Remix.run Logo
Hendrikto 9 hours ago

> I could have written it but it would have taken me about 3x longer when all is said and done.

Really does not sound like that from your description. It sounds like coaching a noob, which is a lot of work in itself.

Wasn’t there a study that said that using LLMs makes people feel more productive while they actually are not?

fluidcruft 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

True but the n00b is very fast. A lot of coaching is waiting for the n00b to perform tasks and meta things about motivation. These LLM are extremely fast and eager to work.

I don't need a study to tell me that five projects that have been stuck in slow plodding along waiting for me to ever have time or resources for nearly ten years. But these are now nearing completion after only two months of picking up Claude Code. And with high-quality implementations that were feverdreams.

My background is academic science not professional programming though and the output quality and speed of Claude Code is vastly better than what grad students generate. But you don't trust grad student code either. The major difference here is that suggestions for improvement loop in minutes rather than weeks or months. Claude will get the science wrong, but so do grad students.

(But sure technically they are not finished yet ... but yeah)

victorbjorklund 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

100% this. The AI missunderstands and make a mistake? No problem. Clarify and the AI will come back with a rewrite in 30 sec.

bigfishrunning 3 hours ago | parent [-]

A rewrite with another, more subtle mistake. That you must spend energy discovering and diagnosing.

dawnerd an hour ago | parent | next [-]

And potentially trick you into going down a rabbit hole as you try to steer it when it would have been faster to edit the code yourself. The best use is editing code with it instead of purely relying on prompting. Also new contexts for different changes make a huge difference. Seems a lot of devs get stuck in the single context chat stream and it starts to break down as context gets fuzzy.

catlifeonmars 25 minutes ago | parent [-]

> The best use is editing code with it instead of purely relying on prompting.

What does this look like in practice?

fluidcruft 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

How is that different from working with a n00b except that it only took 30sec to get to the next bug rather than a week?

bigfishrunning 3 hours ago | parent [-]

The junior engineer will grow into a senior engineer

bayarearefugee 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> The junior engineer will grow into a senior engineer

And then quit after accepting a new job that pays them their modified value, because tech companies are particularly bad at proactive retention.

Kirth 10 minutes ago | parent [-]

.. and because the job and environment weren't that pleasant or rewarding to offset that delta in income offered elsewhere at an equally drab employer

fluidcruft 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

And then they get their own junior engineers and you get fresh new junior engineers.

square_usual 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> another, more subtle mistake. That you must spend energy discovering and diagnosing

But this is literally what senior engineers do most of the time? Have juniors write code with direction and review that it isn't buggy?

bigfishrunning 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Except that most of the code seniors review was written with intention, not just the most statistically most likely response to a given query. As a senior engineer, the kinds of mistakes that AI makes are much more bizarre then the mistakes junior engineers make

square_usual 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I've worked with many interns and juniors in my life and they've made very bizarre mistakes and had subtle bugs, so the difference in the kinds hasn't made much of a difference in the work I've had to do to review. Whether or not there was intention behind it didn't make a difference.

sokoloff an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

I’ve definitely seen absolutely bizarre creations from junior devs decades ago (so, well before modern AI). I can also think back to some cringey code I wrote by hand when I was a junior as well.

I mentor high-school students and watch them live write code that takes a completely bizarre path. It might technically be intentional, but that doesn’t mean it’s good or useful.

dingnuts 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

LLMs might make you feel faster (which helps with motivation!) and help with some of the very easy stuff but the critical part of your anecdote is that you haven't actually completed the extra work. The projects are only "NEARING" completion. I think that's very telling.

victorbjorklund 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

If the easy things are done faster you xan spend more time on the hard stuff. No need to spend 2 hours on making the UI for the MVP when an AI can make a decent UI in 2 min. Means you have 2 hours more to spend on the hard stuff.

