| ▲ | petcat a day ago |
| This should also indicate which EUDI wallets will require Google or Apple device attestation. My guess is all of them. For all the talk about digital sovereignty, EU still builds the fundamental element of EU citizenship, the digital ID, on American companies. Baffling. |
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| ▲ | ktosobcy a day ago | parent | next [-] |
| Hmm... AFAIR Duch one (https://github.com/MinBZK/nl-wallet/) will not force it and they are actively working on handling it. What's more - you won't be limited to using your national wallet - you would be able to use whichever implementation works for you (so, for example Duch one). Alas: yes, UE should push harder to avoid google/apple :/ |
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| ▲ | mdp2021 a day ago | parent | next [-] | | But it was a problem that peered from long ago, it was implicit in the plans (cpr. the "digital euro"), and if you do not secure what you need for your plans doubts are legitimately cast about you. Edit: sorry, there is a possibility there is a case of bad communication. A comment nearby (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50486125) mentions the open specs could allow for the non-requirement of Google, Apple and the likes. I may have leant on thinking that the situation could be similar to that of age verification - for which the EU built open software for ZKP, but it is said to require Google or Apple or the likes. | |
| ▲ | preisschild a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | > more - you won't be limited to using your national wallet - you would be able to use whichever implementation works for you Unfortunately not true. You can verify other nations IDs but you can only bind your ID to the eID wallet of the nation you are a citizen of. |
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| ▲ | owisd a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Looks like it's an open spec so can create a wallet for any OS https://eudi.dev/latest/main/ |
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| ▲ | petcat a day ago | parent | next [-] | | I doubt that will ever matter. There are niche alternatives to lots of American tech. But that isn't what the "digital sovereignty" push is about. It's about not building fundamental services on American Big Tech in the first place. But it's obvious that nobody really cares about it after all. For instance, Germany's own official EUDI wallet for Android explicitly requires Google Play Integrity https://bmi.usercontent.opencode.de/eudi-wallet/wallet-devel... | | |
| ▲ | ActionAmmonia a day ago | parent | next [-] | | You are linking to version 0.14.0 of the documentation. The latest version is 0.19.0. The release notes of 0.15.0 mention that they dropped the Play Integrity dependency | | | |
| ▲ | danaris a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > But it's obvious that nobody really cares about it after all. That's not remotely obvious. The push for digital sovereignty is only a few months old. Governments work on timescales of years—or even decades. It's certainly true that it would be good if they could be a bit more responsive, particularly in this fast-paced digital age. But demanding them to be doing that already, today, is just not living in the real world. | |
| ▲ | noelnh a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Okay scratch my doubtfulness from the other comment, of course you're right what was I even thinking. Man I really hate that. | | |
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| ▲ | preisschild a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Its an open spefication but the identity issuers (your country) locks it down so only their own wallet can be used for their countries ID | |
| ▲ | functionmouse a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Does one exist which does not require integration with Apple, Google, or Microsoft services? |
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| ▲ | Semaphor a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The German teams AMA said it doesn't. Though for legal reasons it'll need to be certified for every OS. |
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| ▲ | InsidiousWombat a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Polish one already have app that de facto works as ID and uses independent authentication than Google's/Apples (using either banks or govt site for it) |
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| ▲ | signatoremo a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Any talks about physical sovereignty? Why do EU let its auto industry struggle against Chinese EVs? What about electronic products? Why can Europe wean off foreign energy such as from US or Middle East or Russia? |
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| ▲ | swiftcoder a day ago | parent | next [-] | | > Why do EU let its auto industry struggle against Chinese EVs? What about electronic products? Why can Europe wean off foreign energy such as from US or Middle East or Russia? Your two goals are fundamentally at odds with each other: cheap Chinese solar panels and EVs are the only realistic route to energy independence. That many of the EU car manufacturers bet hard against the EV transition, is pretty much a bed of their own making. | |
| ▲ | InsidiousWombat a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | EU car industry languished in safety too long, focusing on how to bump the price of cars up and up while having them less and less reliable. It can't survive honest competition, let alone one that also benefits from lower costs | | |
| ▲ | moi2388 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | You are saying the Chinese EVs which came into being by corporate espionage and which are government subsidised to exactly destroy EU car production is honest competition? |
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| ▲ | preisschild a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Why should people be forced to only choose from a limited amount of suppliers? | |
| ▲ | eternauta3k a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Why should China buy our chips / other 1000 exports if we refuse to buy their cars? | | |
| ▲ | oblio a day ago | parent [-] | | I have bad news for you, China doesn't import much these days, except for raw resources. |
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| ▲ | spwa4 a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Any talks about physical sovereignty? You mean about the 3.5 wars Europe is directly involved in? Up from 2 three years ago. Ukraine - Russia Russia - Black Sea EU member states (esp. Bulgaria, but also Greece) Turkey - Greece Russia - Georgia (kind of) | | |
| ▲ | cicko 21 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | That way you can list pretty much any combination of countries around the world. | |
| ▲ | MonkeyClub 21 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Turkey - Greece How’s that a war? | | |
| ▲ | spwa4 11 hours ago | parent [-] | | See Cyprus. Plus there was a coast guard confrontation this year with shots fired. | | |
| ▲ | MonkeyClub 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | That’s a bit far from a hot war like Ukraine or Iran. Cyprus’ ongoing occupation since the 1974 invasion is, of course, another thing (habitually not raised in either the UN or the EU), though Cyprus is a sovereign state with Greece as only an inert guarantor nation. |
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| ▲ | noelnh a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| So your being baffled relies solely on your guess being correct? It kinda feels like a good idea to wait until we know for sure. I mean I wouldn't really be surprised if you were right, but I also want to give them the benefit of the doubt for now. |
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| ▲ | petcat a day ago | parent [-] | | I looked at the source code for Germany's Android EUDI wallet and confirmed my suspicion that it will require Google. So I have very little doubt about any of the others too. https://bmi.usercontent.opencode.de/eudi-wallet/wallet-devel... Edit: apparently the requirement was dropped in a later version | | |
| ▲ | pimeys a day ago | parent [-] | | Can we just say no I do not want to use the digital identification and continue our lives as before? | | |
| ▲ | ktosobcy a day ago | parent [-] | | You can... | | |
| ▲ | mdp2021 a day ago | parent [-] | | It will have to be seen. E.g. try to travel in some countries without carrying electronic payment systems. | | |
| ▲ | ktosobcy an hour ago | parent [-] | | Imagine trying to travel in some countries with electronic payment system ;) (I mean Germany for example :P) |
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| ▲ | s_dev a day ago | parent | prev [-] |
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