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mastax 7 hours ago

It seems likely to me the ruling took this long because John Roberts wanted to get a more unanimous ruling.

Additionally, the law in this case isn’t ill defined whatsoever. Alito, Thomas, and to a lesser extent Kavanaugh are just partisan hacks. For many years I wanted to believe they had a consistent and defensible legal viewpoint, even if I thought it was misguided. However the past six years have destroyed that notion. They’re barely even trying to justify themselves in most of these rulings; and via the shadow docket frequently deny us even that barest explanation.

pdpi 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> For many years I wanted to believe they had a consistent and defensible legal viewpoint, even if I thought it was misguided.

Watching from across the Atlantic, I was always fascinated by Scalia's opinions (especially his dissents). I usually vehemently disagreed with him on principle (and I do believe his opinions were principled), but I often found myself conceding to his points, from a "what is and what should be are different things" angle.

Nicook 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Scalia wrote some really interesting opinions for sure. Feel like the arguments are only going to get worse :(

Rapzid 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Amy Coney Barrett has somewhat taken up the mantel, but her legal reasoning is probably superior.

Thomas wants to pretend he's the OG originalist, but I don't think he is anywhere near Barrett's peer.

bradleyjg 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Kavanaugh clearly isn’t in the same bucket. His votes go either way. I don’t recall seeing a single decision this administration where either Alito or Thomas wrote against a White House position. Not just in case opinions but even in an order. I don’t think we’ve seen a justice act as a stalking horse for the president in this way since Fortas.

legitster 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Kavanaugh strikes me as principled, but in kind of a Type-A, "well, actually" sort of way where he will get pulled into rabbit holes and want to die on random textual hills.

He is all over the map, but not in a way that seems consistent or predictable.

llbeansandrice 2 hours ago | parent [-]

His dissent in this case was basically "Don't over turn the tariffs because it will be too hard to make everyone whole" Which doesn't strike me as "principled" at all.

Wasn't it JFK who said "We choose to Not do these things bc they're kinda hard actually"? /s

Rapzid 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

That is not the thrust of his argument; he believes they were legal. I don't think we need people spreading this uninformed meme all over HN.

dboreham 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is nonsense, and the same nonsense as we heard in the insurrectionist ruling. Allowing fascism "Because it's inconvenient to do otherwise" is bonkers.

malfist an hour ago | parent [-]

Your misbehavior is so egregious we have to reward you for it

brendoelfrendo 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Kavanaugh votes either way, but I don't think this is out of principle... I just think he's just kind of an idiot and thinks he can write a justification for just about any of his biases without making those biases obvious. It's kind of apparent if you read his opinions; they tend to be very verbose (his dissent here is 63 pages!) without saying a whole lot, and he gets sloppy with citations, selectively citing precedent in some cases while others he simply hand-waves. Take his opinion in Noem v. Vasquez Perdomo (the "Kavanaugh stop" case): there's a reason why no one joined his concurrence.

metalliqaz 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

His reputation will be forever tarnished by "Kavanaugh stops"

throw0101a 3 hours ago | parent [-]

That the the four sexual assault allegations (Thomas had "only" one during his nomination):

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brett_Kavanaugh#Sexual_assault...

ruszki 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You need to be cautious with the notion of “his votes go either way”. In Hungary, where I’m from, and a Trump kinda guy rules for 16 years, judges vote either way… but they vote against the government only when it doesn’t really matter for the ruling party. Either the government wants a scapegoat anyway why they cannot do something, or just simply nobody cares or even see the consequences. Like the propaganda newspapers are struck down routinely… but they don’t care because nobody, who they really care about, see the consequences of those. So judges can say happily that they are independent, yet they are not at all.

This fake independence works so well, that most Hungarians lie themselves that judiciary is free.

zeroonetwothree 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Weren’t Sotomator and Jackson the same with Biden? Kagan is much more principled.

bradleyjg 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

In major case, sure. But every last emergency petition? I don’t think so.

bonsai_spool 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Weren’t Sotomator and Jackson the same with Biden? Kagan is much more principled

Very respectfully, there is no comparison between Trump and Biden in this respect. Indeed, the court adopted a new legal concept, the Major Questions Doctrine, to limit Biden continuing the Trump student loan forbearance.

twoodfin 5 hours ago | parent [-]

The Major Questions Doctrine has been a thing for decades:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_questions_doctrine

bonsai_spool 5 hours ago | parent [-]

> The Major Questions Doctrine has been a thing for decades:

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_questions_doctrine

I've read the Wikipedia page before and also reviewed it before posting, but thanks for your insightful analysis.

Care to share when it was used in the majority before the current Roberts court?

tyre 4 hours ago | parent [-]

FDA v. Brown & Williamson Tobacco Corp. is an example of the same principle without the name (afaik it wasn’t named that until later.)

Basically the FDA tried to use its powers to regulate drugs and devices to regulate nicotine (drug) via cigarettes (device.) The conservatives on the court said, in effect, “look obviously congress didn’t intend to include cigarettes as a medical device, come on.”

