| ▲ | jp57 12 hours ago |
| The warming is terrible and deadly, AND ALSO Europeans are negligent in not protecting themselves however they can. The idea that Europe could slow warming by not using air-conditioning is absurd, when the emissions mostly come from elsewhere. France, in particular, gets most of its energy from nuclear power, but also makes it very hard to get climatisation. |
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| ▲ | suslik 12 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| When I lived in a rather hot area of Spain for a year, I was shocked to find out that many apartments don't have an air conditioner. In a place where a similar heat wave happens every year, for months. A friend of mine moved there from Germany and being somewhat frugal, rented a place without and aircon. Let me just say that he didn't enjoy the summer nights one bit. I myself had one, but I could probably rent a car for the cost of running it. |
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| ▲ | mapt 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I will say this - air conditioning costs to establish room temperature are inversely proportional to the degree the building is insulated. If your whole country is comprised of uninsulated or barely insulated housing stock, you have a MUCH larger project than simply buying some small window units for a few hundred euro per person and then paying a few hundred euros extra per year in energy costs. |
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| ▲ | user43928 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I believe many people do not know how effective air conditioning technology is. A single portable monoblock unit with window exhaust pipe is plenty for all but the worst rooms if you target 26.5C while it is around 33C outside. The air my portable unit emits is cooled to like ~5C. Insulation does not even matter; the window is literally partially open. I can still cool a 70m2 room in the top floor of an ancient building, at least together with ventilating at night. If the room was not on the top floor, or if it was only 35m2, I imagine I could comfortably cool it to 24.5 - 25C. The only issue here is that it draws close to 1000W 24/7, it is loud, and the window has to stay open all the time. With even just a portable split/window unit this could be much more effective and comfortable, but sadly it is not allowed for preservation reasons that make no sense. | |
| ▲ | jp57 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Don't they have to heat them in the winter too? That also costs more and creates more emissions without insulation. | | |
| ▲ | mapt 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | Some of these places don't get very cold, others rely on coats, others south facing window solar gain. Very old buildings are common. I'm not claiming all of Europe is uninsulated, just a large enough portion to render heatwave safety a much bigger problem. |
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| ▲ | PH02 11 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| People live longer in many parts of Europe than the USA. Does that mean the USA is somehow negligent? Excess deaths due to heat are primarily the in the elderly. The excess numbers we are seeing now are because the proportion of elderly people in France, Germany and Spain are higher than in the USA. If the population pyramid in the EU was more similar to that of the USA the number of excess deaths would be lower. I'm not sure negligent is the correct word to use. Climate change will reduce quality of life. Because of these changes people will not live as long. That's how excess deaths work. |
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| ▲ | jp57 9 hours ago | parent [-] | | Having more old people is even more of a reason to make it easy to get air conditioning. I live in the USA, and there are certainly many ways in which the USA is negligent on health care, but making sure people can stay cool in hot weather isn't one of them. In any case, this isn't a zero sum game, where the USA's negligence in one area negates Europes negligence in another. | | |
| ▲ | PH02 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | I think you may have missed the point. It's not a matter of more old people, it's more old people relative to the rest of the population. The excess death numbers reported will happen because more people live longer in the EU than in other places. Those excess death numbers can't be sustained over time, because our population pyramid will gradually resemble something more like yours. Alternatively put, if the EU population pyramid resembled the US population pyramid we wouldn't have the excess death numbers that have been reported during the heatwaves (because most of those people would have already been dead). It's not the case that people are boiling in the streets. It's more similar to COVID-19. People who were going to die relatively soon die earlier. That's what excess deaths is. |
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| ▲ | atoav 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| If you can't run one fifth of your nuclear plants, because the water levels are to low or the water temperatures too high in the rivers used to cool them, you may want to reconsider whether that is truly the best choice here¹ In the meantime my fathers solar roof allows him free AC cooling, because as it turns out AC generally needs most energy when the sun shines the most. I am not arguing nuclear plants do not have benefits, I just argue that solar with storage may be a much better fit for powering ACs. ¹: https://www.euronews.com/2026/08/12/heatwave-and-jellyfish-a... |
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| ▲ | Arodex 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| >Europeans are negligent in not protecting themselves however they can. Well, if the people in charge say or think global warming isn't real, that's what you get: not "other" solutions to the "unacceptable propositions" the Green parties suggest, but no proposition at all, as there is no problem. The current situation is a direct consequence of pure negationism from conservative parties, not a disagreement on how to deal with climate change between the Right and the Left. The Left proposed solutions you may not agree with, but the Right has been completely rejecting the reality of climate change. BTW, how do you propose Europe protect not only people from the heat, but also forests from burning, rivers from drying up, fields from being unfit for cows and sheep, lakes from blooming with algae, nuclear plants from being shut down due to river water being too hot and seawater being full of jellyfish, etc, etc, etc? In the end, there are so many things to "adapt" that it would cost less to try to organize a global effort to lower CO2. |
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| ▲ | jp57 12 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | [H]ow do you propose Europe protect not only people from the heat, but [all these other things]? Why does it have to be framed as all-or-nothing? I agree that using air conditioning to reduce the number of people who die from the heat does nothing to help with the problem of jellyfish, but how is that relevant, exactly? | | |
| ▲ | Arodex 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | Your AC isn't going to work when your power plants are stuffed with jellyfish and have to shut down. | | |
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| ▲ | markvdb 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Honest question. How could effective global climate action look? | | |
| ▲ | myrmidon 11 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Put a significant price on CO2 emissions (think like $300+/ton, instead of <$100), then tax every import from countries that take insufficient actions (or run a low CO2 emission price). Likewise, tax any export into countries that take no action. Electrify everything where possible (especially transport and heating), get electricity CO2 neutral, get concrete and steel production CO2 neutral (lots of those would be an inevitable consequence of the emission pricing). This would allow western democracies to basically fix the global situation on their own, by exerting economic pressure on developing countries (those want/need market access, like China). It would make goods (and especially individual transport!) more expensive though (even if you re-emit the tax income), so you can be sure it's not gonna happen, because too many people are too selfish. | |
| ▲ | 11 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | [deleted] | |
| ▲ | karmakurtisaani 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | To add to the other replies, stopping animal agriculture would be a huge step forward. | |
| ▲ | Arodex 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Stop electing climate change deniers. Stop listening to billionaires who don't want to pay - not to lose - a single cent to help reduce CO2 emissions, but are ready to pay millions to lobby against. |
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