SpicyLemonZest 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Unless, as is often the case in my experience, the hard stuff consists largely of fixing bugs and edge cases in your implementation of the easy stuff. I've seen multiple people already end up forced back to the drawing board because their "easy stuff" AI implementation had critical flaws they only realized after they thought they were done. It's hard to prove counterfactuals, but I'm pretty confident they would have gotten it right the first time if they hadn't used AI, they're not bad engineers.

fluidcruft 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Congratulations! You repeated my joke? lol

But in all seriousness, completion is not the only metric of productivity. I could easily break it down into a mountain of subtasks that have been fully completed for the bean counters. In the meantime, the code that did not exist 2 months ago does exist.

exe34 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> I don't need a study to tell me that five projects that have been stuck in slow plodding along waiting for me to ever have time or resources for nearly ten years.

that's the issue in the argument though. it could be that those projects would also have been completed in the same time if you had simply started working on them. but honestly, if it makes you feel productive to the point you're doing more work than you would do without the drug, I'd say keep taking it. watch out for side effects and habituation though.

pessimizer 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

You've added an implicit assumption that this person spends more time programming now than they used to, rather than continuing to commit time at the same rate but now leading to projects being completed when they previously got bogged down and abandoned.

There are any number of things you could add to get you to any conclusion. Better to discuss what is there.

I've had the same experience of being able to finish tons of old abandoned projects with AI assistance, and I am not spending any more time than usual working on programming or design projects. It's just that the most boring things that would have taken weeks to figure out and do (instead, let me switch to the other project I have that is not like that, yet) have been reduced to hours. The parts that were tough in a creative fun way are still tough, and AI barely helps with them because it is extremely stupid, but those are the funnest, most substantive parts.

fluidcruft 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I don't think that's correct. That could be true if I were primarily a programmer, but I am not. I'm mostly a certified medical physicist working in a hospital. Programming is a skill that is helpful and I have spent my programming time building other tools that I need. But that list is gigantic, the software that is available for purchase is all complete crap, the market is too small for investment, etc. That's all to say the things I am building are desperately needed but my time for programming is limited and it's not what brings home the bacon and there's no money to be made (beyond consulting, essentially these things might possibly work as tools for consultants). I don't have resources for professional programming staff but I have worked with them in the past and (no offense to most of HN) but the lack of domain knowledge tends to waste even more of my time.

tehjoker 2 hours ago | parent [-]

You are very fortunately in the perfect slot for where LLM has a lot of bang for the buck.

veidr 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It is in many ways much like coaching a n00b, but a n00b that can do 10 hours of n00b work in 10 minutes (or, 2 minutes).

That's a significant difference. There are a lot of tasks that can be done by a n00b with some advice, especially when you can say "copy the pattern when I did this same basic thing here and here".

And there are a lot of things a n00b, or an LLM, can't do.

The study you reference was real, and I am not surprised — because accurately gauging the productivity win, or loss, obtained by using LLMs in real production coding workflows is also not junior stuff.

giantg2 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"Really does not sound like that from your description. It sounds like coaching a noob, which is a lot of work in itself."

And if this is true, you will have to coach AI each time whereas a person should advance over time.

raincole 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

At least you can ask AI to summarize a AGENT.md or something and it will read it diligently next time.

As for humans, they might not have the motivation technical writing skill to document what they learnt. And even if they did, the next person might not have the patience to actually read it.

ay 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

"Read diligently" - that’s a very optimistic statement. I can not count how many times Claude (LLM I am most familiar with, I had it write probably about 100KLOC in the past few months) explicitly disobeyed what was written in the instructions.

Also, a good few times, if it were a human doing the task, I would have said they both failed to follow the instructions and lied about it and attempted to pretend they didn’t. Luckily their lying abilities today are primitive, so it’s easy to catch.

smsm42 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Psychopatic behavior seems to be a major problem for these (of course it doesn't think so it can't be called that but that's the closest term that fits). They are trained to arrive at the result, and if the most likely path to it is faking it and lying about it, then that's what you are getting. And if you find it, it will cheerfully admit it and try to make s better lie that you'd believe.

onionisafruit 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

So true. I have some non-typical preferences for code style. One example is I don’t like nested error checks in Go. It’s not a correctness issue, it’s just a readability preference. Claude and copilot continually ignore this no matter how much emphasis I give it in the instructions. I recently found a linter for this, and the agent will fix it when the linter points out the issue.

This is probably because the llm is trained on millions of lines of Go with nested error checks vs a few lines of contrary instructions in the instructions file.

