A lot of people keep looking for technology solutions to political problems. The fact is that privacy, especially of financial transactions, is becoming illegal. Any technology that allows you to send or spend money anonymously will be attacked by our governments. They won't be allowed.

You can argue about whether you can get away with it due to difficulty of enforcement, but all that does is turn us all into criminals. They won't put ALL of in jail, but they can put ANY of us in jail - the ones they don't like.

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ddtaylor 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

> The fact is that privacy, especially of financial transactions, is becoming illegal. Any technology that allows you to send or spend money anonymously will be attacked by our governments. They won't be allowed.

It's probably a bit worse than that. It's not specific to transactions or spending.

Eventually any IP talking to another IP without the mandatory metadata to link it to a physical identity will be illegal.

Right now there is a hodge-podge of solutions that piggy-back on the phone networks, wires, etc. that used to give LEO enough actionable information to track some criminals. But most of that has been obsoleted by modern cryptography.

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vkou 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

> But most of that has been obsoleted by modern cryptography.

Except that people are people, and people make mistakes, and it doesn't take a lot of mistakes to fail in your opsec, and then your whole plot unravels.

	▲	ddtaylor a day ago \| parent [-]
		Criminals are going to get caught all the time, some even want to get caught. The window of opportunity for network forensics to be an important role in that has been closing and continues to as cryptography and technology advances at a blazing speed.

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ozgrakkurt 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Don’t understand this pessimism. There are a large number of countries in the world. You can migrate out of a country if they start doing insane things like this.

I would consider leaving UK very seriously if I was building a life there now, as an example.

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StanislavPetrov 4 days ago | parent [-]

>Don’t understand this pessimism. There are a large number of countries in the world. You can migrate out of a country if they start doing insane things like this.

Unfortunately in 2025 it is a race to the bottom. While some countries (such as the UK) are sinking faster than others, there isn't a single country I can think of that is moving in the right direction when it comes to privacy, free speech and civil liberties.

	▲	ddtaylor 3 days ago \| parent [-]
		It's not a game they are interested in playing. As someone who knows enough about how much CISCO equipment is purchased around the globe for DPI and privacy invasion as a government business is booming.

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user34283 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Spot on.

Some think we need financial freedom, but in reality it's the freedom to fund scams and malware, launder money, dodge taxes, and buy stuff that’s illegal.

That won't become legal just because you use "Monero" or whatever. Obviously we can't have privacy for financial transactions.

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rocqua 4 days ago | parent [-]

You forgot a few things on that list that people would like freedom for:

advocating for (or against) trans rights, protesting against the deportation of migrants, advocate against gun-control, and donating to (anti) palestinian causes

Are just a few things that people would like the freedom to do.

The point being, financial privacy is an important part of having a functioning democracy. But at the same time, financial control and limits are also an important part of a functioning democracy, for e.g. the 'freedoms' you mention. In the end, neither perfect privacy, not perfect surveilance are what we need. The best solution will be somewhere in the middle, with nuance.

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user34283 4 days ago | parent [-]

> financial privacy is an important part of having a functioning democracy

No, I don't think it is. Perhaps privacy for speech and voting are.

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Ylpertnodi 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

>> financial privacy is an important part of having a functioning democracy

>No, I don't think it is. Perhaps privacy for speech and voting are.

Cash works for financial privacy, and functioning democracies.

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realo 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Heinous speech is allowed in the USA but is totally illegal in Canada.

I live in Canada. Anonymous heinous speech? No thank you. Go away.

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doganugurlu 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

How is privacy for voting different than privacy for funding the candidate?

	▲	vkou 4 days ago \| parent [-]
		One man one vote is a little different from one dollar one word, or one dollar one vote. In most civilized countries you have privacy in the voting booth (because without it, buying votes becomes trivial), but no privacy in financing campaigns. Some of those countries even have rules about when campaigns can and cannot run, because there are benefits to living in a society that's not actively bombarded by polarizing political screeching 24/7. It does some to cut down the influence of dollars in politics. I guess it makes people in the advertising business, and people looking to buy political influence very unhappy.

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ozgrakkurt 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This is a very narrow way to see it. Technological advancements can and did massively affect politics and other parts of life.

Today you get away with it, they make it harder but it would still be better than the old one.

People manage to corrupt and hack things inevitably as long as it is static, changing systems can obviously be good just for this reason only. It also brings questions about why the current system is the way it is.

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j2kun 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Except, you know, the dollar bills the government itself prints.

	▲	Nifty3929 3 days ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Yes! But also this is why governments (including in the US) are trying to discourage the use of cash, and make it less convenient.
	▲	giveita 4 days ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		To some extent. Not dragnettable but certainly not perfectly anonymous.