only Google worked 15years ago the way that Google did work. Lots of companies today do not have the same lane anymore, so spending more and more on advertising....

happymellon 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Who is going to be Apple’s next Nadella? Steve Jobs was the original.

Nadella is a budget Larry Ellison.

ragazzina a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> completely devoid of any ideas on the software side.

Maybe I’m too old, but if Apple fixed every single bug and added absolutely zero features until the day of my death, I would still be a satisfied customer.

The problem is not lack of innovation, the problem is that everything barely works.

latexr 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

There are obvious exceptions, like for example updating certificates, but otherwise I’m with you. Or I was, for many years, until the release of Liquid Glass. Now fixing bugs is no longer enough, the OS has become an abomination. I’ll avoid “upgrading” for as long as possible, then I’ll probably have to abandon Apple platforms forever.

celsius1414 21 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Doing your job and doing your job well are two different things, of course. The innovation is going to have to be in how to return to the latter when they’ve lost their way. Or, perhaps more accurately, been led astray by conflicting priorities.

They’ve done it recently with their hardware. Past time for the other side of the house to refocus.

asdff 10 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm still waiting on the iphone to get the macbook pro treatment: a return to thickness, more ports, and of course touchID.

edm0nd 18 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

imo the Apple that we all grew to love or hate, died when Jobs died. Its been nothing but a shell of itself since.

KolibriFly 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Forstall is an interesting thought experiment, but probably pure nostalgia

master_crab a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I heard someone randomly say that they should replace Tim Cook with Scott Forstall. I chuckled at the idea but this might be a great idea.

Fadell might also be a good choice. Either way it should be someone currently outside Apple. The company needs an external eye to review its processes and cruft that built up under Cook (nothing negative against the guy, but what worked 5-10 years ago won’t necessarily work 5-10 years down the road).

a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
x0x0 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> they’re completely devoid of any ideas on the software side.

Nah, they're full of ideas. Mostly around sucking out every dollar from anyone foolish enough to build on their OS.

They've seen which way the wind is blowing and their extortionate payment processing fees are going to get limited by most governments. The plan flatly is to extort companies for money in the app store to make up for it.

eg allowing companies to advertise against other companies' names: just like google, they plan to extort companies on navigation (ie direct product/company name) queries.

BanAntiVaxxers a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Has Nadella had one original thought? He simply passes through whatever the board orders.

drecked a day ago | parent | next [-]

Nadella turned Microsoft completely around. Before Nadella, for about 2 decades, Microsoft’s entire purpose seemed to be to stuff Windows into everything. Changing this was a massive undertaking that was largely unimaginable within MS.

Unfortunately now under Nadella AI is taking the role Windows used to play, but even there he understood the importance of AI before most of his competitors did which is what allowed Microsoft to gain such a substantial footing in OpenAI.

pjmlp 8 hours ago | parent [-]

And in the process alieanted most of the Windows developers, only game devs care (hence Proton), and now it is a QA mess.

Also it is quite clear for us old timers, that since the AI obssession started in Redmond, the old rotten Microsoft culture is back, it probably never left but it was tamed in the early Satya years.

happymellon 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Does he?

Remember Nadella doesn't read emails (he gets AI to summarise them all), he doesn't pay attention in meetings (he claims to get the minutes and then AI summerise them), what makes you think he even really knows the nuances of what the board want?

chroma205 a day ago | parent | prev [-]

> Has Nadella had one original thought? He simply passes through whatever the board orders.

No.

But for mega-tech CEO salary, I’d probably do exactly the same.

coliveira a day ago | parent [-]

It takes a person with massive personality disorder to do this kind of stuff. I'm glad I'm not doing it, whatever the amounts of money in play.

a day ago | parent [-]
[deleted]
downrightmike 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

a-holes with spreadsheets = MBA

Same thing that killed Intel, Microslop, pretty much every american company.

user205738 21 hours ago | parent [-]

The MBA was designed for those who did not want to study or could not master economics.(/jk or isn't)

rchaud 19 hours ago | parent [-]

So what if it is? A Master's in Economics gets you diddly squat in the job market whereas an MBA opens doors everywhere. You could get a PhD in Economics and still only work at a university, your country's central bank or at a stretch, the IMF or the World Bank, which are hardly held up as the pinnacle of professional development. And even then they'd only take you if you studied monetary economics.

Dylan16807 7 hours ago | parent [-]

They're not criticizing someone for seeing the appeal of an MBA, they're criticizing that an MBA has those factors in the first place. It shouldn't be the degree you pick to open doors.

lapcat a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

What has Nadella done for Windows users? It appears to me that Windows is becoming every bit as enshittified as macOS, if not more so. And isn't Microsoft experimenting with advertisements in Windows?

raw_anon_1111 a day ago | parent | next [-]

Microsoft doesn’t care about Windows. It’s been clear for years that their focus is on Azure, Office, and enterprise sales.

The enterprise is going to choose Windows regardless for the masses and even if consumers make a mass exodus to Apple (not going to happen because of price) or Linux (even less likely) they are out of $30 they charge OEMs.

pjmlp 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Only WSL and Terminal, but that is questionable.

I had VMWare Workstation before, and it isn't as if there were not Terminal alternatives already.