I keep fighting this because I want to understand my tools, not because I care that much about this one preference.

jaggederest 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Claude has really gone downhill in the last month or so. They made a change to move the CLAUDE.md from the system prompt to being occasionally read in, and it really deprioritizes the instructions to the same attention level as the code it's working on.

I've been trying out Codex the last couple days and it's much more adherent and much less prone to lying and laziness. Anthropic says they're working on a significant release in Claude Code, but I'd much rather have them just revert back to the system as it was ~a month ago.

CuriouslyC 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Claude is cooked. GPT5 codex is a much stronger model, and the codex cli is much more performant/robust than cc (even if it has fewer features).

I've never had a model lie to me as much as Claude. It's insane.

darkbatman 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

true, I was using Cline/Roocode from almost an year and it always made sure to read things from memory-bank which i really liked. Claude has gone downhill from August mid for me and often it doesn't follow instructions from claude.md or forget things mid-way.

derefr 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Also, a good few times, if it were a human doing the task, I would have said they both failed to follow the instructions and lied about it and attempted to pretend they didn’t.

It's funny. Just yesterday I had the experience of attending a concert under the strong — yet entirely mistaken — belief that I had already been to a previous performance of the same musician. It was only on the way back from the show, talking with my partner who attended with me (and who had seen this musician live before), trying to figure out what time exactly "we" had last seen them, with me exhaustively listing out recollections that turned out to be other (confusingly similar) musicians we had seen live together... that I finally realized I had never actually been to one of this particular musician's concerts before.

I think this is precisely the "experience" of being one of these LLMs. Except that, where I had a phantom "interpolated" memory of seeing a musician I had never actually seen, these LLMs have phantom actually-interpolated memories of performing skills they have never actually themselves performed.

Coding LLMs are trained to replicate pair-programming-esque conversations between people who actually do have these skills, and are performing them... but where those conversations don't lay out the thinking involved in all the many implicit (thinking, probing, checking, recalling) micro-skills involved in actually performing those skills. Instead, all you get in such a conversation thread is the conclusion each person reaches after applying those micro-skills.

And this leads to the LLM thinking it "has" a given skill... even though it doesn't actually know anything about "how" to execute that skill, in terms of the micro-skills that are used "off-screen" to come up with the final response given in the conversation. Instead, it just comes up with a prediction for "what someone using the skill" looks like... and thinks that that means it has used the skill.

Even after a hole is poked in its use of the skill, and it realizes it made a mistake, that doesn't dissuade it from the belief that it has the given skill. Just like, even after I asked my partner about the show I recall us attending, and she told me that that was a show for a different (but similar) musician, I still thought I had gone to the show.

It took me exhausting all possibilities for times I could have seen this musician before, to get me to even hypothesize that maybe I hadn't.

And it would likely take similarly exhaustive disproof (over hundreds of exchanges) to get an LLM to truly "internalize" that it doesn't actually have a skill it believed itself to have, and so stop trying to use it. (If that meta-skill is even a thing that LLMs have ever learned from their training data — which I doubt. And even if they did, you'd be wasting 90% of a Transformer's context window on this. Maybe something that's worth keeping in mind if we ever switch back to basing our LLMs on RNNs with true runtime weight updates, though!)

giantg2 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I find the summaries to be helpful. However, I find some of the detailed points to lack a deep understanding of technical points and their importance.

rolisz 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And then they skip to another job for more money, and you start again with a new hire.

Avicebron 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Thankfully after many generations of human interactions and complex analysis of group dynamics, we've found a solution. It's called 'don't be an asshole' and 'pay people competitively'.

edit: because people are stupid, 'competitively' in this sense isn't some theoretical number pulled from an average, it's 'does this person feel better off financially working with you than others around them who don't work with you, and is is this person meeting their own personal financial goals through working with you'?

binary132 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The elephant in this particular room is that there are a tiny handful of employers that have so much money that they can and do just pay whatever amount is more than any of their competitors can possibly afford.

giantg2 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That shouldn't be a big deal since they're a finite portion of the market. You should have a robust enough model to handle people leaving, including unavoidable scenarios like retirement and death.

thfuran 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The common corporate policy of making it harder to give raises than to increase starting salaries for new hires is insane.

