| ▲ | adamm255 5 hours ago |
| Learning that every thought you’ve put into an LLM, is recorded and readily available for evidence is going to be interesting for a lot of people. |
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| ▲ | binlog 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| Similar to how people realized their Google searches were accessible to law enforcement. “I did not kill my wife!” “Cool so why did you search for how to hide a dead body the same day she went missing?” |
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| ▲ | randycupertino 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | There was a mom in Utah who killed her husband poisoning him with a moscow mule spiked with fentanyl who googled "luxury prisons for the rich" as well as "how long does life insrance companies takento.pay" "can you delete everythjng on an old icloud account" "can deleted text messages be retrieved" "what information can be cbtained from a cellphone" "how to turn find my iphone off" "can cops force you to do a lie detector test," "when does FBI get involved in a case," "what is considered a lethal.dose of fentanyl" and "what are you allowed inside utah jails." She took out $2 million in life insurance on him and was having an affair with their handyman and they were having disputes about $$. https://www.ktvu.com/news/utah-mom-kouri-richins-googled-lux... After she killed him she authored a children's book about grief for kids. | | |
| ▲ | pcthrowaway 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | A woman who wrote a romance fiction novel called "How to Murder Your Husband" was convicted of murdering her husband https://www.npr.org/2022/05/26/1101433465/how-to-murder-your... | | |
| ▲ | xrd 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Someday AI will kill someone. And, then it'll write a book about it. It will do that because it read "How to Murder Your Husband" as part of its training. I'm going to be very confused about how to feel about that. When we arraign the AI, should there be two counts against it: stealing and murder? Or, can it plead that "my daddy, Sam Altman, told me to read this, I was born into a moral void." Plot twist: the judge will be AI from Russia. | | |
| ▲ | skinfaxi 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I read arraigning AI like putting down a rabid dog, except worse because you can't transfer to another machine the weights of the dog's brain (yet). | |
| ▲ | SanjayMehta 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Why Russia? Why not China? After all, China is way ahead of Russia in this aspect. | | |
| ▲ | xrd 40 minutes ago | parent [-] | | I'm obviously not a skilled writer. You should read AI written books exclusively. |
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| ▲ | hefner1456 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | She tried to poison him twice and he stayed with her. Now, thats ... uh ... love.. i think. She must have been one top notch narcissist to drag him along. | |
| ▲ | soundnote 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Similar story for many rap albums. Quite a few rappers have rapped about murders and oops, turns out they really did do it. | | | |
| ▲ | mcphage 30 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Well, they do say write what you know. | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | An essay it seems like, which wasn't included in the trial even: > Crampton Brophy's how-to treatise detailed various options for committing an untraceable killing and professed a desire to avoid getting caught. Circuit Judge Christopher Ramras ultimately excluded the essay from the trial, noting it was published in 2011. A prosecutor, however, alluded to the essay's themes without naming it after Crampton Brophy took the stand. |
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| ▲ | dmoy 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Man I really need to stop playing modern setting TTRPGs | | | |
| ▲ | crossroadsguy 44 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > "when does FBI get involved in a case," Now I can see why local law enforcement would have made it a priority to get her :D | |
| ▲ | 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | godwinson__4-8 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yes, what an idiot. He should have searched "I love my wife". Then law enforcement would know he couldn't possibly. Open and shut case, Johnson. | | |
| ▲ | skinfaxi 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | What point are you making here? Do you think a judge or jury would give both of those instances equal weight? | | |
| ▲ | godwinson__4-8 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | All other things being equal, why would it matter if a suspect instead of saying something obviously incriminating, had instead said something diametrically opposed? Is that what you are asking? If so, I'm confused. Why wouldn't it matter? Wouldn't this necessarily only be the case where the Google search doesn't really matter at all (i.e. there is sufficient other incriminating evidence). Anyway I also think you're missing what was merely meant to be a comment in jest. But now I'm actually confused what point you are trying to make. | | |
| ▲ | binlog 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Because people are going to lie in their own favor. Do you think that claims of innocence should be given the same weight as confessions of guilt? | | |
| ▲ | godwinson__4-8 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | What makes a Google search a confession? If the implication is the Google search is an implicit confession, because in a Google search you think you are not being watched, and thus are confessing your honest desires, why would his search of love be a "claim of innocence" rather than a "confession of love"? | |
| ▲ | autoexec an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | I don't think confessions of guilt should be given much weight either. Innocent people confess to crimes all the time. |
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| ▲ | mrheosuper an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | He should have searched "How to dispose a 130lb chicken". Rockie mistake. | |
| ▲ | the_af an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > Similar to how people realized their Google searches were accessible to law enforcement. There's probably a regression in beliefs, actually. Even here on HN, for more tech-savvy people. We used to know all the hard lessons of lack of privacy in browsing the internet, using Google services, etc. I remember when (tech) people were up in arms that Gmail scanned your emails, remember that? Well, all of that is seemingly forgotten in the age of LLM chat bots. It's back to square one. People need to relearn all the lessons, it's as if AI magically erased all of what we used to know about online privacy. | |
| ▲ | dzhiurgis 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | "I wanted to know what would potential killer would've done because I know you guys are doing fuck all to find her" |
