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petcat 8 hours ago

I was shocked to read how late even several prominent European countries abolished it. Most northern US states abolished slavery even before Britain, France, Portugal, and (especially) Spain did.

wahern 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Serfdom wasn't legally abolished in Russia until 1861. Slavery was technically abolished in the late 1700s, but in some areas serfs were still bought and sold like chattel until the end of serfdom.

The Ottoman Empire legally abolished slavery in the 1880s, but there was still illicit yet tolerated slavery in Turkey into the 1930s.

I think in some areas of the Sahel chattel slavery may still exist as a practical matter. Mauritania didn't legally abolish chattel slavery until 1981, for example, but as in other areas it can take decades for reality to match the law, given the laws were often changed under international pressure rather than reflecting any change to the domestic social order.

hylaride 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Serfdom continued in practice in Russia for decades and often serfs became indebted to the landowners in a form of financial bondage that pretty much lasted until the Russian revolution, where...well things didn't get much better for them.

The fact that serfdom de-facto remained is one of the primary reasons Russia's industrialization lagged the rest of Europe for so long as factories didn't get the initial cheap labour. It was only finally fully picking up steam (pun not intended) when WW1 broke out.

spwa4 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

And, today, in the whole middle east everyone, from governments to individual families, keep getting "embarassed" by having it turn that that they're "holding servants". And then it happens again. And again. And again. Daesh/IS "brought back" slavery (which is one reason bringing back terror brides, some of whom exploited slaves while in the middle east, is such a judicial nightmare. What do you do with a legally Australian girl, now a mother of 4, who lived for 2 years in Iraq, bought and sold slaves, exploited some them to "run the household", and killed/worked to death one of them?)

Slavery is abolished everywhere in the middle east ("except" Daesh/islamic state), and yet this keeps happening. Example after example after example:

https://www.hrw.org/news/2025/06/12/fifas-world-cup-ignores-...

https://www.freedomunited.org/news/repression-modern-slavery...

https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/Documents/HRBodies...

https://www.ohchr.org/en/stories/2014/12/domestic-servitude-...

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cpw5v077nyjo

https://www.hrw.org/report/2016/07/13/i-was-sold/abuse-and-e...

https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/10/22/united-arab-emirates-tra...

https://www.hrw.org/report/2020/08/24/how-can-we-work-withou...

https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2017/11/libya-must-e...

Oh and the royal families keep getting caught in "even more embarrassing" incidents.

Here is Saudi Arabia having a royal murder a slave for perceived insults, then forcing UK governments to allow and forgive the murder (by taking nationals hostage then organizing a "prisoner swap")

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9674420/Saudi-...

Or Qatar:

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20200619-qatar-prince-accu...

Or Iranian and Iraqi imams and mullahs selling children, girls, but apparently even including the occasional boy, into child prostitution, functioning as pimps and exploiters:

https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/Documents/Issues/W...

Frankly, these days it seems to be quite normal for countries to just sign whatever treaty anyone wants signed ... and just ignore it. Vilifying anyone calling them out on it as culturally insensitive and in all cases ignoring them.

crote 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This isn't very surprising.

The vast majority of slaves went to the New World, so that's where most of its effects were felt. Of the 12.5M people kidnapped from Africa, only ~9000 went to the Old World. It just wasn't as obvious of a problem in Europe itself.

An interesting side-effect of this is that a lot of European countries have two relevant dates: the first being the banning of slave trade, the second being the banning of slavery. For example, the UK prohibited any involvement in the Atlantic slave trade in 1807, but slavery in the UK itself was only abolished in 1833.

rightbyte 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Abducted and enslaved? Doesn't kidnapping imply kids?

ShinyLeftPad 4 hours ago | parent [-]

It doesn't imply kids (or napping). Nancy Guthrie is 84 https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/fbi-determine...

rightbyte 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Oh. Yeah I thought it was slang language use but it seems like it is used for adults too over the board. I mainly wanted to point out that adults were victims also.

_DeadFred_ 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

In addition muslim traders also exported as many as 17 million slaves to the coast of the Indian Ocean, the Middle East, and North Africa.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/1523100.stm

cyphar 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The abolition of slavery in the US is unfortunately a more complicated story than most people are aware.

The 13th amendment removed the legal concept of slavery (except for convicts) but it was still not a crime to do slavery. Slavery changed shape many times over the years since the civil war (usually involving convicting black people under sham crimes and then selling them as debt slaves or forcing them to sign contracts that rendered them slaves under threat of being convicted for said sham crimes) and can only reasonably be said to have actually ended in the US after Pearl Harbour when concerns that it would be used as enemy propaganda caused the Justice Department to properly prosecute slave owners (see Circular 3591[1]).

The last chattel slave in the US was Alfred Irving[2] and he was released in late 1942. He was kept in chains and was permanently disfigured due to constant physical abuse from his owners. He died in 1960.

[3] is a very comprehensive video essay about the topic.

