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WhereIsTheTruth a day ago

> Government enacted shut down due to protests

Not just protests, it's to prevent foreign interference (like CIA) from fueling civil unrest and spreading AI deepfakes, as seen in Myanmar and Brazil

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/09/myanmar-faceb...

daedrdev a day ago | parent | next [-]

Wow its so nice this excuse just happens to shut down the internet when an astronomically unpopular regime faces vast protests after years of economic and political mismanagement

ithkuil a day ago | parent | next [-]

Apparently a lot of people in the west too are assuming that these protests are fueled by the west. At least that's the most likely explanation for why so many left leaning youth are not supporting Iranians while supporting Palestine. Apparently the fight is not about freedom but about (perceived) whiteness vs non-whiteness

irusensei a day ago | parent | next [-]

These people treat geopolitics as if they are watching an avengers movie.

logicchains a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>Apparently the fight is not about freedom but about (perceived) whiteness vs non-whiteness

But the Iranians are white. The name Iran is literally derived from "Aryan".

Aloisius a day ago | parent | next [-]

I believe that was the point they were making.

While I don't think they're right that Iran is ignored because Iranian protesters and the Iranian government are both perceived as white by Americans (or both non-white, depending on the person), it's undeniable that they use the perceived non-whiteness of Palestinians and perceived whiteness of Israelis as rhetorical ammunition.

This rhetorical device is a rather effective as Americans have a tendency to view everything through their own lens of "race"/color so casting the conflict as white people oppressing non-white people because they are non-white is a powerful argument that is easily understood by Americans.

That said, personally, I think Iran is ignored more because Palestine is sucking all the air out of the room than anything else, especially with all the graphic videos/photos. Sudan on the other hand... there's really no excuse for ignoring that.

shigawire a day ago | parent [-]

>Personally, I think Iran is ignored more because Palestine is sucking all the air out of the room than anything else, especially with all the graphic videos/photos.

>Sudan on the other hand... there's really no excuse for ignoring that.

Palestine has the focus because America tax dollars most directly fuel the conflict and it is the most one-sided.

Iran is an internal conflict and Sudan is a civil war - neither of which are as directly funded by the US. Also neither has a perceived clear solution. In the case of Israel, the US should have significant leverage that it does not have in those other conflicts.

graemep a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Aryan does not equal white.

Definitions of race are very culturally dependent. A few decades ago South Asians were regarded as caucasian (I have an American encyclopedia published in the 1950s that says so), a century earlier so were some East Africans (Somalis IIRC). The current western definition of white does not include them.

Similarly the current American definition of black includes people most of the rest of the world would not consider black - we sometimes have to be told that some people identify as "black" (what Americans call passing as white).

ithkuil a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah of course none of this makes sense. And yet it all has real world consequences. It's all incredibly partisan. If one just manages to take a step back and watch this dynamic from outside it all seems so weird: the islamist Iran backs Hamas, Hamas are Palestinians, Palestinians are victimized by Jews, Jews have money, capitalists have money, america is capitalist, america is imperialist, ergo .... Islamist Iran is against capitalist imperialism. The protests are against islamist Iran ergo they are against the fight against capitalist imperialism and thus they don't deserve solidarity, or something like this.

I would really love to hear from somebody who is not supporting the Iran protests to honestly tell me if I misrepresented their position and in which way

helloaltalt a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Iran comes from the word rougly translating to the word noble, and noble in sanskrit translates to the word Arya

Aryans aren't necessarily white or black especially in the sanskrit context of things.

FilosofumRex a day ago | parent | prev [-]

No, they're just better educated about Iran than are you.

Iran provides substantial food, fuel, education and healthcare subsidies to the average citizen and has a very effective state bureaucracy which functions independent of political appointees. Pensioners' checks are issued regularly and social services are delivered by charitable "Bonyads", which are run by local mosques, which don't report to any government ministries.

helloaltalt a day ago | parent | next [-]

My ex was iranian and we frequently talked about iran and you are so wrong.

She had frequent black outs with complete electricity downage for many hours a day and she was in a major city

One of the largest problems is that Iran's average income is so poor and the rising inflation and rising prices.

They didn't even have a battery or something which could store electricity while it came because the batteries were so expensive that one of them cost like 1 month of salary of average iranian.

Things were really tough, she told me about the education system and she had to recently move to govt school and she said that there were just not any books available.