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| ▲ | crossroadsguy an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I started asking things I'd normally want no one to know about (but if they do, it's fine) in private browser windows, not logged in (duck.ai most of the time anyway), usually VPN toggled ON just for that. Now I just use an offline model for that but since RAM is the bottleneck on my mac so to even run a 6-7GB model I have to start aggressively killing anything and everthing that's running and then hope to clear up enough on this 16GB RAM machine. So I am thinking of hosting one on one of the oracle free tier instances (if I can somehow use that whole 24GB RAM, that used to be, at once – not sure that's available anymore). I tihnk Kaggle also offers something like that. |
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| ▲ | belorn 41 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| We had a very public case in south of Sweden where a woman asked chat-gpt last year about how a failed rape attempt would look like and where in the local park there would be spots without any cameras, a full day before she reported to have been followed and attacked in that park. Quite recently the court found her guilt of filling a false police report, citing among other things the chat log (the police spent over 400 work hours on the initial report). It is the first case I seen in the news of LLM logs being used as evidence. |
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| ▲ | BLKNSLVR 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Also makes it important to not let other people use your LLM account... Could have more far-reaching consequences than having to make good on the offer to buy doughnuts for the office^ ^being the classic message that gets sent from the account of someone who didn't lock their computer when they walked away from their desk. |
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| ▲ | KellyCriterion 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It starts far before that: Ive seen people going through Plaud.AI conversation to find "on day X person Y said Z to person W", just to get some amunition against them. |
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| ▲ | andrewinardeer 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | Isn't this standard C level behaviour? | | |
| ▲ | KellyCriterion 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Before AI tools like Plaud.AI, this wasnt near possible because of work/time, and no person usually do not remember exactly who said what 6 month before,unless there is some email conversation. With Plaud, you can check unlimited backwards who said what in which meeting and what was wanted to achieve - very interesting actually to find things in there 6m later, while people said they will do it at ends of month and youself just forgot it already - and these systems allow you to chase exactly these discrepancies. | | |
| ▲ | dylan604 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Before, they'd hire some humans to do the research. No self respecting C-suite person would ever consider doing something resembling actual work. How long have corps been required to keep copies of emails/chats/etc? | |
| ▲ | anonymous908213 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Before AI tools like Plaud.AI, this wasnt near possible because of work/time, What is "work" to an executive if not using their privileged access to data to violate the privacy of anyone they have a grievance against? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EBay_stalking_scandal This has been happening long before LLMs, and this eBay case is notable only for the fact that it was actually publicly documented and prosecuted, not for the fact that it happened. I've personally been privy to two situations with other companies where the owner was doing something like this but nothing came of it legally. See also Meta employees looking up nudes streamed from people's Meta spy glasses, and Flock-using police stalking their exes. Smaller scale, but this also happens all the time with internet community moderators/admins. Humans are on average cretins, give them authority and the ability to abuse it and they will abuse it. | | |
| ▲ | autoexec an hour ago | parent [-] | | Humans abusing power isn't new, but the tools that make abusing power easier than ever are. |
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| ▲ | SoftTalker 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Same goes for anything you've put into social media, chat apps, or email for at least the last decade or two. |
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| ▲ | thelastgallon an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| This means no business should use AI providers (Cloud AI). Businesses do a LOT of shady stuff and all of it will be available. And, their IP or special sauce is all available to Anthropic/OpenAI to sell to other companies as AI solutions. Just like how AI solved recent math problems. Use local llms instead. |
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| ▲ | ChiMan an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | Local LLMs have the potential to convert computer use into what most people already thought it was: Private. In this, they could be one small step toward pushing back the Borg. Note to EFF and Cato: You each do yeoman's work for privacy in the realm of policy and law. Keep it up, and add this--relentless encouragement of local AI. Rights and progress are as often driven by technological realities as by enlightened policy and law. | | |
| ▲ | seanmcdirmid 18 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Relying on model weights won’t get you far. You need to hook up a search engine to your local model, and then you are stuck where you were before. |
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| ▲ | happyopossum an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | This is why a lot of companies that use Ai negotiate ZDR terms with their model providers of choice… Using local LLMs is a choice, but not one a lot of companies can support nimbly at scale. |
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| ▲ | darepublic 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I figured any hire at openai would know that at least |
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| ▲ | thatsabadlook 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | A good chunk of what keeps openai and similar companies afloat is subpar people who are willing if not eager to do crappy stuff to other people. A lot of the world works this way actually. | | |
| ▲ | Der_Einzige 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | "The grapes are sour!" - you | |
| ▲ | zer00eyz 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I dont think it's subpar people. The only word for it is hubris. The overwhelming sense that your ability in one area has some magical transitive property to ability in another. Can I write code? Sure. Im a bad designer, I can follow along in accounting, Im a terrible actor. I would guess that there is much more to this story than just someone "bugging" a conference room. Though I would venture to guess that the keystone cops never get to the bottom of it. | |
| ▲ | dearing 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Word. Company is another. |
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| ▲ | Jcampuzano2 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| At this points its an IQ test. Stupid people still google exactly what heinous stuff they plan to do and think thats gonna fly. |
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| ▲ | jltsiren 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Intelligent people are often stupid. Or, more accurately, people make stupid mistakes when they lack the experience. Intelligent people often succumb to the fallacy that because they can learn things quickly, they can skip the learning part just figure things out as they go. | | |
