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jordanb 3 hours ago

That "Lake America" is doing a hell of a lot of work for Google

strictnein 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The judge was appointed by Clinton, so they've been in their role for decades now. It seems unlikely that someone who has served that long in her position would rule based on making the child in the White House happy.

ElProlactin 15 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> It seems unlikely that someone who has served that long in her position would rule based on making the child in the White House happy.

The US is a corporatocracy. It's apparently a lot easier for Americans to convince themselves that the current administration is corrupt and end there than it is to acknowledge that the entire system has been corrupted and it won't change once the administration changes.

JMiao an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

we got rick grimes over here walking into atlanta

bigyabai 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

To the contrary, the entire DOJ understands that FAANG and the three-letter-agencies are one revolving door. Any judge that attempts to defang Google's data collection may well run afoul of the American surveillance system, which this administration will fight tooth and nail to defend.

Not very different from how federal protectionism keeps Apple's App Store centralized despite trillions of dollars in ostensible market damage. Anyone trying to loosen America's grip on software distribution is crossing an ugly national security line that we're all too ashamed to admit exists.

rootsudo 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

100% glad someone states the obvious. Sometimes here people think these tech companies are on truly altruistic missions on making “the world a better place!!1” or truly making an impact by being an IC in their role and having access to perks which, have largely been taken away as the market matures to data collection and surveillance.

If you want to have some fun, go on LinkedIn and see how many former military people, proud of their service, boast how they are at x or y tech company in director esque roles.

Then bookmark them and see the pages disappear in the future. Boy I’m glad it’s legally 100% ok to scrap LinkedIn data because it truly is a revolving door.

roosterIllusi0n an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

RCS is google's foothold. It forces everyone to share with google and currently, there is no carrier option for RCS. You have to pick google or apple or go without.

JMiao an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

agree with you but including netflix is becoming hilarious

xp84 an hour ago | parent [-]

The acronym gets awkward if we don't, though

edoceo an hour ago | parent [-]

I thought we were using "Mag7" these days.

vasco 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Since you are getting no replies but getting downvoted I'm adding source from 2016 corroborating what you mention: https://www.techtransparencyproject.org/articles/googles-rev...

251 individuals in such detected instances just in google. And that report is 10 years old, I'd bet it's 10x that by now.

strictnein 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That makes the argument worse, not better.

Google employees tens of thousands of people. The US intelligence apparatus employees hundreds of thousands of people. In all of that, over eight years, there are 251 people who moved between the two, and because of that absolute rounding error, the entire federal government is beholden to them?

Since you are making the accusation that this is a real conspiracy: statistically, how many people should have rotated between these two giant employers over an 8 year span? The answer isn't zero.

Also, this makes the "data" even more pointless:

"between Google or related firms, and the federal government, national political campaigns and Congress during President Obama’s time in office"

"were appointed to federal advisory boards."

Do you know how many of those boards exist? There are tons of them. I've known a couple of people who have served on them. They're incredibly boring and deal with things like "What accessibility standards should federal government websites support?". Of course you would want people from Google on that type of board.

> 251 individuals in such detected instances just in google. And that report is 10 years old, I'd bet it's 10x that by now.

"Detected instances"

It's so secret that I can name one of them off the top of my head: Matt Cutts. Is he part of this vast conspiracy too?

vasco 2 hours ago | parent [-]

What conspiracy mate? It's not so deep, I was curious if what he said was a lie due to the downvotes and found nice evidence for it. You don't find it convincing it's your choice, but the dude didn't pull it out of his ass.

strictnein 2 hours ago | parent [-]

The conspiracy that Google is protected on high because people have rotated between two giant employers.

If you think it is "nice evidence", how many people should have moved between those two employers?

And you made the claim that the rate likely drastically increased over the past 10 years. Based on what, exactly?

JMiao an hour ago | parent | next [-]

yes, such has been the reality for some time now. look at boeing

ux266478 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You think that giant employers being protected, especially when they align themselves with government interests of the day, is a conspiracy? Do you also think that suggesting economic producer interests are a high priority is a conspiracy? Or that corporations with contracts to the government are generally compliant with governmental requests?

watwut 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Big companies being protected "from high" based on payments and favors is not conspiracy theory anymore. It is out there in the open expected thing.

surcap526 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[dead]

strictnein 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The DOJ isn't part of the Judiciary branch, it's part of the Executive.

> FAANG and the three-letter-agencies are one revolving door

Most of the NSA is active duty service members and former military. Did you mean other three letter agencies, excluding the most powerful one dealing with surveillance?

> Any judge that attempts to interfere with Google's data collection may well run afoul of the American surveillance system

The judge in this case put the final nail into Trumps slush fund. But now she's doing his bidding. Is that what you're claiming?

