Not only does it irritate me not having it in a practical sense, it’s also an arrogance on behalf of the manufacturer. “We can do it better than iOS/Android”, or “We have a better reason to do it”. No, and No.

▲ bingo-bongo 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I’ve had ~15 cars over the past 25 years, different make and models, some really cheap, some fairly expensive. One thing they all have in common: their terrible infotainment UI.

I’m sure they are trying and it has gotten slightly better lately - but it’s still not great imho. If they really want to do it better than Apple etc., they seriously need to up their game - and I really wish they would, but I don’t see that happening, the cost is too high.

	▲	Telaneo 15 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Even if they can do better, will it be better than Carplay in 10 years? Or 20? Will I get free GPS map updates for that long? Some brands don't even do OTA updates, so you'd have to get your car in for a service if there's a new feature or bug fix in an update you care about. I'd never want to do that for a map fix when I could just use Carplay where Google Maps (or whatever else) has already fixed it. And even if they do OTA updates, they won't be updating those maps in 10 years, much less 20.
	▲	ExoticPearTree 44 minutes ago \| parent \| prev \| next [-]
		I don't think they can. The infotainment is outsourced to who knows where and those people develop based on specs sent by the manufacturer: as cheap as possible and as fast as possible. Unless you actually spend time understanding what people want, how they want it, if they like it or not, you cannot have a superior product. I have a newish car (2023 make) with an Android based infotainment system: the built-in maps move so slow, no online updates (I have to use a stick to update them once a year) and so on. Basically they put it there I think out of habit, not that the majority of their customer demand in-car navigation as a must to buy it.
	▲	throwaway2037 an hour ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		`> I’ve had ~15 cars over the past 25 years` That is a lot of cars! Why so many?

▲ _factor 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That’s just a line. More like, “We can collect our own data”, or “We can lock them in and collect subscription fees.”

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grumbelbart2 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Mostly the second point.

They already collect and track you, even with car play. I strongly recommend this CCC talk, where they hacked a Volkswagen database that contained unfiltered, high-accuracy, timestamped locations of a large majority of electric cars from VW group.

Based on that they were, for example, able to identify cars owned by members of Germany's security apparatus: where they work, where they live, where they drop off their children each morning. Who visited brothels.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGzoXbbth0s&t=30m

	▲	lII1lIlI11ll 11 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Just curious, are car manufacturers required to obtain explicit consent from owners for collecting such data according to GDPR? Or German car lobby's pocket politicians were able to carve out some exception for them?
	▲	bdavbdav 3 hours ago \| parent \| prev \| next [-]
		The frustrating thing is I bet they’re still tracking and collecting this when you stop paying for the tracking / telematics.
	▲	vincnetas 2 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		good thing that brothels are legal in germany.

▲ hamburglar 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

They all think they can do better, and it is sheer arrogance, because even the best of them is utter garbage compared to software that is actually built with fast iteration, UX research, and real user testing. No car manufacturers do a good job of this, and they all bake their atrocious UX into a $50k piece of hardware you keep for decades and which *never* gets a significant software update. The fact that they don’t see how impossible it is for them to win at this game is why they will never win. Sorry Rivian. Your vehicle is great but you’re handicapping yourself with software hubris.

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throwaway2037 an hour ago | parent [-]

I hear so many complaints here on HN about "car UX". I am not a Tesla fanboy, but lots of people who review Teslas say they have great "car UX". Can you share some specifics about what you don't like?

	▲	lotsofpulp a minute ago \| parent [-]
		I used to be a person who thought I would never buy a car without Carplay, and Tesla won me over.