[1]: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Circular_No._3591 [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Irving_(former_slave) [3]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4kI2h3iotA

hokkos 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Serfdom was abolished in the Kingdom of France in 1315.

throw_m239339 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You'd be shocked how much of our "friends" in MENA still have legal slavery for non citizens. When an employer can legally confiscate someone's passport and one can only leave the country with their authorization, it is slavery.

I have no idea why we in the west consider that normal and look the other way... What am I saying, I know, oil & VC money...

Some of them also bring their Filipino, India, Nepali, or African slave maids in Europe and everybody looks the other way, they have too much money to be criticized...

They are so brazen about slavery they routinely sell their slaves on Instagram or Facebook ads, with copies such as "doesn't need much food","will sleep on the floor", "will work 20 hours a day"...

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50228549

> "African worker, clean and smiley," said one listing. Another: "Nepalese who dares to ask for a day off."

> When speaking to the sellers, the undercover team frequently heard racist language. "Indians are the dirtiest," said one, describing a woman being advertised.

They are dehumanized at first place, but the level of racism in these places, on top of all that is shocking...

fmbb 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> When an employer can confiscate someone's passport and one can only leave the country with their authorization, it is slavery.

This happens in Europe as well.

It is not legal, but it is the only way the Scandinavian berry market works at all. You don’t even need a huge market for this to be allowed to happen. You just need _a_ market and workers that are desperate enough to be tricked.

RetroTechie 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

On a side note: be VERY suspicious if you ever come across a situation, where person identified by a passport, does not keep (more exactly: control) it themselves. This is a big red flag you've encountered some sort of exploitative (and possibly illegal) situation. Please remember!

Quoting from my own passport:

"The bearer of this passport may pass it to a third party only if there is a statutory obligation to do so".

Denying the freedom of an employee to end a work relation with their employer & leave, does not pass that bar.

runsWphotons 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is completely a figment of your imagination.

manarth 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Passport confiscation is a common sign of modern slavery.

    "he was lured in with the false promise of a well-paid job in the UK"
    "The gang confiscated the passports of all their victims"
It's not legal. There are definitions of "Modern Slavery" and descriptions of the practices and warning signs because it is still an issue in contemporary times, including in Europe.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2kdg84zj4wo

regenschutz 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No, it's real. Every year, there are several news articles about berry pickers being abused, at least here in Sweden (not sure about the other Scandinavian countries). Here's [0] just ONE of the myriad of articles I could find, but there are so, so, so many more (and even worse ones) [1].

[0]: (In Swedish) Berry entrepreneurs suspected of trafficking Thai nationals, (2025). https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/vasternorrland/barforetag-...

[1]: (In Swedish) Berry pickers (Topic). https://www.svt.se/nyheter/om/barplockare

Both are from SVT, the public broadcaster in Sweden.

ronjakoi 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Similar situation in Finland. There have only recently been some consequences for the berry companies and reforms are underway. The pickers would come mainly from Thailand with tourist visas. This year a majority of the visas have been denied and the berry companies are throwing tantrums.

They've been engaging in illegal price-fixing, too.

insane_dreamer 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The difference is that in Sweden it happens but at least it's illegal. In Dubai there's nothing illegal about it and therefore much more widespread.

6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
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insane_dreamer 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Most northern US states abolished slavery even before Britain, France, Portugal, and (especially) Spain did

Sort of. France and England abolished slavery within their own territories before the US states did, but it did not extend to their colonies until later. France banned slavery within its home territory back in the 1300s (Free Soil Principle), but continued with slavery through its "Code Noir" (Black Code) in its colonies, where slavery was not permanently abolished until 1848 (it was abolished at the time of the French Revolution but then reinstated by Napoleon). England abolished slavery at home in the mid 1700s but not in its colonies until 1834.

(Like the US North, England and France had very small populations of Africans/others, so it was relatively painless and easy to ban slavery there, while continuing to accept slavery "elsewhere". For the US North "elsewhere" was the South, for England and France it was their colonies. Same principle though.)

Along the same lines, slavery of Catholics was forbidden in Europe all the way back in the Middle Ages. So it was acknowledged to be something bad, that Christians should not do to each other. But slavery of "infidels", heathen/pagan/Muslims/etc., was OK - and not only okay but sanctioned by Romanus Pontifex in the 1400s granting Portugal the authority to enslave "pagans" (basically all non-Europeans) along the coast of Africa. (Incidentally, as some Africans converted to Christianity, this posed a problem (they were no longer pagan and couldn't be enslaved), and so eventually it shifted to being about race and skin color rather than religion.)

_DeadFred_ 3 hours ago | parent [-]

I wonder if this position was taken from the Muslim slaver behavior who had been conquering/enslaving Christians for quite a while at that point. Especially as Spain was being taken back from Muslim colonizers at that time, and you have lands that had been under Muslim practices (enslaving non-muslims) now having the roles reversed but perhaps the engrained Islamic thought (only enslave non-believers) entrenched.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saqaliba