SOLAR_FIELDS 22 minutes ago | parent [-]

Is it insane? Makes perfect sense. Employee has way less leverage at raise time. It’s all about leverage. It sucks, but that is the reality

wiseowise 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

They do have a point. Why waste a time on person who will always need more money over time, rather than invest in AI? Not only you don’t need to please every hire, your seniors will be more thankful too, because they will get linearly faster with time.

smsm42 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Outside of working for Antropic etc., there's no way you can make an LLM better at anything. You can train a junior though.

victorbjorklund 3 hours ago | parent [-]

You can def provide better context etc.

faangguyindia 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The person paying and the one responsible for coaching others usually aren't same

giantg2 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

That's not a bad thing. It means you've added one more senior to the societal pool. A lot of the talent problems today are due to companies not wanting to train and focusing on cheap shortcut options like outsourcing or H1B

mensetmanusman 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The AI in this example is 1/100 the cost.

gnerd00 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

that is absolutely false - the capital and resources used to create these things are societal scale. An individual consumer is not paying that cost at this time.

victorbjorklund 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

You can make the same argument about humans. The employeer doesnt pay the full cost and time to create the worker from an embryo to a senior dev.

devmor 16 minutes ago | parent [-]

Unless you are advocating for executing developers when they are no longer capable of working, that’s a bit of a non sequitur.

Humans aren’t tools.

mensetmanusman 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

That only proves the point. If something increases the value of someone’s time by 5% and 500,000,000 people are affected by it, the cost will collapse.

These models are only going to get better and cheaper per watt.

devmor 14 minutes ago | parent [-]

> These models are only going to get better and cheaper per watt.

What do you base this claim on? They have only gotten exponentially more expensive for decreasing gain so far - quite the opposite of what you say.

cratermoon 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

For now, not including externalities.

nicce 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Really does not sound like that from your description. It sounds like coaching a noob, which is a lot of work in itself.

Even if you do it by yourself, you need to do the same thinking and iterative process by yourself. You just get the code almost instantly and mostly correctly, if you are good at defining the initial specification.

fsloth 6 hours ago | parent [-]

This. You _have_ to write the spec. The result is that instead of spending X units of time on spec and THEN y units of time on coding, you get the whole thing in x units of time AND you have a spec.

The trick is knowning where the particular LLM sucks. I expect in a short amount of time there is no productivity gain but when you start to understand the limitations and strengths - holey moley.

skydhash 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> The result is that instead of spending X units of time on spec and THEN y units of time on coding, you get the whole thing in x units of time AND you have a spec.

It's more like x units of time thinking and y units of times coding, whereas I see people spend x/2 thinking, x typing the specs, y correcting the specs, and y giving up and correcting the code.

fsloth 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Sure! That's inefficient. I know just how I work and I've been writing the type of programs I do for quite many years. And I know what would take me normally a week takes me few days at best.

smsm42 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Unless you realize no LLM is good at what you need and you just wasted weeks of time walking in circles.

athrowaway3z 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Wasn’t there a study that said that using LLMs makes people feel more productive while they actually are not?

On a tangent; that study is brought up a lot. There are some issues with it, but I agree with the main takeaway to be weary of the feeling of productivity vs actual productivity.

But most of the time its brought up by AI skeptics, that conveniently gloss over the fact it's about averages.

Which, while organizationally interesting, is far less interesting than to discover what is and isn't currently possible at the tail end by the most skillful users.

sarchertech an hour ago | parent | next [-]

The key insight from the study is that even the users that did see an increase in productivity overestimated that increase.

Taken along with the dozens of other studies that show that humans are terrible at estimating how long it will take them to complete task, you should be very skeptical when someone says an LLM makes them x% more productive.

There’s no reason to think that the most skillful LLM users are not overestimating productivity benefits as well.

oceanplexian 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Engineers have always been terrible at measuring productivity. Building a new internal tool or writing a bunch of code is not necessarily productive.

Productivity is something that creates business value. In that sense an engineer who writes 10 lines of code but that code solves a $10M business problem or allows the company to sign 100 new customers may be the most productive engineer in your organization.

kaydub 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Not to mention the study doesn't really show a lack of productivity and they include some key caveats in it outlining how they think productivity increases using LLMs

lumost 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Anecdotally, on green field projects where you are exploring a new domain - it’s an insanely productive experience. On mundane day to day tasks it probably takes more time, but feels like less mental bandwidth.

