| ▲ | userbinator 6 hours ago |
| This architectural shift eliminates the user’s ability to expand memory capacity as self-hosting demands grow, effectively putting a permanent ceiling on running memory-heavy Docker containers, ZFS pools, or virtual machines. That's not a NAS anymore, that's a full server. I think of a NAS as "low-power computer with lots of storage attached", so not being able to upgrade the RAM on one isn't all that surprising. |
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| ▲ | folkrav 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| I run some light services on my NAS cause well, in the end, the distinction in naming is arbitrary at best, it’s a computer, and I use it for computer things. In an ideal world where I can afford separate purpose-built machines for everything, I’ll have a storage-only NAS, but it’s a computer I have that also happens to have many hard drive bays. Being able to service my own machines shouldn’t be all that surprising either. |
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| ▲ | podocarp 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Well that's just for home use. Say a small to medium enterprise needing a shared drive. Or even things like say video editing you might need a 10G connection. Furthermore for most it's just a hobby so there's no right or wrong, if you can live with the noise and power of old enterprise gear then kudos to you, or if you think a raspberry pi with a sata hat works then go ahead |
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| ▲ | close04 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| For business it should be all storage. But for home use the best is all-in-one. A home user doesn’t benefit from specialization of equipment, just brings them more headaches managing more stuff. One device that has storage and can also run Plex, Immich, HA in a single package makes the lives much easier for those who have to take care of the IT in the house especially of they’re not “IT people”. |
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| ▲ | inigyou 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | That isn't a NAS, then. It's a home server. | | |
| ▲ | jasode 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | >That isn't a NAS, then. It's a home server. It's just 2 different usages of "NAS" for different contexts. In a business/enterprise environment, "NAS" is a more constrained definition of a single-purpose rack that only does storage duties. However, in a home environment, "NAS" is a fuzzier definition to also include running "apps" like Home Assistant, Plex/Jellyfish media, or webcam video analysis. Either in containers or vms. Both the vendors Synology/QNAP/UGREEN and the consumers use "NAS" in this looser definition. If you go out on Google search or Amazon to search for a "home server" to buy, you will get "NAS appliances" as the results. This happens because a NAS in a home usage has plenty of idle CPU leftover to run extra apps that's not strictly just storage. Buying a 2nd computer to run apps just to satisfy the NAS to remain as a "pure" NAS is a waste of money. Similar situation to "routers". Business/enterprise routers are single purpose. But home routers from the ISP are fuzzier definitions. They also include a DHCP service, a firewall, and a Wi-Fi access point. Maybe the home versions are not "true pure routers" in the official OSI 7-layer sense. Ok, but home users still call them "routers". | | |
| ▲ | inigyou 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I suppose it's like how nobody ever calls each other on a "phone" any more but we still call them "phones". | |
| ▲ | PunchyHamster an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | We just need to backronym the shortcut to make somewhat redundant name of "network attached server" | | |
| ▲ | inigyou 25 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Just call it a home server. I don't mind too much that a NAS runs file-sharing-oriented software as a bonus feature - if it can run Samba why can't it run Immich? But when you start using it for compute tasks it's not a storage box any more by definition. And that would be a more advanced extra feature whereas the basic functionality of a storage box is always storage. |
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| ▲ | close04 3 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Exactly! But we call it a NAS like we call the general purpose computer in our pockets a “phone”. There is no market for single purpose, exclusively NAS devices outside of enterprise. |
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| ▲ | TacticalCoder 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > That's not a NAS anymore, that's a full server. I think of a NAS as "low-power computer with lots of storage attached" I disagree. And we can at least discuss whether a NAS that doesn't have ECC is that much of a NAS or not. I'd take an old Xeon server with 64 GB of ECC memory, run its CPU in powersave mode, and slap TrueNAS (with ZFS) on it any day over buying a dedicated NAS. YMMV but actual professional server gear, with ECC memory, is to me more of a NAS than a consumer NAS. And nothing forces you to run a "full server": you can dedicate a real server to be only a NAS and slap the lowest consuming Xeon on it, which moreover you can run with a powersaving CPU governor. Slap a 10 Gbit/s ethernet NIC in it and call it a day. It shall be more reliable too. You can of course cosplay with a consumer NAS but the real thing is better. P.S: mine is a HP Z440 with a 14-cores Xeon (so a workstation, not a server: the advantage is that it's totally quiet) |
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| ▲ | maccard 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | That's pretty mental. Those Xeon E5's are 50w at idle, plus 10w for the 10Gb Ethernet, before you add any storage. A core 3 N300 is 1/10 of the power usage, for ~85% of the performance. Integrity at the filesystem level is required _anyway_ but if you want ECC ram, there's a bunch of AMD processors with similar power usage. | | |
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| ▲ | iamshs 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| If I have CPU power at my disposal, why should I waste it? I love the fact that my NAS can serve my other needs too. |
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| ▲ | dijit 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Sure, but then shouldn’t they have a lower power CPU? I’d be worried about starving my storage need for CPU (ZFS can use a good amount of CPU power) inadvertently. Running some small services is nice, to avoid having more devices, but I think people want “server with storage” and not actually a NAS, which on the face of it is growing out from nothing more than an SMB share. | | |
| ▲ | izacus 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Lower power CPUs are very powerful nowadays. Like the one in your phone - it sips power and can do what a full server could do a decade ago. | | |
| ▲ | dijit 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | storage has also increased (thus, its management overheads). And, to be honest with you, I’d prefer phones that are battery powered get the 3nm process node and these kind of devices lagging on 7nm or whatever, since they have the capability to be powered from the wall, and you can have less consumptive cpus taking a larger spaces making a bit more heat/power per cycle: but since you need less you can get away with it. Not everything can be 3nm or lower, the yields aren't good enough. What I care more about is ECC. | |
| ▲ | lostlogin 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | The rumoured Apple server (for their use, not for customers) makes me sad. I want one. Apple silicon with some other os would be an amazing low power nas. |
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| ▲ | inigyou 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Do you run services on your home router, your cellphone, and your microwave just because they have CPUs? | | |
| ▲ | ericd 26 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Your home router is a pretty good place to run some services… Highly recommend running VPN so you can access your home network from anywhere. | |
| ▲ | fragmede 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | My microwave, unfortunately, is closed source. However my home router runs a web server, and my cellphone runs a service called Airdrop, when I turn it on. |
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| ▲ | crabbone 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| You missed the point the author really complains about: soldered in memory chips create a single point of failure. What you quoted needs to be seen in the context of what author calls "increasing media demands". I.e. the author believes that while the way the system is configured might be OK today, it won't be OK in the future. |
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| ▲ | Ekaros an hour ago | parent [-] | | Memory chips failing to me sounds like extremely bizarre fear. Memory has been extremely reliable for long time now. It is much more likely any other component on same mainboard failing than memory. | | |
| ▲ | crabbone 17 minutes ago | parent [-] | | It still makes it a single point of failure... | | |
| ▲ | Ekaros 16 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Every single component in NAS which breaking stops operation is single point of failure. So should those all too be socket mounted? |
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| ▲ | 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
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