| ▲ | ComputerGuru a day ago |
| As this is a) being served in Search, b) supposed to be 2.5x faster than 3.8 Flash, c) the element with lowest atomic weight; I deduce that, despite being more capable than 3.8 Flash, now the “entry level” model set to replace 3.5 Flash Lite. But it is priced the same as the non-discounted 3.8 Flash, considerably higher than what anyone is paying today for 3.8 Flash or 3.5 Flash Lite or the deprecated 3.0/2.x Gemini models. How does this work? Is Google abandoning the “fast and cheap” tier? That seems like a mistake since plenty of workflows are absolutely price inelastic, meaning when the 3.8 Flash discount ends at EOY, lots of current enterprise Gemini customers would have to take their business to another shop?? |
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| ▲ | pqdbr a day ago | parent | next [-] |
| Same impression here. If this is Google's strategy we'll have to migrate to Luna, because costs are already high for our workload on 3.8 Flash (which in itself was already a 40% increase compared to 3.7 flash due to being more verbose and thinking more) and this now doubles cost once again. |
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| ▲ | ComputerGuru a day ago | parent | next [-] | | Yeah, and they rug-pulled 3.7 very quickly, silently redirecting to 3.8 Flash. Raised our prices and broke some workflows. | | | |
| ▲ | amarcheschi a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Isn't something open weight cheaper (and probably better as well)? | | |
| ▲ | ComputerGuru a day ago | parent [-] | | Depends on your needs. Gemini Flash has best bang for your buck on visual tasks and best multilingual support/intelligence for non-Western/non-East-Asian languages; better than paid or OSS alternatives. | | |
| ▲ | amarcheschi a day ago | parent [-] | | Yes I gave for granted textual tasks but they're not the only ones. If I remember correctly, mistral large should be good as well on image tasks while being cheap(er). I never had to do anything with less common languages tho |
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| ▲ | NooneAtAll5 15 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | why not to migrate to deepseek instead? |
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| ▲ | wasabi991011 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| According to Artificial Analysis, it's much cheaper per task than 3.8 flash, 3$ for H xhigh vs 6-7$ for 3.8 medium-high. I don't understand how though, since AA says it has more output tokens per task. |
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| ▲ | declanjackson a day ago | parent [-] | | Hi there - AA employee here. This is due to 3.8 Flash having a much lower cache hit rate compared to Gemini 4 Hydrogen | | |
| ▲ | gruez a day ago | parent | next [-] | | Why would cache rates differ? Does hydrogen have a longer cache period? | |
| ▲ | nightshift1 a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | sorry if this is a dumb question, but how is this possible? what can cause the cache hit rate to change just by changing the model? | | |
| ▲ | declanjackson a day ago | parent | next [-] | | This is based on what we measure from the API - we see different endpoints depending on how they are served can have different cache hit rates (cache hit rate is defined as the % of cacheable tokens that actually come back as cache hits) | |
| ▲ | scott_weber 20 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | One possibility (just a guess): new arch produces a more compact cache, it becomes cost effective to hold more cache for longer. |
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| ▲ | netrem a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| In the Gemini app it's replaced Flash. Lite is still there. |
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| ▲ | irthomasthomas a day ago | parent [-] | | But that's an old model, and if they replace it they have no smaller element to use for it's name. I guess it would have to be Hydrogen Light. | | |
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| ▲ | a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| [deleted] |
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| ▲ | iamdelirium a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The fact that there is still a flash lite dropdown in Gemini points to them keeping the flash lite model family. |
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| ▲ | p_l a day ago | parent | next [-] | | Isn't Flash-lite or related model the one used for AI summary in Google Search? | |
| ▲ | irthomasthomas a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | So all models will be named after elements except Flash Light? Or maybe the next version will be named Hydrogen Light? | | |
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| ▲ | deaux a day ago | parent | prev [-] |
| > considerably higher than what anyone is paying today for 3.8 Flash or 3.5 Flash Lite or the deprecated 3.0/2.x Gemini models It's cheaper than the last Pro models. |
