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terribleperson 5 days ago

I'm suspended on reddit for, as best as I can tell, posting a DFhack bug fix script. For the uninitiated, this is a bug fix script for a program commonly used in Dwarf Fortress moderating, not anything illicit.

If this kind of low-quality AI moderation is the future, I'm not sure if these major platforms will even remain usable.

floundy 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

That's hilarious given that Reddit is utterly overrun with blatant, low-quality LLM accounts using ChatGPT to post comments and gain karma, and several of the "text stories" on the front page from subs like AITA are blatant AI slop that the users (or other bots?) are eating up.

I suspect sites like Reddit don't care about a few% false positive rate, without considering in context that bot farmers literally do not care, they'll make another free account, but genuine users will have their attitude towards the site turn significantly negative when they're falsely actioned.

Don't worry, Reddit's day of reckoning comes when the advertisers figure out what percent of Reddit's traffic that they're paying to serve ads to are just bots.

trod1234 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

Its not just Reddit, this is happening on all networked platforms. FB, X, HN, Reddit, they are all in the exact same boat, and some are quite worse than Reddit.

This is surreptitious jamming of communications at levels that constitute and exceed thresholds for consideration as irregular warfare.

Genuine users no longer matter, only the user counts which are programmatically driven to distort reflected appraisal. The users are repressed and demoralized because of such false actions, and the platform has no solution because regulation failed to act at a time they could have changed these outcomes.

What comes later will simply be comparable to why "triage" is done on the battlefield.

Adtech is just a gloriously indirect means for money laundering in fiat money-printing environments. Credit/Debt being offers, when it is unbacked without proper reserve is money-printing.

terribleperson 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't know if the day of reckoning will be anytime soon. I think a lot of major advertising firms are aware that they're mostly serving to bots, but if they tell their customers that, they don't get paid.

edit: This has definitely soured my already poor opinion of reddit. I mostly post there about video games, or to help people in /r/buildapc or /r/askculinary. I think I'd rather help people somewhere I'm not going to get blackholed because an AI misinterpreted my comments.

viccis 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>That's hilarious given that Reddit is utterly overrun with blatant, low-quality LLM accounts using ChatGPT to post comments and gain karma, and several of the "text stories" on the front page from subs like AITA are blatant AI slop that the users (or other bots?) are eating up.

Check out this post [1] in which the post includes part of the LLM response ("This kind of story involves classic AITA themes: family drama, boundary-setting, and a “big event” setting, which typically generates a lot of engagement and differing opinions.") and almost no commenter points this out. Hilarious if it weren't so bleak.

1: https://www.rareddit.com/r/AITAH/comments/1ft3bt6/aita_for_n... (using rareddit because it was eventually deleted)

threeducks 5 days ago | parent [-]

Over the past two years, I have also seen many similar stories where the majority of users were unable to recognize that these stories were AI-generated. I fear for the future of democracy if the masses are so easily deceived. Does anyone have any good ideas on how to counteract this?

utyop22 5 days ago | parent [-]

Literacy rates have been falling off a cliff for decades.

If theres no literacy, there is no critical thinking.

The only solution is to deliver high quality education to all folks and create engaging environments for it to be delivered.

Ultimately it comes down to influencing folks to think deeper about whats going on around them.

Most of the people between the age of 13-30ish right now are kinda screwed and pretty much a write off imo.

heavyset_go 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

> Don't worry, Reddit's day of reckoning comes when the advertisers figure out what percent of Reddit's traffic that they're paying to serve ads to are just bots.

No it won't, we'll all have to upload our IDs and videos of our faces just to register or use Reddit or any social media. They will know who is a real monetizable user or not.

kbaker 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Lol. I got perma-banned for violating rules under my alt accounts.

But I don't have any alt accounts...??? Appeal process is a joke. I just opted to delete my 12 year old account instead and have stopped going there.

Oh well, probably time for them to go under and be reborn anyways. The default subs and front page has been garbage for some time.

randycupertino 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

I'm permanently banned from Reddit for calling a "power mod" of SF Bay Area a nimby when he was complaining about increased traffic in his neighborhood and that they had to put a stop sign up at a major intersection.

They IP and hardward device banned me, it's crazy! Any appeal auto-rejected and can't make new accounts.

cmxch 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

This is where someone does need to buy up Reddit to clean that out.

terribleperson 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

...is nimby a dirty word now or something?

lazide 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

Any word can be a dirty word when someone who is definitely that thing is insecure about being that thing. Bonus points - those kind of people tend to love going around calling other people that thing too.

llbbdd 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Always has been

mnky9800n 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

i deleted my reddit account because the feed is organized for you. It is entirely possible that reddit will organize a feed designed to make you come to a certain conclusion across viewing a number of posts. And whether this is done purposefully by some bad actor or it is done because some algorithm latches on to a particular theme, it doesn't matter. I prefer that things be voted directly without interference, which I assume is how hacker news works.

The other thing is that it is simply a complete waste of time. Commenting on pop culture or news or whatever, when I could be reading books, working on projects, or otherwise interacting with people in the real world is better. We don't have so much time on Earth, I am not sure I want to keep spending so much of it in cyberspace.

https://sustainableviews.substack.com/p/the-day-i-kissed-com...

giancarlostoro 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

If you appeal every so often I've heard it works, but its even dumber.

immibis 4 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Reddit has been garbage since the effective private equity takeover.

I'm not sure if they actually got taken over by private equity, but they acted like it since about a year before the third-party app tantrum.

busymom0 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Meanwhile the "new" Digg reboot plans on using AI moderators too...

terribleperson 5 days ago | parent [-]

The thing that annoys me is that I could see value in AI moderation. Instead of scanning every post with AI with overly-broad criteria (and probably lower-power models), use AI to prescreen reports and determine whether they're worth surfacing to a human. IT could also be used to put temporary holds on material that's potentially criminal or just way over the line, but those holds should go to the very front of the human review queue to either be lifted or the content deleted.

