It's pointless to look for solutions that's against human nature.

mrkeen 31 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

'Against human nature' is where every intervention begins! Otherwise you wouldn't bother intervening.

sixtyj an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Law of conservation of energy can be applied here as well. So you can’t expect something else if you produce and consume more.

I don’t dispute capitalism and democracy.

Just trying to figure out what I (as person) really need.

Every weekend travelling by plane just to experience something else?

Ordering some stuff across the globe from Temu, Aliexpress just because it is cheap(er)?

Eating e.g. tuna because it is healthy that had to be transported around the globe?

Drinking wine from South Africa because I don’t like Californian? (Blind tests by Wine Spectator magazine confirm that even a sommelier doesn’t recognize cheap from expensive ones.)

Global export-import statistics is staggering… just a few: all metals, honey, fish, vegetables from Spain, avocados from Peru, almonds from California, cheaper than local milk transported across Europe , bananas from everywhere you can imagine… supply and demand - a lot of people have a much more money.

Vessel and plane trackers show so many vehicles moving around that I wonder how whales can handle this traffic.

There is chemical and industry that is real spin doctors.

(Almost) everyone wants to have house, car, cheap everything, travel everywhere. Those who can’t afford do everything to become rich.

Wealth is good. Plundering to get more money not so much. And mankind plunders like there is no tomorrow. All the CSR, circular economy etc is nice but brainwashing and stuff for distraction so people could feel better.

	▲	noir_lord an hour ago \| parent \| next [-]
		> I don’t dispute capitalism and democracy. I do the capitalism part, or more specifically what form of capitalism because there is a vast range between "society should work for capitalism" and "capitalism should work for society". I'd likely argue that on the whole capitalism in it's current form isn't working for society and the trend is towards that getting worse over time.
	▲	dns_snek an hour ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		> I don’t dispute capitalism But we should. This is a taboo topic but pretending that these consequences are either disconnected from capitalism or that capitalism is some natural law of the universe that should never be challenged is, for lack of a better word, delusional. These consequences are inherent to capitalism because people benefiting from it demand infinite growth and nobody is incentivized to care about the environment. People who care about it get outcompeted by those who don't in ruthless pursuit of "efficiency". We can try to regulate it to the point that people wouldn't call it capitalism anymore but the nature of a system where the only incentive is maximizing profit will always have a natural tendency to harm the environment, so it should be disputed.

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soco 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

So the human nature is to kill ourselves or otherwise let ourselves die out? Sorry dude, I don't want to accept that - I don't even believe it.

	▲	satvikpendem an hour ago \| parent [-]
		You don't have to accept it but seems like that's what is happening. Humans just don't seem to have the capacity for long term collective action against individual interests. Ultimately that may be what the Great Filter for us ends up being, maybe it'd have been different were we a hive mind.

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burnt-resistor an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Leadership by the Tokugawa shogunate saved the forests of Japan. Leadership saved the ozone layer. Leadership can save the climate, although civil war(s) maybe necessary to overthrow corrupt elites who put us all at risk.

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MachineMan an hour ago | parent [-]

Earth has an immune system called the atlantic meridian overturning cycle. When meltwater dillutes the salt concentration too much, it collapses and creates an ice age. Short term catastrophe, long term it will be OK.

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defrost an hour ago | parent [-]

> it collapses and creates an ice age.

We're already in an ice age (there is ice at the poles). I suspect you mean this would make Europe cooler, but do nothing to reverse the trend of increasing global mean surface (land + ocean) temperature.

	▲	kuerbel 5 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		They mean a glacial period, I guess... we are in an interglacial in an ice age