Other than that the whole UAP/UWP/WinUI/WinAppSDK, .NET Native, C++/CX, C++/WinRT has been a mess. They may shout to the winds it is the future, yet it is mostly crickets and endless list of bugs on the Github repos and related VS tooling.

apercu a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

So, yea, the latest IOS and MacOS are pretty terrible and user hostile, but they are miles from the issues with the latest Windows OS.

nikitaga a day ago | parent | prev [-]

How is MacOS as enshittified as Windows? It doesn't have ads, doesn't push AI on you, their online services are trivial to ignore once and never think about again, etc. I haven't tried Tahoe, and sure, its new glass UI is shit, but merely incompetent UI design is not "enshittification" and is not in any way equivalent to what Microsoft does in Windows.

madeofpalk a day ago | parent | next [-]

macOS absolutely, definitely, 100% has ads.

Buy a new Apple Watch and notice that the settings app with have a [1] badge trying to upsell you to buy AppleCare+. They obscure dismissing these by clicking the "Add AppleCare Coverage" button and then having a button that says actually no.

pixelready a day ago | parent | next [-]

The undissmissable badges in settings irk me to no end. Using language like “finish setting up” in iOS to describe me opting out of Apple Intelligence by choice as leaving MY device in some sort of “unfinished state” is user hostile too. With the amount of effort it takes me to push back constantly on these dark patterns, I know for a fact all my less tech savvy friends and family just aren’t bothering and that’s what they count on.

Not as egregious as what windows is doing with copilot everywhere or sneakily flipping user-toggled options during updates, but it’s all some degree of gross.

lynndotpy a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This, on top of the nonstop onslaught of advertisements for F1. It seemed like every one of Apple's services were pushing for that movie. They even put it into maps, wallets, into CarPlay (while people were driving!) It was surprisingly shameless.

It's certainly not as bad _right now_ as what you'll see on Windows 11, but this is something that will almost certainly only get worse over time.

nikitaga 20 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

My MacOS "100%" does not have any ads. But I don't use Apple watch or Apple online services, so that's the difference I guess.

You don't need to buy a Windows Watch to get ads on Windows though. They'll be right there anyway, and more of them.

gverrilla 8 hours ago | parent [-]

Didn't know that was possible (not a mac user).

rpdillon 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Agreed. And don't press the play/pause button on your Bluetooth headset, or Apple Music will fire up and ask you to agree to their terms.

iwontberude a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Windows has third party ads and it’s so trash

Marsymars 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> their online services are trivial to ignore once and never think about again

The workarounds to get rid of the nag to log into your icloud account on macOS are far more difficult than the workarounds to avoid using an MS account in Windows.

latexr 5 hours ago | parent [-]

> The workarounds to get rid of the nag to log into your icloud account on macOS

Do you have an example? I have to set up macOS on the regular, and after saying no to iCloud on the setup screen, it never bothers me again.

They are very aggressive with trying to get me to “update” to Tahoe, though.

runjake a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I've been getting intrusive first-party ads in Apple's OSes for at least the past 3 major OS releases. News+, Fitness+, Music, Apple TV+, etc etc.

nikitaga 20 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Surely we can distinguish MacOS – the operating system – from the online services provided by Apple that happen to have a native app?

If you are choosing to use Apple online services, sure, you'll get upsells I guess, as with any other online service. I don't use any of Apple's online services, and never see those ads.

al_borland a day ago | parent | prev [-]

News+ also has a ton of articles behind paywalls, even if paying for the premium version. It’s an ugly experience, probably the worst one.

bigyabai a day ago | parent | prev [-]

macOS does have ads, their online services are worse than Windows, and installing basic software like Homebrew and Git is like having teeth pulled.

Windows is absolutely miserable, but with WSL installed it's far and away the better dev environment. I say that as someone who dailies Linux and hates all three OSes.

coldtea 20 hours ago | parent [-]

While macOS has gown down over time, installing Homebrew and Git on macOS is trivial, a 30 second affair.

gtsop 16 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[dead]

iwontberude a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Forstall was an enshittefier too. Apple Maps was exactly what we are talking about.

atonse 20 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Apple Maps from day one was skating to where the puck was going to be. They had vector based maps when that stuff was brand new. Possibly before Google deployed it widespread (but I'm not sure on this fact).

But the problem with Apple Maps was easy to see (and can only be fixex over time)... data. Google and others had a decade+ head start on Apple when it came to collecting data for maps. Judge Apple Maps 5 years old vs Google Maps 5 years old. Not Apple Maps brand new vs Google Maps 10 years later.

Forstall is the one that pushed to make iOS based on macOS/Unix. He was definitely a lightning rod but had product sense.

krackers 15 hours ago | parent [-]

From my reading, Forstall was one of the few who actually refused to partake in performative corporate culture, and decided to quit rather than bend over

>when Apple issued a formal apology for the errors in Maps, Forstall refused to sign it

It's obvious that apple maps would never be able to be a perfect replacement for google maps at launch, and it's possible Forstall in fact voiced these exact concerns but was overruled before launch, only to then be used as cannon fodder when he turned out to be right. Given all the clearly empty corporate-style "we take full responsibility" stuff you see today, someone actually _refusing_ to play those games when it wasn't his fault is a very positive sign for authenticity.

(He also did work on Siri, but given that he was booted right after its launch, I don't think it's fair to attribute their present incompetence on that front to him.)

coldtea 20 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Strange take. Apple Maps was a new product. It's expected it would be behind Google Maps, maybe even forever given all the headstart and resources Google gives it.

In any case, Apple Maps (a NEW then product, in an entirely new space for Apple) being bad, is not at all related to "enshittification".

Apple Maps is absolutely the wrong thing to judge Forstall on.

Not to mention that its main problem is coverage i.e. data quality. Regarding software engineering it's fine, even better than Google Maps in lots of aspects.

iwontberude 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I mean, we had gps nav that worked and Apple maps would instead tell people to go down railroads but okay downvote me.