Not everything is a conspiracy. You don't have some special insight into this.

ux266478 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Given the sentence immediately following the revolving door metaphor, I think it was clumsily being used for data, not personnel. Especially because it's true for obvious reasons.

> The judge in this case put the final nail into Trumps slush fund. But now she's doing his bidding. Is that what you're claiming?

No, they're clearly claiming it's a non-partisan thing and the sitting president is irrelevant, as are the specifics of the virtue signalling happening. Yes, even though they qualified themselves with "this administration". Do you think that the Clintons aren't friends with the state department surveillance abomination or the nastiest parts of government writ large? That Bill or Hillary wouldn't fight tooth and nail to protect this terrible thing that's been wrought? Replace the context with some virtue signal about NATO intervention in Serbia 27 years ago, nothing changes. Partisan politics is for yokels.

bigyabai 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> The judge in this case put the final nail into Trumps slush fund.

That's a very different, partisan effort. It's not bipartisan like the Patriot Act was, or domestic surveillance in-general.

> Not everything is a conspiracy. You don't have some special insight into this.

Not everything is as it seems. You can't meaningfully prove that the NSA sat on their hands in the 13 interceding years since Snowden. There's no evidence that US interventionism is on the straight-and-narrow now, you're wishcasting and calling it truth.

strictnein 2 hours ago | parent [-]

> You can't meaningfully prove that the NSA sat on their hands in the 13 interceding years since Snowden.

I mean, you're correct? It's impossible to prove a negative.

> There's no evidence that US interventionism is on the straight-and-narrow now, you're wishcasting and calling it truth.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and all that. You're the ones making the extraordinary claims. The burden of proof is on you, not the people pointing out the flaws in these claims.

mobelkh an hour ago | parent [-]

i would argue, the NSA not being up to some bullshit is more unlikely, and thus has the burden of proof on it, to assume otherwise is to ignore history and basic incentives these orgs have.

pixl97 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

strictnein 2 hours ago | parent [-]

This started under Biden? Crazy.

> These days all three branches march lock step in their jackboots

Which is why the Judicial branch has been ruling against the Executive branch again and again? I don't understand what evidence you think you have to the contrary, other than vibes?

ralfd 23 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

> Apple's App Store centralized despite trillions of dollars in ostensible market damage

Please. The Androidfication of iOS with malware/scamware would cost quadrillions in market damage.

harimau777 3 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

So the market damage would be more than the entire planet's GDP?

gambiting 20 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Citation needed. The idea that somehow my mum can't even find the space bar on her keyboard and yet is competent enough to go through several warning screens to install a custom .apk is just laughable.

bitpush 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Isnt that updated by some national database and google just pulls that data? Apparently Apple Maps will also get it in a few days, since they get the data from them as well.

jvolkman 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Yes. We had the same comments about Gulf of America.

Edit: I don't know that there's an actual database served up by the US Gov, but governments control the naming of these things within their own jurisdictions. All of the big mapping products have the ability to serve up different names based on where you're viewing from.

And Apple just renamed: https://apnews.com/article/apple-lake-ontario-america-google...

TazeTSchnitzel 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

https://edits.nationalmap.gov/apps/gaz-domestic/public/searc...

GNIS, Geographic Names Information System

(Which still shows Lake Ontario for me as I write this. The body of water along the US's southern coast is Gulf of America however.)

jonas21 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The database entry was updated to "Lake America" on August 27:

https://edits.nationalmap.gov/apps/gaz-domestic/public/searc...

GNIS renders their own static map tiles, so it may take a while for the update to be reflected on the map itself.

michchinn 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Per Secretarial Order 3453, Lake Ontario has been renamed to Lake America. The basemaps for GNIS are in the process of being updated to reflect this name change.

I see this on the top bar

wbl 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The government does not control the words you or I use to refer to things.

j2kun 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It would be nice if Maps would prefer data from government DBs that have localized versions of foreign place name data (e.g., Germany's BKG) when available.

biophysboy 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It makes perfect sense that govs control names within their jurisdiction - I am eyerolling at both the name change and the reaction.

I am curious though - is it convention to leave the data as is, or is it illegal to modify it?

Regardless, itll just be changed back in 2 years; as long as I can type "lake ontario" and get directed to Lake Ontario, I do not care at all what the gov database calls it currently.

sixothree 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I wouldn't exactly describe one person as "the government".

watwut 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> I am eyerolling at both the name change and the reaction.

Why do you expect meek reaction in a rename like this? What is eye rolling over reacting to this particular rename?

ericmay 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I too remember last year when everyone really cared about that and it was the end of the world and then we got on with our lives because at the end of the day it not only doesn't matter, the naming of these things is arbitrary, and anything that a president can change the name of a subsequent president can modify yet again.