Real moderation actions should not be taken without human input and should always be appealable, even if the appeal is just another mod looking at it to see if they agree.

trod1234 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

I'm banned from a few subreddits for correctly pointing out that ricing is not a pejorative, and the history of the culture that led to extreme customization.

You have malevolent third-party bots taking advantage of poor moderation to conflate similar/same word different context pairs to silence communication.

For example, the reddit AI bots considers "ricing" to be the same as "rice boy". The latter definitely is pejorative, but the former is not.

Just wild and absolutely crazy-making that this is even allowed, since communication is the primary means to inflict compulsion and torture these days.

Intolerable acts without due process or a rule of law lead to only one possible outcome. Coercion isn't new, but the stupid people are trying their hand for another bite at the apple.

The major platforms will not remain usable because eventually you get this hollowing out of meaning, and this behavior will either drive away all your rational intelligent contributors, or lead to accelerated failures such as evaporative cooling in the social networks. People use things because they provide some amount of value. When that stops being the case, the value disappears not overnight, but within a few months.

Just take a look at the linuxquestions subreddit since the mod exodus. They have a automated trickle of the same questions that don't really get sufficiently answered. Its all slop.

All the experienced people who previously shared their knowledge as charity have moved on because they were driven out by caustic harassment and lack of proper moderation to prevent that. The mod list even hides who the mods are now so people who have had moderated action can't appeal to the Reddit Administrators with the specific moderator who did something as a fascist dictator incapable of basic reading level comprehension common to grade schoolers (AI).

noah_buddy 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

I thought you were going to point out distinct etymology, but these terms do seem linked, no? Not surprising that the shared lineage confers shared problems.

navane 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

I had to Google it, but apparently it comes from cars, where a riced car has stripes and spoilers and such to make it look like a race car.

One source claimed rice was race inspired custum e-forgot, the other did claim a link with asian street racing.

brnaftr361 4 days ago | parent [-]

I expect that r.i.c.e. was overfit. Asian imports are called riceburners, ostensibly because asian cultures consume a lot of rice. I guess it could be contrived as racist, but it's relatively harmless in the scope of things...

I'm speculating further: but the imports were cheap and had a thriving aftermarket of bolt-on parts e.g. body and turbo kits. The low barrier of entry afforded opportunities for anybody to play. Ricing was probably a perjorative issued by domestic enthusiasts that was adopted ironically by Asian import enthusiasts. If you can imagine there was a lot of diversity, people who would bolt up body kits to clapped out Civics to people that would push 700hp with extensively tuned cars with no adornments. I think in particular ricing was the more aesthetically motivated of the crowd.

This was later adopted by computer enthusiasts that like to add embelishments to their desktops, things like rainmeter/rocketdock and Windows/Linux skins and etc...

trod1234 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

The two are unconnected, one is used as a pejorative which is racist, the other isn't. This is not a hard distinction to make if you aren't a bot.

<Victim> "I'm ricing my Linux Shell, check it out." <Bot> That's Racist!

<Bot Brigade> Moderator this person is violating your rules and being racist!

<Moderator> I'm just using AI to determine this. <Bot Brigade> Great! Now they can't contribute. Lets find another.

TL;DR Words have specific meanings, and a growing number of words have been corrupted purposefully to prevent communication, and by extension limit communication to the detriment of all. You get the same ultimate outcomes when people do this as any other false claim. Abuses pile up until eventually in the absence of functioning non-violent conflict resolution; violence forces the system to reform.

Have you noticed that your implication is circular based on the indefinite assumption (foregone conclusion) that the two are linked (tightly coupled)?

You use a lot of ambiguous manipulative language and structure. Doing that makes any reasonable person think you are either a bot, or a malicious actor.

bitwize 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Per the Linux Foundation it is inappropriate to speak of programs as "hung" due to the political and social history associated with hanging. What makes you think "ricing" would be considered acceptable language in today's context?

ants_everywhere 5 days ago | parent | next [-]

huh, the past tense of the violent "hang" is "hanged" not "hung". https://www.thefreedictionary.com/hung

"hung" means to "suspend", so the process is suspended

ChrisMarshallNY 5 days ago | parent [-]

It also means … ahem … a well-endowed gentleman.

I’m not sure that AI would necessarily make that mistake, but a semilterate mod, very much could.

I think the real issue is the absolute impossibility of appeal. This is a big problem, for outfits like Google or Microsoft, where stories of businesses being shut down for false positive bans are fairly common.

In my experience, on the other hand, Apple has always been responsive to appeal. I have released a lot of apps, and have had fairly frequent rejections. The process is annoying, because they seldom tell you exactly what caused the rejection, but I usually figure it out, after one or two exchanges. They are almost always word-choice issues, but not bad words. Rather, they don’t like stuff that can step on their brands.

I once had an app rejected, because it had the word “Finder” in its name (it was an app for finding things).

The annoying thing, was that the first rejection said it was because it was a simple re-skinning of a Web site. I’m positive that what happened, was that a human assessor accidentally tapped the wrong button on their dashboard.

blibble 5 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't remember voting the Linux Foundation into power as global word police

trod1234 5 days ago | parent [-]

I also don't remember voting to allow doublespeak to be the dominant form of definition.

wkat4242 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

The Linux Foundation is a bunch of business suits trying to tell the grassroots FOSS community to follow corporate interests. I don't take them seriously.

Just look at their list of directors. It's the fortune 500 right there.