Then Congress passed a specific law allowing the FDA to regulate cigarettes. This is how it should work. If congress means something that’s a stretch, they should say so specifically.

bonsai_spool 4 hours ago | parent [-]

I think that's a fair example but it had the wrinkle that an FDA commissioner explicitly changed what the Agency's position on tobacco regulation was [1].

I don't have as much time to offer a similar assessment of the first two 'official' Major Questions Doctrine cases in the Biden administration, but neither was nearly as contentious as the FDA reversing its prior position.

For this reason, I see this decision as an argument against an agency changing course from an accepted previous (but not Congressionally defined) perspective. However, Chevron—at least according to interviews with lawmakers responding to the 'MQD' usage—ran counter to what the supposed understanding of how agency work would function. Again, I can find primary sources later.

1. https://www.nytimes.com/2000/03/22/us/high-court-holds-fda-c...

hluska 4 hours ago | parent [-]

> the court adopted a new legal concept

You phrased something very poorly. Someone replied and you moved the goalposts; claiming that you were actually referring to the majority using a concept. And now you’ve moved the goalposts again.

I don’t know why you’re doing backflips to avoid admitting that you were wrong.

bonsai_spool an hour ago | parent [-]

> Indeed, the court adopted a new legal concept

I wasn't wrong - the first time the concept was named in a decision was in the Biden administration. It sounds like you're not actually reading any of these, or aware of this issue?

I do agree that the idea that some agency actions should be used appeared in the case OP cited. But it's obvious that SCOTUS is using this concept much more broadly now.

blackjack_ 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Alito is one of the original proponents of the unitary executive theory (way before he was a Supreme Court justice). Everything he does should be looked at as an attempt to impose said theory and destroy America.

anthonypasq 5 hours ago | parent [-]

its truly bizarre that anyone with this view could get approved by congress. its so antithetical to the entire american political system. just blows my mind how spineless congress as an institution has been for decades.

jasondigitized 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

When all of your decisions can be predetermined without even knowing the context of the matter you are surely a hack. It goes like this.....'Does this matter benefit Trump, corporations, rich people or evangelicals?'. Yes? Alito and Thomas will argue its lawful. Every single time.

5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
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RetpolineDrama 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Extremely biased comment.

The SC ruling today:

1) Does not stop the president from enacting tariffs, at all. The dissents even spelled out that no actual change would come from this ruling.

2) The ruling creates the absurd scenario where the president can (under this specific law) totally ban ALL imports from a country on whim, but not partially via tariffs. It's akin to being able to turn the AC on or off, but not being allowed to set the temperature.

As usual, interesting discussion about the nuances of this ruling are happening on X. Reddit and HN comments are consistently low-signal like the above.

tyre 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It’s not an absurd scenario. The law was written specifically to allow blocking imports from a country.

The nuance is that nothing Congress passed granted to right to tax. Additionally, they did grant the power to partially block imports. Nothing says you have to enact “no imports from Japan” vs. “no imports of networking equipment from Lichtenstein.”

RetpolineDrama 4 hours ago | parent [-]

>The law was written specifically to allow blocking imports from a country.

The precise wording is regulate. The idea that "regulate" means you can turn it on or off with no in-between is beyond parody. Absurd. Hilarious. Farcical.

That said the headline is misleading and should be renamed, nothing is changing from this ruling.

Starman_Jones 2 hours ago | parent [-]

The precise wording is

"investigate, block during the pendency of an investigation, regulate, direct and compel, nullify, void, prevent or prohibit..."

mexicocitinluez 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> discussion about the nuances of this ruling are happening on X

I'm sure they are lol.

2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]
hinkley 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Thomas isn’t a hack, he’s a shill. And he’s not even trying to be subtle about it. He’s somebody’s bitch and he literally drives around in the toys they bought for him as compensation.

If any justice deserves to be impeached it’s him. I can’t believe they approved him in the first place. Anita Hill sends her regards.

MaysonL 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I remember being shocked, albeit not surprised, when I read that he had quite a lot of contact with Ron de Santis.

https://americanoversight.org/email-suggests-that-supreme-co...

dyauspitr 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

But the toys are so cheap. It can’t possibly be just a matter of the money, there has to be some blackmail involved. Either that or he was always self hating.

evan_ 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Why would there need to be bribery or blackmail involved? He's ideologically aligned with the goals of the republican party.

His patrons lavish him with gifts because they don't want him to retire, not because they want a specific ruling.

hinkley 2 hours ago | parent [-]

It’s the same thing.

Keep doing exactly what we want you to do, or the money goes to someone who will.

Which is also a message to the rest.

Rapzid 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Then why accept them and face the embarrassment of being found out not reporting them properly?

You are correct compared to the $320k/year salary these empty nesters pull these things seem not that expensive. So why not just save up and buy them himself?

Yes, RED FLAG. Because apparently he likes nice things and spending money so much he can't seem to afford them himself or forgo the gifts and spare himself the scandal.

hinkley 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

He was gifted a motor coach worth $80,000, and that’s just one of the bigger things he can’t launder.

buzzerbetrayed 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

jonathanstrange 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

What liberal justices do has no bearing on OP's argument at all. You must be able to recognize the fallacy?

bluedays 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Why are conservatives always so angry?

geoka9 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Why do angry people tend to lean conservative?

Refreeze5224 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Constant fear.