She really disliked the regime. She was liberal and I asked her about hijab and she said that she was forced to wear in schools and that the only contacts that they usually did was with their brothers. The society is extremely strict to a point of no return.

The average Iranian person either barely scrapes by or was/is actively being suffered by authoritarian brutality from the ground reality of extremist islamist radicalism that their govt put them on.

FilosofumRex a day ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

kelvinjps10 a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Just go there, live there if you think that's true. It isn't it's the same argument that communist believers do about Venezuela, Cuba and North corea they will support those government but they won't move there or even ask the people there how they actually live.

aprilthird2021 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Internet shut downs are really common in authoritarian countries. India used to shut the Internet down in Kashmir every other day, and in random states for random reasons some as seemingly trivial as high school students taking their board exams

FilosofumRex a day ago | parent | next [-]

[flagged]

helloaltalt a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Kashmir has such a bloody history with its kashmiri pandits and wars and even recent events that really shock its nation.

Kashmir has been the most unstable part of India and Article 370 although with flaws wanted to give Kashmir the stability it deserves but Kashmir had even its own flags and state etc. and thats why it got really messy and why the internet used to be shut down

Kashmir still requires people to specifically get a sim just for Kashmir. But you can get any large carrier to do such. There are even ways of generating e-sim and such, but there is genuinely lots of concerns and complaints in doing so and its very time consuming in a way but internet access has stabilized for the most part, you just require a special sim verification again to do such or perhaps buying a new sim specifically for kashmir but you can port the number as well but as I said, its really time consuming but possible to even do this without entering kashmir itself

anthem2025 a day ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

perching_aix a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I gave this a skim and a keyword search. Note that I'm not familiar with the matter.

The article claims that the Rohingya genocide in Myanmar that kicked off in 2017 has been substantively fueled by Facebook propaganda efforts, with strong links to Myanmar's own "security forces" (military).

> it's to prevent foreign interference (like CIA) from fueling civil unrest and spreading AI deepfakes, as seen in Myanmar and Brazil

In contrast then, you seem to allege that it was actually a foreign interference campaign by the CIA? Or am I misunderstanding what you're proposing?

Because if I'm not, I fail to see how what you linked supports that at all. Even your mention of deepfakes seems very questionable, as those haven't been a thing until late 2017, by which point this cleansing effort was already long underway. I further see that the US has formally condemned these events, although of course that does not rule out involvement.

WhereIsTheTruth a day ago | parent [-]

CIA and Amnesty's claims aside, focus on how social media fuels civil unrest, the real concern is foreign interference, Iran has been a target for a very long time

The US wants a regime change, that's a fact, Trump has been very vocal on the matter, and the NSA has the tools to do what ever it pleases on the internet (e.g., PRISM)

perching_aix a day ago | parent | next [-]

People can focus on a lot of things and make any arbitrary narrative emerge. My problem is exactly that I do not find this angle compelling so far, especially in light of the to-me-obvious alternative.

You started off by listing a bunch of things that did not pass my smell test (and you have now walked back on), then followed it up by what's essentially a scattershot of vague gesturings. Why would I focus on what you tell me to? Not only is any of these not compelling, I do not find you a reliable narrator so far at all.

21 hours ago | parent [-]
[deleted]
bawolff a day ago | parent | prev [-]

You know what else fuels unrest - potentially not having basic needs met by society. There is a major economic crisis in Iran. There is an impending water crisis.

Social media is a new thing, but protests are old. People protested in despotic regimes prior to social media, and the triggering factors were basically the same as what is happening in Iran right now.

helloaltalt a day ago | parent [-]

> Social media is a new thing, but protests are old. People protested in despotic regimes prior to social media, and the triggering factors were basically the same as what is happening in Iran right now.

In fact, Social medias can make the co-ordination of protests and other information rather quickly. Its one of the few benefits of social medias. Social media with all its flaws still helps protests

WhereIsTheTruth 19 hours ago | parent [-]

TikTok playbook: if a foreign power controls an influential platform, it's a national security threat, if the US controls it, it's just social media

bawolff a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Pretty sure the CIA is perfectly capable of doing that without the internet.

If anything its easier to spread rumours without the internet to let people compare notes

breppp a day ago | parent | prev [-]

or alternatively to shutdown information flowing out just before the killing begins

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/press-release/2020/11/iran...