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▲ rvz 2 days ago

Europe has no money.

▲piltdownman a day ago | parent | next [-]

The average salary (not including RSUs/Bonus) in Dublin's Silcon Docklands is north of €130k+, with sick pay, 23 days leave, and the sort of employee protections which would be an utter fantasy in the US (defined redundancy payments, mandated collective bargaining, governance processes around mass redundancy handling at state level).

This was hugely evident during the recent spate of tech layoffs - employers planning collective dismissals are obliged to hold a mandatory 30-day consultation with employee representatives and notify the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment beforehand. Issuing premature "done deal" announcements before meaningful consultation breaches Irish law.

Even at the micro level, non-collective or individual restructuring must still rely on objective selection criteria and fair procedures. Failing to do so exposes employers to Workplace Relations Commission (WRC) claims for unfair or constructive dismissal.

There's also very very strict regulations around work/life issues. A famous case this year in 2023 where a Customer Care Team Lead at the Dublin office of Israeli software company Wix was dismissed after posting comments on LinkedIn. In her posts, she described Israel as a "terrorist state" and referred to Zionism as "the root of violence" while expressing solidarity with the Palestinian people. In July 2024, the WRC ordered Wix to pay Carey €35,000 in compensation after Wix acknowledged that the dismissal was "procedurally unfair" under Irish employment law.

In short, we're not that poor and have significant societal safety-nets that make up the delta in direct wages.

▲kube-system 26 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> The average salary (not including RSUs/Bonus) in Dublin's Silcon Docklands is north of €130k

That's quite a bit short to buy an EUV machine.

But of course, the parent commenter was not talking about salaries, because ASMLs products are not B2C.

▲jiggawatts 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> employee protections which would be an utter fantasy in the US (defined redundancy payments, mandated collective bargaining, governance processes around mass redundancy handling at state level).

This can be compared to protectionist policies such as tariffs.

If employees are hard to fire, then companies hesitate to hire them.

If employees on-shore are protected, then un-protected employees overseas are more competitive, eventually gutting local industries.

Etc.

This came up in Australia recently where a liberal government proposed loosening some employee protection laws with the idea that it would encourage hiring.

It did. It worked.

Then the policy was swiftly reversed by a more left-wing party, and a lot of those newly employed people lost their jobs because they turned from an asset to a liability.

Protectionism is a double-edged sword.

▲__m a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It’s all invested in American companies

▲yomismoaqui a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And yet, more USians move to my "poor" country than the other way around. Make of that what you will.

▲PorciiVorbesc a day ago | parent | next [-]

>more USians move to my "poor" country than the other way around.

Retirees and people who already made money to outbid the locals on housing and purchasing power.

Why would they move to a more expensive country where they'd feel poor?

▲yomismoaqui a day ago | parent [-]

Emigrating is not an easy task (even with money), think why they do it and why the don't want to live on the country they were born.

Think about it... a hint, it's not about money.

▲PorciiVorbesc a day ago | parent [-]

Emigrating is super easy when you have a lot of money and a strong passport. Money solves most problems that are not related to the soul.

By comparison, try emigrating as a poor person from a poor country with a weak passport. Americans are playing life on easy mode but they complain the most.

▲TMWNN a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That well-paid Americans like to WFH on Malaga beaches is not a testament to the Spanish economy, but to its weather and (more importantly) low cost of living.

In any case, don't be too sure about your claim. According to <https://ourworldindata.org/where-do-migrants-live-and-where-...>, 170K Spanish-born live in the US. By contrast, 69K US-born live in Spain <https://ourworldindata.org/where-do-migrants-live-and-where-...>. Given that the US (341 million) has 7.25 times Spain's population (47 million), this means that a Spaniard is 17-18 times more likely to move to the US, than an American is to move to Spain.

▲ar0 a day ago | parent | next [-]

This is… a mathematically correct but practically useless way to compare migration flows. Using this approach, Singaporeans are more likely to move to China than Chinese to move to Singapore. Mathematically true, and tells us much about the relative sizes of these two countries, but very, very little about relative attractiveness as a place of living.

▲TMWNN a day ago | parent [-]

>Using this approach, Singaporeans are more likely to move to China than Chinese to move to Singapore.

