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▲ mentos 2 hours ago

I’m just a layman but this feels like a big discovery on par with attention is all you need. For an LLM to have such incredible intuition of weights feels very emergent and unanticipated?

▲huijzer 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I’m very much surprised but also not. I recently gave Astra a 3D model file and asked Astra to build a viewer for it, and it figured out the data structures in no time. What I mean to say is that AI is insanely good at things that we humans would never do since the work would be too monotonous.

I wouldn’t mind if AI progress would stop right here and now, but I fear it will continue, and increase inequality in society which is contrary to what the CEOs say (as usual).

▲dghlsakjg 44 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

I think the latest round of models is about to do to CAD the same thing that has been happening to development. I don't know if CAD designers have picked up on this. What happened to dev is probably going to happen to CAD designers soon. I've been having Opus 5.5 design parametric openscad models, and it can do some rather amazing work.

▲curt15 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Was Astra able to disclose its methodology for analyzing the data structures?

▲juleiie 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Too much inequality in society is a mortal danger to 1%.

That’s the beauty of the democratic capitalism system. If a government isn’t totalitarian, it naturally seeks to preserve stability thus having to elevate common people, lest they would cease to form a civilized group or simply vote away the politicians.

99% rule the 1% through elections.

There is no better system of checks and balances where opposite engines of greed vector sum to faster and faster abundance for everyone.

▲willguest 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

perfect playback! congratulations, you are a model citizen

▲TimTheTinker an hour ago | parent [-]

Is HN now against western capitalism? I'm confused...

That comment may have been overly preachy, tone deaf[0], and out of place, but it doesn't seem wrong, per se. Or am I missing something?

[0] e.g. elections themselves are so prone to manipulation (exhibit a: Dominion voting machines), previously trusted institutions now lack integrity, the insane power of well-funded NGO networks, etc.

▲mrandish 5 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> Is HN now against western capitalism?

I think that's a (very) vocal minority.

I think most of the HN community broadly realizes there is no perfect system, just different sets of trade offs, but understands history has shown generally democratic systems built on enlightenment values like uniform rule of law, respect for individual civil & property rights and free markets usually net better overall outcomes in the long-run - despite the fact they are still very far from perfect.

To paraphrase Winston Churchill, it's the worst system... except for all the others (which are even worse). :-)

▲hnhg 44 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I would guess it seems very naïve to the overly cynical. And in 2026, being overly cynical is rather mainstream (understandably so).

▲BatFastard 41 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

I fear western capitalism has lost its guide rails. We are seeing more and more centralization of wealth, along with unlimited election spending. Its a dark path.

▲ciefa 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I mean there are more than enough countries on earth kinda proving you wrong, no?

▲ciefa 2 hours ago | parent [-]

(This comment was written before your edit, so no longer valid! :D)

▲brador an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

They’ll just start bopping the 99% out the picture until the 1% is 51%.

▲vineyardmike 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This does feel big, but the trillion-dollar question: is this trained by OpenAI and can other LLMs do it.

It’s no secret that these big labs see “recursive self improvement” as a primary goal. It seems natural that the models would be explicitly trained to excel at all sorts of ML related tasks as a result. Is this one of those tasks, or is this emergent?

▲jrflo an hour ago | parent | next [-]

This seems emergent to me. LLMs are not trained directly on how to read weights, because humans do not understand raw weights, so there is no training data. They're trained on how to use the tools we have like writing python, examining training output and iterating, not writing whole weights from scratch.

▲yorwba an hour ago | parent | next [-]

In cases where Astra succeeded, it succeeded using standard techniques also used by humans when they read and write neural network weights. It's a rare skill, mostly used for fun (e.g. https://blog.janestreet.com/can-you-reverse-engineer-our-neu... ) and basic research rather than profit, but Astra is big enough to have learned many rare skills.

▲throwaway219450 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In a self-supervised setting you don't need ground truth data, as long as you have a proxy task that you can train on which forces the model to learn something useful. Like cutting out bits of images and telling the model to reconstruct the gaps (i.e. MAEs).

There are also techniques to watermark model weights to confirm what training data were used: https://arxiv.org/html/2512.17075 I'm not an expert in this domain, but it seems like there are lots of pieces that could be used to (a) train a model to infer whether some data were trained on and (b) train a model to understand which weights are relevant for a particular training task in a more explainable way than backprop/gradient descent.

▲paxy an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Humans don’t need to understand the data for models to train on it.

A large enough number of examples of “here are the model weights -> here’s what it does” will achieve this.

▲adamsb6 an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

There is a body of research on mechanistic interpretatibility that probably helped inform this behavior.

▲user43928 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I tried it in the Claude web version with Opus 5.5 Medium and it also identified Breakout, even though in one of its explanations it seems to have mixed up some indexes, but the overall reading of the weights was right.

That's also matching what I see when I work with Opus 5.5 to optimize models. It seems to understand what individual layers are for, and can thus sometimes suggest optimizations, where I as a layman would be completely clueless.

The latest models are performing amazingly. Because of this, I disagree with popular comments saying that eg. DeepSeek is good enough, AI-assisted development was where the real value was at, etc.

We see huge progress at the frontier, while the open competition is around GPT-5.5's level, and that model was released in April. Let's see how things develop in the future.

▲caaqil 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> It seems natural that the models would be explicitly trained to excel at all sorts of ML related tasks as a result. Is this one of those tasks, or is this emergent?

Maybe there's some general capability, call it g, that can explain all the underlying capabilities and improvements, including on ML tasks? Huh, I am getting a bit of déjà vu here.

▲swiftcoder 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This is just the model editing weights in the same way humans do when we jailbreak/ablate models. The method isn't novel, the interesting bit is that Astra will do it at all (I'd expect some safeguards in this area around jailbreaks)

▲dnautics 39 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Was it "intuited" or empirical?

▲objektif 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

How is it even possible though I can’t think of any reason why they would have the intuition.

▲swader999 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Could it be already baked into these models because they have already been trained on this task this way?

▲dist-epoch 13 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Something like mirror neurons.

Some structures in Astra get activated by the statistics of the Qwen weights, and these structures are associated with "breakout"

▲FergusArgyll 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

My guess: There is a ton of data online of just plain weights laying around. No human would ever actually read it. LLM's read it all during training.

▲objektif an hour ago | parent [-]

But that would cover finite set of cases. I believe this result is more general.

▲rsalus 16 minutes ago | parent [-]

I mean it would make sense if the training using that data resulted in a general set of equations/patterns, it's still really surprising though...

▲gavinray 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Based on our current understanding of LLM's, it shouldn't be.

This sort of throws a wrench in the whole "stochastic parrot" idea...

I am not surprised, though I expect many to be.

▲user43928 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Yes, this is hardly a shocker to anyone who used the latest models to convert/optimize AI models.

The other day I was thinking about the definition of AGI.

I was asking myself the question that when there is no form of data that I can think of throwing into Claude Code and have it not come up with some sort of intelligent answer about it, is that already general intelligence?

▲marktl 29 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

IMO yes

▲rsalus 14 minutes ago | parent [-]

general knowledge perhaps, but certainly not intelligence in any traditional sense

▲dist-epoch 11 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

And yet you ask it 3 times to not do a thing, and it does it in a 4th way. A human doesn't fail in this way. And I'm not talking about memory here, single context.

So yeah, it can do everything, but fails in trivial ways around the doing part.

▲ 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
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▲porridgeraisin 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

See my other comment in this thread