Coding at full throttle is a very intensive task that requires deep focus. There are many days that I simply don’t have that in me.

tarsinge 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Sure it’s a lot of work, but the noob in question has all the internet knowledge and can write multiples times faster than a human for a fraction of the costs. This is not about an individual being more productive, this is about business costs. Long term we should still hire and train juniors obviously, but short term there is lot of pressure to not do it as it makes no sense financially. Study or not the reality is there is not much difference in productivity between a senior with a cursor license and a senior and a junior that needs heavy guidance.

skydhash 5 hours ago | parent [-]

Code is a liability. You always want less of it. Typing faster does not particularly help. Unless the tool is verbose, then you fix the tool.

ludicrousdispla 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

LLMs make two people more productive, the person that uses the LLM, and then the person that cleans up the mess.

ants_everywhere 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There was one study that said that in a specific setting and was amplified heavily on forums by anti-AI people.

There have been many more studies showing productivity gains across a variety of tasks that preceded that one.

That study wasn't necessarily wrong about the specific methodology they had for onboarding people to use AI. But if I remember correctly it was funded by an organization that was slightly skeptical of AI.

kaydub 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

If anyone actually reads the study they'll see that even the authors of that study admit LLMs will increase productivity and there's a lot more to come.

mrits 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't understand why anyone would believe a study on anything AI at this point. I don't believe anyone can quantify software development productivity much less measure the impact from AI

JohnMakin 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

which studies show this?

simonw 5 hours ago | parent [-]

Here are some from the last few months:

AI coding assistant trial: UK public sector findings report: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/ai-coding-assista... - UK government. "GDS ran a trial of AI coding assistants (AICAs) across government from November 2024 to February 2025. [...] Trial participants saved an average of 56 minutes a working day when using AICAs"

Human + AI in Accounting: Early Evidence from the Field: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=5240924 - "We document significant productivity gains among AI adopters, including a 55% increase in weekly client support and a reallocation of approximately 8.5% of accountant time from routine data entry toward high-value tasks such as business communication and quality assurance."

OECD: The effects of generative AI on productivity, innovation and entrepreneurship: https://www.oecd.org/en/publications/the-effects-of-generati... - "Generative AI has proven particularly effective in automating tasks that are well-defined and have clear objectives, notably including some writing and coding tasks. It can also play a critical role for skill development and business model transformation, where it can serve as a catalyst for personalised learning and organisational efficiency gains, respectively [...] However, these potential gains are not without challenges. Trust in AI-generated outputs and a deep understanding of its limitations are crucial to leverage the potential of the technology. The reviewed experiments highlight the ongoing need for human expertise and oversight to ensure that generative AI remains a valuable tool in creative, operational and technical processes rather than a substitute for authentic human creativity and knowledge, especially in the longer term.".

dns_snek 3 hours ago | parent [-]

That was a treat to explore. All of those are based on self-assessment surveys or toy problems. The UK report reads:

> On average, users reported time savings of 56 minutes per working day [...] It is also possible that survey respondents overestimated time saved due to optimism bias.

Yet in conclusion, this self-reported figure is stated as an independently observed fact. When people without ADHD take stimulants they also self-report increased productivity, higher accuracy, and faster task completion but all objective measurements are negatively affected.

The OECD paper supports their programming-related findings with the following gems:

- A study that measures productivity by the time needed to implement a "hello world" of HTTP servers [27]

- A study that measures productivity by the number of lines of code produced [28]

- A study co-authored by Microsoft that measures productivity of Microsoft employees using Microsoft Copilot by the number of pull requests they create. Then the code is reviewed by their Microsoft coworkers and the quality of those PRs is judged by the acceptance rate of those PRs. Unbelievably, the code quality doesn't only remain the same, it goes up! [30]

- An inspirational pro-AI paper co-authored by GitHub and Microsoft that's "shining a light on the importance of AI" aimed at "managers and policy-makers". [31]

simonw 19 minutes ago | parent [-]

Have you seen any studies on this topic that you find credible?

kaydub 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Everyone using that study to prove LLMs are bad hasn't actually read the study.

aljimbra 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

My buggy executive function frequently gets in the way of putting code to screen. You know how hacker news has that lil timeout setting to pseudo force you to disengage from it? AI made it so I don't need anything like that. It is digital Adderall.

pkilgore 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You aren't wrong in the coaching but, but feedback loops are orders of magnitude faster.