Using the Our World in Data figures, a Singapore-born person is about four times more likely to move to China than a China-born person is to move to Singapore.

That does not seem like an unreasonable ratio, given that a) Chinese are not nearly as free, whether economically or politically, to emigrate, b) those Chinese who have the money and connections to leave are likely going to be in the large cities that offer good living standards, and c) China is going to have, from sheer size, aspects that will appeal to Singaporeans regardless of per-capita economic disparity. Put another way, if Chinese were as free to move around the world as Singaporeans, there would surely be many more China-born people in Singapore ... perhaps four times as the current 530K.

By contrast, the US and Spain are fairly comparable in terms of their citizens' freedom to move about, so that factor can be eliminated from the comparison.

▲yomismoaqui a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And healthcare, better food, better public transport, security, human relations, lifespan... and above all, happiness.

The american dream is dead, US is a country for working, not for living.

▲gib444 a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Absolutely also a testament to escaping Trump too. I have met many all over Europe, all ages – UK, Netherlands, Spain, Portugal, Ireland etc who mentioned it. Including many previously living in California, Florida, Colorado etc with a decent climate, who were earning very good money.

Definitely a testament to each country too - presumably they have a fairly wide choice. They wouldn't go somewhere they disliked the culture that much. We know how discerning US folk are.

▲marky1991 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If we were to take all preceding arguments seriously, couldn't that be explained by americans going to live in a low-cost-of-living country once they've earned their living?

(Don't know your country to know if that's true or not, but it's a possibility)

▲yomismoaqui a day ago | parent [-]

Are you looking for money or are you looking for a good life?

My country offers them both, people from lots of countries como here looking for money and also for a better way of living.

The lesson explains itself.

▲pb7 a day ago | parent | prev [-]

The demonym is American, not whatever you wrote. Unless your poor country is New Zealand, that's not the case.

▲yomismoaqui a day ago | parent [-]

Being pedantic America is the continent. So a chilean should be as "American" as Donald Trump.

▲pb7 a day ago | parent [-]

No, it isn't. Everyone knows exactly what "American" means and it's never a Chilean.

▲gib444 11 hours ago | parent [-]

You know English is defined by its usage right? If people start using a new term such as USAian, or American to refer to everyone from the continent...that's what will be. There is no central authority to tell us how to use English correctly.

Anyway. New world order. USA hegemony is going way.

I guess USAians are beginning to find out how we in the UK felt about the loss of our empire.

▲prerok a day ago | parent | prev [-]

It's actually the other way around. All we have is money that we stole from the colonies.

If the car companies actually go down the drain I have no clue what products of note we would still be producing that would continue to bring money in. So, I think our goose is cooked here in Europe.

▲piltdownman a day ago | parent [-]

I mean this is just such FUD.

In Ireland alone we manufacture:

* Cardiovascular Stents (80% of Global Supply)

* Orthopaedic Knee Implants (75% of Global Supply)

* Acute Hospital Ventilators (50% of Global Supply)

* Contact Lenses (World Leader)

19 of the world's top 20 pharmaceutical companies operate manufacturing, R&D, or biopharma facilities in Ireland; this compromises over 50% of all physical goods exported from Ireland, totaling well over €100 billion annually. Needless to say it's also the pivotal manufacturing hub for high-demand GLP-1 weight-loss and diabetes treatments (like Mounjaro).

Ireland is among the top global exporters of antisera, blood fractions, and complex cell cultures, making it indispensable to global healthcare infrastructure.

Ireland is the absolute world leader in dairy science per capita, and produces roughly 10% to 15% of the entire world's infant milk formula, with estimates indicating that roughly one in ten to one in seven babies globally consume formula manufactured in the country.

That's an Island of less than 5 million people, 1/8th the size of Texas, that was basically bypassed by the Industrial Revolution and had no colonial benefit. Now extrapolate for a second and imagine what Germany is manufacturing.

▲teruakohatu 6 hours ago | parent [-]

> That's an Island of less than 5 million people,

The Republic of Ireland has more than 5 million people. The Island has well over 7 million.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2026/0824/1588997-cso-popul...