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sixtyj 2 hours ago

Law of conservation of energy can be applied here as well. So you can’t expect something else if you produce and consume more.

I don’t dispute capitalism and democracy.

Just trying to figure out what I (as person) really need.

Every weekend travelling by plane just to experience something else?

Ordering some stuff across the globe from Temu, Aliexpress just because it is cheap(er)?

Eating e.g. tuna because it is healthy that had to be transported around the globe?

Drinking wine from South Africa because I don’t like Californian? (Blind tests by Wine Spectator magazine confirm that even a sommelier doesn’t recognize cheap from expensive ones.)

Global export-import statistics is staggering… just a few: all metals, honey, fish, vegetables from Spain, avocados from Peru, almonds from California, cheaper than local milk transported across Europe , bananas from everywhere you can imagine… supply and demand - a lot of people have a much more money.

Vessel and plane trackers show so many vehicles moving around that I wonder how whales can handle this traffic.

There is chemical and industry that is real spin doctors.

(Almost) everyone wants to have house, car, cheap everything, travel everywhere. Those who can’t afford do everything to become rich.

Wealth is good. Plundering to get more money not so much. And mankind plunders like there is no tomorrow. All the CSR, circular economy etc is nice but brainwashing and stuff for distraction so people could feel better.

noir_lord 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> I don’t dispute capitalism and democracy.

I do the capitalism part, or more specifically what form of capitalism because there is a vast range between "society should work for capitalism" and "capitalism should work for society".

I'd likely argue that on the whole capitalism in it's current form isn't working for society and the trend is towards that getting worse over time.

dns_snek 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> I don’t dispute capitalism

But we should. This is a taboo topic but pretending that these consequences are either disconnected from capitalism or that capitalism is some natural law of the universe that should never be challenged is, for lack of a better word, delusional.

These consequences are inherent to capitalism because people benefiting from it demand infinite growth and nobody is incentivized to care about the environment. People who care about it get outcompeted by those who don't in ruthless pursuit of "efficiency".

We can try to regulate it to the point that people wouldn't call it capitalism anymore but the nature of a system where the only incentive is maximizing profit will always have a natural tendency to harm the environment, so it should be disputed.

MachineMan 5 minutes ago | parent [-]

I personally don’t think either communism or capitalism will exist in 10 years from now. We are entering a period of total upheaval, where the very concept of a nation state has become obsolete. I expect global theocracy where robots and ai (incl nanobots) clean up the mess we made in this world, freedom becomes more limited, but abundance and security increases. There will be a renewed focus on community and human connection rather than the run away obsessive focus on materialism and innovation at a pace human beings cannot adapt to. Human labor, cognition, natural resources and policy have always been the elements that dictate whether a nation can develop into a first world country. Labor and cognition are respectively solved by robots and AI.