It takes an LLM 2-20 minutes to give me the next stage of output not 1-2 days (week?). As a result, I have higher context the entire time so my side of the iteration is maybe 10x faster too.

peteforde 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I am so tired of this style of "don't believe your lying eyes" conjecture.

I'm a career coder and I used LLMs primarily to rapidly produce code for domains that I don't have deep experience in. Instead of spending days or weeks getting up to speed on an SDK I might need once, I have a pair programmer that doesn't check their phone or need to pick up their kids at 4:30pm.

If you don't want to use LLMs, nobody is forcing you. Burning energy trying to convince people to whom the benefits of LLMs are self-evident many times over that they are imagining things is insulting the intelligence of everyone in the conversation.

vlovich123 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Correct. In areas you yourself are a junior engineer, you’ll be more effective with an LLM at tackling that area maybe. It’s also surprisingly effective at executing refactors.

peteforde 2 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm not sure which one of us is ultimately more hung up on titles in this context, but I would push back and say that when someone with 30+ years experience tackling software problems delegates navigating the details of an API to an LLM, that is roughly the most "senior developer" moment of the day.

Conflating experience and instinct with knowing everything isn't just false equivalency, it's backwards.

vlovich123 30 minutes ago | parent [-]

I really don’t know what I said that was such an emotional trigger for you. All I said is that it’s an accelerant for you when you leave your domain. Like for example I’m a systems engineer. I hate coding UIs but with the LLM I can pump out a UI quickly and this was true both for web code and a GUI I built with dioxus. The UI code was also cleaner because I had some sense of how it should be structured and asked the AI to cleanup that structure. But ultimately it did most of the work in response to high level prompts and I picked and chose what to review line by line vs vibe coding.

That’s what I mean - by myself it would have taken me easily 10x longer if not worse because UI coding for me is a slog + there’s nuances about reactive coding + getting started is also a hurdle. The output of the code was still high quality because I knew when the LLM wasn’t making the choices I wanted it to make.

peteforde 3 minutes ago | parent [-]

I can tell you exactly: it's your framing of relying on an LLM (or any outside assistance, including humans) as temporarily becoming "junior".

I feel strongly that delegation to strengths is one of the most obvious signs of experience.

Apologies for getting hung up on what might seem like trivial details, but when discussing on a text forum, word choices matter.

sndisjh 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> used LLMs primarily to rapidly produce code for domains that I don't have deep experience in

You’re either trusting the LLM or you still have to pay the cost of getting the experience you don’t have. So in either case you’re not going too much faster - the formers cost not being apparent until it’s much more expensive later on.

Edit: assuming you don’t struggle with typing speed, basic syntax, APIs etc. These are not significant cost reductions for experts, though they are for juniors.

3 hours ago | parent [-]
[deleted]
kaydub 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> If you don't want to use LLMs, nobody is forcing you. Burning energy trying to convince people to whom the benefits of LLMs are self-evident many times over that they are imagining things is insulting the intelligence of everyone in the conversation.

Hey man, I don't bother trying to convince them because it's just going to increase my job security.

Refusing to use LLMs or thinking they're bad is just FUD and it's the same as people that prefer to use nano/vim over an IDE or it's the same as people that say "hur dur cloud is just somebody else's computer"

It's best to ignore and just leave them in the dust.

micromacrofoot 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

It's this, but 1000 times faster — that's the difference. It's sending a noob away to follow your exact instructions and getting results back in 10 seconds instead of 10 hours.

I don't have to worry about managing the noob's emotions or their availability, I can tell the LLM to try 3 different approaches and it only takes a few minutes... I can get mad at it and say "fuck it I'll do this part myself", the LLM doesn't have to be reminded of our workflow or formatting (I just tell the LLM once)

I can tell it that I see a code smell and it will usually have an idea of what I'm talking about and attempt to correct, little explanation needed

The LLM can also: do tons of research in a short amount of time, traverse the codebase and answer questions for me, etc

it's a noob savant

It's no replacement for a competent person, but it's a very useful assistant