What do they call the South China Sea, is it the East Sea or is it the West Philippine Sea? What do the French call the English Channel? Is it Le Manche d'anglaise?

nancyminusone 3 hours ago | parent [-]

So unimportant that you just have to comment on how unimportant it is

ericmay 2 hours ago | parent [-]

It’s so unimportant folks are commenting on my comment about how unimportant it is!

spogbiper 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/apple-maps-changes-name-lak...

Apple updated it yesterday. If I were Google I'd turn down that refresh rate and let someone else take the bad PR next time

lotsofpulp 2 hours ago | parent [-]

There is no bad PR, 99% of people don’t care.

bee_rider 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Seems like something that should be user-configurable (like DNS servers). While the recent annoying renamings have drawn attention to the issue, landmark names have basically always been political.

avs733 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I have been wondering this as well. I cannot imagine having this be autoupdated without review from a centralized database is a good idea. This is a process that needs to be frangible and have some friction in it.

In this day and age, GPS mapping tools have major implications for societal function, safety, economics, national security, healthcare, etc. I'm struggling to think of an industry where a sudden absence/subtle changes of named GPS mapping data would not have an effect.

If everyone relied on the same data base which could push changes to the map in the pocket of every resident of a nation that would be the first thing I would think to hack. Probably easier than actually jamming or spoofing GPS/GNSS over a huge area.

bpodgursky 2 hours ago | parent [-]

There are thousands of small street changes across the country each day. New subdivisions, road expansions, lane changes, new traffic lights. Of course the vast majority should be auto-updated without manual review, what would a person add to the process? The public database is the system of record in the first place.

hn_throwaway_99 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

To all the people pissed about the "Lake America" stuff: why in the actual fuck do you want Google of all organizations to be arbiter of geographical info, instead of federal institutions that are (at least nominally) operated under democratic principles?

Don't you understand the horror of what you're suggesting: "I want Google to impose it's own personal value judgments over the government's."

Yes, I think it's incredibly stupid, 3rd grader childlike to call this "Lake America". But the problem is not Google, the problem is the ass hats we (collectively, even if not you/me personally) voted for. The problem is especially with our Congressional reps who have just neutered themselves in service to this stupidity. And I get it, our federal institutions have definitely showed their frailty lately, but I can't fathom then why people think the proper solution is to give more decision-making authority to Google.

mpalczewski an hour ago | parent | next [-]

I do wonder how many people that criticize the renaming, were criticizing Obama when he rename Mt McKinley. What are the principles here? Or is it just names I like vs names I don't like.

tdb7893 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Democracy works best as a diffuse institution and is more than just voting. People are supposed to have rights and power themselves and I want them to try to make things better (whether I agree with them or not) and "corporations" are just groups of people. Needing to just go with the government, especially on something so clearly within their rights, is counter to the ideals of the system.

I can understand Google somewhat here (if I was running a business I wouldn't be happy wading into a political issue like this) but the idea that they are above criticism for just falling in line still doesn't resonate with me.

schubidubiduba 13 minutes ago | parent [-]

Corporations being only "groups of people" is kind of wishful thinking. They are one cog in a large machinery that is steered by a few very rich people.

Corporations should not be absolved of criticism. But at the same time it makes little sense to put a hamster in hamster wheel and then blame him for running.

dragontamer an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Yeah it's meaningless to fight. Except not really. If the powers that be are corrupt we can simply keep calling it Lake Ontario across the board, and use the difference to find who is or isn't on my side on that issue.

The only people calling it Gulf of America or Lake America are hardcore MAGATs in my social circle. Even former Trump voters in my social circle are annoyed and not using the new names. So it's an effective way to figure out who is or isn't going along with the Administration today.

xp84 44 minutes ago | parent [-]

> If the powers that be are corrupt we can simply keep calling it Lake Ontario

This is the same logic that the right wing used when they disagreed with Obama on some issues, so they blocked his Supreme Court nominations just because anything Obama does must be bad.

Sounds like your social circle is in denial. There are certainly plenty of things Trump, buffoon and graft-a-holic he is, has done that are corrupt. Renaming bodies of water doesn't look like one of them. (Obviously, because he would have renamed it after a donor, or at least after himself.)

I mean, sure, we can all call anything whatever. I can call New Mexico "Best Mexico" or call Washington, DC "Bad Washington" and that's my right. But pretending that there aren't official names for things because we don't like the current guy seems immature. It's clearly within the authority of the government. Talk like this makes me think that people want to just live in a reality defined exclusively by party politics where we just pretend every law or policy made by The Bad Party doesn't exist, rather than try to win elections so we can shape the one actual reality.

an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
okdood64 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You mean by Judge Leonie M. Brinkema who was appointed by Clinton and has ruled against Trump policies/agenda regularly?

owebmaster 2 hours ago | parent [-]

... proving the point that protecting big tech is a bipartisan work.

bradthebeaverfa 13 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

As much as I love when people pretend Trump is the first government official to ever rename something, there is no evidence this had any impact on the court's decision.