| ▲ | wat10000 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | It’s good to remember that we rarely hear about the smart people who carefully thought through their crimes and then executed them well. |
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| ▲ | m463 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Claude, help throw people off my trail by blaming a random openai employee, then delete all my activity. |
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| ▲ | serial_dev 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Even my non tech elderly parents know that. The fact that they used LLMs to figure out how to best bug the executives really shows how poor their judgement is. |
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| ▲ | 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| [deleted] |
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| ▲ | 10xDev 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I think people have some awareness, but like search history they believe deleting will resolve that (it won't). |
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| ▲ | SoftTalker 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Yeah if you're logged in to a Google account when you search, clearing your local browser history does nothing. |
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| ▲ | EGreg 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Ever since social media, I have always gamed out what would happen if this was ever saved on the backend and used against me in the future. It’s like thinking about edge cases in programming… Most people are totally not like that. And it does force you into some difficult choices. |
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| ▲ | jacquesm 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > And it does force you into some difficult choices. I gots to know... | | |
| ▲ | EGreg 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Just read this: https://paulgraham.com/say.html Paul Graham years ago: “I can’t publicly comment on all this stuff. I would turn into Noam Chomsky.” Paul Graham on X last couple years…not exactly following his earlier advice. They get you eventually. | | |
| ▲ | jacquesm 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Paul staying on X was a real failure of judgment imo. He made the right call and then backed out of it. I don't remember if they invited Elon to startup school before or after, either way I don't think that that is the kind of connection you want. | | |
| ▲ | EGreg 39 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Yup and that’s just ONE guy. The fact that I was able to bring an example on HN of literally the guy who founded YC, imagine what chance the rest of the “plebs” have to resist the siren song. If you want to know what I think … they make both parents work long hours for corporations, stick their kids in government schools, which are run like prisons[1] where now if they act too rambunctious they are diagnosed with ADHD and prescribed amphetamines. Meanwhile the elderly parents who took care of you when you were little are put into nursing homes because their adult children have no time to take care of them either. The amount of medications for the elderly in nursing homes is even greater than for their children. The teenage girls have record levels of depression, coinciding with the rise of Instagram and TikTok. But they call it “sadness” because they don’t want to link it with clinical depression, which is also quite high. Men are on opiates while one in five middle aged women is on antidepressants. And many people are now glued to their latest feed of doomscroll or video AI slop. Which is even worse than before… So yeah. If you think the software is “bad for our kids”, you should look at what it does to the adults. Endless arguing online with strangers for no reason. Maybe a bot will read it. Maybe a random person will reply or downvote it. Either way it wins because the system needs profits and the algorithm will prioritize “engagement”, which means one-sided outrage narratives that triggers someone to write an angry rant. We don’t really need those user-generated arguments anymore because AI can generate those, but then again we won’t need humans to do most things online at all… (Ironically, the above was an angry rant too, to open some strangers’ eyes on HN, a social forum. But once you see it, you can’t really unsee it.) 1. https://paulgraham.com/nerds.html | |
| ▲ | Pxtl 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | He was inching into anti-dei culture war stuff so I'm not sure how much he actually disagrees with Musk's political goals so much as he rightly observers that Musk and Trump are complete maniacs. | | |
| ▲ | jacquesm 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Or just scared. These guys don't play nice with people that publicly cross them. |
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| ▲ | teiferer 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Just to be clear, the difficult choice is not whether to use OpenAi/Anthropic/Grok/... versus a local LLM. The choice is whether to hang out with people with whom you can't be sure they don't have a Plaud/Pocket/.. in their literal pocket which is continuously listening. Unfortunately the set of such people will eventually be shrinking more and more until eventually only a few tinfoil folks are left. Dystopian? Just think back w.r.t. continuous tracking by Google/Facebook/.. Unthinkable 30 years ago, total standard today. Try to count the fraction of your emails that don't actually reside on a MSFT or Google server because the other end has an account there. That fight is over. You can just as well join them. | | |
| ▲ | sda2 an hour ago | parent [-] | | True homies will invite you over to chill nude in their Faraday cage. | | |
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| ▲ | nradov 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The weird thing is that I've had other HN users argue with me and claim that LLM chat users should be entitled to privacy, as if it were a priest or lawyer. |
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| ▲ | 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| [deleted] |
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| ▲ | rustcleaner 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Local AI > Cloud AI Thus, #NeverSubscribe! |
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| ▲ | teiferer 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Prepare to have that dug up 20 years in the future during some court proceedings. Or at the border where it is already routine to ask for social media accounts (especially foreign nationals) you might someday five the border agent your login. |
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| ▲ | hsuduebc2 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| To be honest, from OpenAI engineer I would expect better. |
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| ▲ | rossy 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Seems like they select for people as dependent on their product as their customers. Maybe it helps them more to have true-believers rather than intelligent people. |
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