| ▲ | Zig v0.17.0(ziglang.org) |
| 107 points by ErenayDev an hour ago | 44 comments |
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| ▲ | audunw 11 minutes ago | parent | next [-] |
| Would recommend checking out the Zig state of the (tagged) union as well. https://youtu.be/zwi5b5xSsKA?is=PTjJJjSnVMdRuZag It may surprise some people here to see that Andrew is warming up to using LLMs to discover bugs (inspired by results from SQLlite) and considers it a tool on the path to getting to bug free software. |
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| ▲ | saghm 2 minutes ago | parent [-] | | > It may surprise some people here to see that Andrew is warming up to using LLMs to discover bugs (inspired by results from SQLlite) and considers it a tool on the path to getting to bug free software. Someone in the thread below says their bug was closed because of mentioning that they use AI to confirm the bug they had encountered. Is he going to go back and reopen all of those now that he learned what pretty much everyone else already knew? |
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| ▲ | jabedude an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| How is Zig doing as a project? I remember they took a hard line against AI |
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| ▲ | agentultra 36 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | They seem to be doing fine. Tigerbeetle and Ghostty are two projects that continue to do well and are written in Zig. The foundation’s funding also seems to be doing well. They are continuing to make releases. | |
| ▲ | abc42 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It looks like they're spending 5 months what should be a 1 month job these days. | | |
| ▲ | onlyrealcuzzo an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | Filed a compiler bug related to dwarf tables that screws up debugging and line of code coverage that they completely ignored, just because I mentioned that I had every LLM check it to confirm it's a bug, since all I know is what kcov and every coverage tool generates incorrect coverage data for my repo, for 100% certain. | | |
| ▲ | bendmorris 36 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Sounds like you violated the clearly stated project rules and admitted to it. Are you surprised that they're not engaging with you? | | |
| ▲ | phoghed 3 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Yeah, the maintainers of a DOA hobby project should certainly be allowed to run it however they want imo | |
| ▲ | unclad5968 31 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It's a violation of project rules to confirm bugs with AI? | | | |
| ▲ | IshKebab 31 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Wow I thought surely they wouldn't object to using AI to confirm bugs, but they really do. Tbf I guess as a popular open source project not using AI to fix bugs, they probably already have more open bugs than they can ever fix so it doesn't really help them for people to find more. I would imagine his bug was actually ignored just because Zig has 2700 open bugs, rather than some AI policy violation. | | |
| ▲ | bendmorris 27 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Claude Code has 13.4k open bugs: https://github.com/anthropics/claude-code/issues Show me a popular open source project that doesn't have a large number of open issues and I'll show you one that has a triage bot auto-close them. | | | |
| ▲ | audunw 13 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | They don’t, at least not any more. Andrew Kelley has explicitly stated that he sees the value of using LLMs to uncover bugs. Inspired by sqllite project. https://youtu.be/zwi5b5xSsKA?is=PTjJJjSnVMdRuZag They may just be taking the slow route of rejecting by default until they can be sure that the usage of LLMs provides long term value. I don’t see anything wrong with that. If you’re writing robust software, using LLMs at this stage is a bit of a gamble. We don’t fully know the long term effects on code quality yet. | |
| ▲ | acedTrex 21 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | The popular LLM projects have infinitely many more bugs than the zig project does this is a ridiculous message. |
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| ▲ | UncleOxidant 25 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If they really insist on no LLM involvement at all then they're going to fall behind and lose out. Your LLM use case seems really very conservative - you didn't write any code with it, you just use it to confirm the bug. There are many OSS projects that are also taking a similar hardline against LLMs - people are going to fork them and then move on. I've had LLMs fix bugs/add features to a couple of projects like this and, well, they're missing out on the fixes/added features that I'm using locally. | | |
| ▲ | acedTrex 20 minutes ago | parent [-] | | They are doing fine, all this "left behind" talk has no basis other than cope. |
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| ▲ | acedTrex 30 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | > breaks the project rules > gets ignored Who could have forseen this. |
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| ▲ | greggoB an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Can you offer any specifics? The ToC looks quite extensive, which to me indicates a lot of design decisions needed to be made (probably involving many people) and unclear how that process might be accelerated by AI. Unless you're suggesting the language design should also be vibed together? | | |
| ▲ | nvme0n1p1 38 minutes ago | parent [-] | | > Unless you're suggesting the language design should also be vibed together? Sounds like a fun little project, have a bunch of AI pushers fork Zig and see if they can do a better job. I want to see results, not snarky HN comments. After all this progress, ChatGPT should be able to one-shot a better language since AI is so good now... right? | | |
| ▲ | agentultra 33 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Claude can’t one-shot a C compiler. None of these systems can. They need enormous training. They need alignment and reinforcement. They need harnesses. And most importantly they need a human that knows how to write and develop a C compiler. The ISO specifications are not sufficient. Neither are the System V guidelines. Not even spec tests and compcert. | |
| ▲ | spankalee 34 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | One-shot, no, but there are a bunch of people pretty much solo-building their personal ideal language with AI and it's going quite well. You need to know just enough about language design to be dangerous, but you don't need to be a seasoned pro. I'm doing it myself: https://zena-lang.dev/ | | |
| ▲ | Karrot_Kream 22 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Been thinking about doing this myself (did some PL in grad school but it's been a long time), but I find myself wanting to reach for a Scheme (using macros to grow the language I want) and customize it or build something atop Janet. Curious why you wanted a more ML / Rust / Scala inspired syntax. (Personal preference here is totally valid btw, just curious.) |
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| ▲ | UncleOxidant 21 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | You're not going to one-shot it, but over the course of a couple of months of evenings you could come up with something usable/interesting if you manage the LLM well. | |
| ▲ | IshKebab 26 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Nobody is one-shotting big projects. Even humans can't do that. |
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| ▲ | dingdingdang 30 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yep, it's true, but the reality of what it would take to actually fork and commence with healthy use of AI alongside with the elusive soft/hard stance needed to lead technically and socially is probably a bigger challenge than anyone is willing to take on! Soo.. slow and (rather?) well it goes for Zig. | |
| ▲ | mg74 42 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Slow and steady wins the race | | |
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| ▲ | acedTrex 29 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Im really enjoying using it, works great tbh | |
| ▲ | DASD 38 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Seems to be C++ing which is disappointing. Looking more at C3 and Odin for cases where I'd hoped Zig to land. | | |
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| ▲ | luiwammus 15 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Although I understand that upgrading LLVM version is a lot of work, it's a bit frustating that loop vectorization is still disabled. |
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| ▲ | alexrp 12 minutes ago | parent [-] | | The fix could not be backported to LLVM 22 because it changed the LLVM library ABI. We also could not skip straight to LLVM 23 because that would make life harder for distro package maintainers. |
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| ▲ | ErenayDev an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| https://ziglang.org/news/0.17.0-released/ |
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| ▲ | ai_critic 9 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] |
| > Please consider a recurring donation so that we can offer more billable hours to our core team members. Just don't be surprised if the project BFDL talks shit about you or your company later. (Still a good language though, credit where credit is due.) |
