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winterismute 4 hours ago

Indeed, I find quite ironic that some people in tech in the US complain about EU "regulations first" approach, but then their government seem to arbitrarily stop things from being released because, well, there is no established policy on safety guarantees or other similar aspects.

tptacek 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I see it too, but worth noting that this is basically unprecedented at least within the last 25 years; I think you have to go back to export controlled cryptography for another example of this kind of abrupt and targeted regulation.

jameshart 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

We’ve seen more examples recently. TikTok, wireless routers, polestar cars…

boelboel an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Huawei, Foreign gambling sites were banned on dubious reasons in 2006 (in reality American companies weren't as competitive and las Vegas needed to be protected), Japanese electronic tariffs in the 80s/90s ...

US never exactly believe in full on 'free trade'.

smallmancontrov an hour ago | parent | next [-]

The US believed in free trade precisely when the politically connected needed labor arbitrage, and protectionism exactly when the politically connected needed protection. The pretense of underlying ideals was never more than a political tool - political economy was always political.

wwalexander an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Japanese electronic tariffs in the 80s

Also motorcycles. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1983_motorcycle_tariff

tehjoker an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"Kicking Away the Ladder: Development Strategy in Historical Perspective by Ha-Joon Chang"

"How did the rich countries really become rich? In this provocative study, Ha-Joon Chang examines the great pressure on developing countries from the developed world to adopt certain 'good policies' and 'good institutions', seen today as necessary for economic development. His conclusions are compelling and disturbing: that developed countries are attempting to 'kick away the ladder' with which they have climbed to the top, thereby preventing developing countries from adopting policies and institutions that they themselves have used."

https://www.amazon.com/Kicking-Away-Ladder-Development-Persp...

oblio 25 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

The entire US auto industry is predicated on protectionism. Without it the Japanese would have wiped out GM/Ford/Chrysler in the 1980s, and now the Chinese in the 2020s-2030s.

dv_dt 24 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

See the Chicken tax for trucks for a not so recent example https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax

frollogaston an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

TikTok ban was the worst one because it was about speech, not trade or security. If the bill said "China banned our social media so we're gonna ban theirs in reciprocity," that'd be a way more valid reason.

munk-a 22 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

It's also super annoying being collateral damage in America's war on free speech. Canadian TikTok is now also being similarly moderated for content unfriendly of your administration. I guess we're still in a position of privilege where we can grow domestic social platforms to compete while American simply have no alternatives - anything that grows sufficiently large will be turned towards similar propaganda aims.

petre 26 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Instagram is just as worse.

martinjc 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

A real headscratcher isn't it? And from a government that is supposedly priding itself on small government. How should companies navigate this? What's the framework they should operate within?

kommunicate an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Claiming the mantle of "small government" was simply an exercise in marketing to relax regulation meant to prevent bribery and corruption. In practice, the current slate of government officials believes in absolute control of whatever they want whenever they want.

It's a mirror case of the supposed "free speech absolutists" who immediately turned around and silenced, sued, fired or jailed once granted the power to do so.

heylook 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Small governments don't deploy thousands of military troops into their own cities.

shimman 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

[flagged]

newfriend an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

One of the few roles a "small government" should actually take on is defending from invaders.

NonHyloMorph 5 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

You are misled/misleading. Get informed about the political theory of domestic deployment of troops for the purpose of policing in western democracues. Look how those who speak for the U.S. military personell (former generals, the editorial of that magazine they produce in the U.S. army prior to being pruned) if you need some motivation.

jeremyjh 22 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Are the invaders in the room with us right now?

oblio 24 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Which invaders? Has the Iran War taken a 180 degree turn?

sph 16 minutes ago | parent [-]

Until a few minutes ago, Iran did technically win the war.

dboreham 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's only small government when they are trying to not give money to some group they don't like.

2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
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outside1234 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

It's almost like he expects bribes to release the model, but I'm just being paranoid.

babypuncher an hour ago | parent | next [-]

This whole administration is absolutely rampant with corruption. Just yesterday we had JD Vance on TV saying that if Watergate happened today, it would just be a 12 hour news story, because they are getting away with so much worse.

Anyone who denies or defends this administration's corruption is complicit.

NamlchakKhandro an hour ago | parent [-]

Same can be said about the previous

exe34 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Anthropic peace prize coming up next.

WesBrownSQL 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Munitions exporting. I fondly remember the PGP feasco. I spent years using PGP to encrypt my emails to several people who refused to use email without it. Good times.

shimman 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Unprecedented? This is very much precedented and has been the end goal when you disallow regulations and public input when it comes to technology proliferation. When was the last time the public had an ability to direct technology in the US?

This is the result of private interests working authoritarian governments (hint, it rhymes with classism).

drcongo an hour ago | parent [-]

Nazism?

jopsen an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Competent government wouldn't do this either... ...also why I think it won't last.

Doubtful it'd hold in court; this admin would have to show that it's not corruption, because we'd all assume otherwise.

tehlike 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

release the weights! freedom of speech!

jdiff 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Whose speech? Nobody with the weights is trying to speak them.

tehlike 2 hours ago | parent [-]

it was a joke.

mrngld 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah, that's what we need, frontier intelligence models open in the wild that, if a jailbreak is reliably established, there's no possibility for anyone to ever patch at the API layer. Because there is no API layer.

tptacek 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

"This stack of 15.3 million t-shirts is a munition."

tehlike 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I was thinking more the first amendment, but second works too.

tptacek 2 hours ago | parent [-]

IYKYK :)

girvo 34 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

I still have mine :)

paulsutter an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Between $5-10T of the US economy is subject to export controls. Nobody disputes that Mythos is dual-use technology, which means it has been export controlled since the day it was created.

Companies are responsible for demonstrating criteria to export (for example) a nerfed version (Fable) of an export controlled item (Mythos)

Nothing here is novel, unusual, capricious, or … fascisistic.

ronsor 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This arrangement is already dubiously legal. The government is already being sued over the Fable incident with Anthropic.

No amount of rules can stop people who are willing to break them. Only enforcement can.

peter422 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Anthropic just needs to donate millions of dollars to a “MAGA Inc” like Greg Brockman did and they’ll get regulated properly from now on.

It’s a perfectly good system for government regulation.

kashunstva an hour ago | parent | next [-]

In some cases, even just bringing a 24K gold desk ornament to the WH is enough; but I suspect these tributes to Dear Leader are subject to inflation, possibly exponentially so.

alfiedotwtf 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

$100 Million to The Trump Foundation, and Anthropic get to become the US AI Regulator

boredatoms 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Or perhaps threaten to donate $10b to the DNC

Goronmon 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That threat will probably result in a DOJ investigation into everyone involved until they hit something they think they can prosecute someone for, even if it's not true.

boredatoms an hour ago | parent [-]

That makes sense

They could double down though, like actually follow through with just 1b and then threaten to do an extra 1b periodically until the investigations are dropped

outside1234 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It looks like Greg needs to make another deposit to the fuhrer

thegreatpeter 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

colinbooks 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

always important to compare things that are actively happening to things that didn’t

hilariously 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Probably not personal bribery?

moomin 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And enforcement cannot work if you’ve captured all three estates.

nostrademons 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Did you mean this in the French Revolution sense (the clergy, the nobility, and the commoners) or in the American sense (the legislative, judicial, and executive branches)?

The French Revolution sense would be an ironic counterpoint, because the Revolutionaries did end up capturing all three estates, only to fall to someone (Napoleon) who captured the military, which wasn't considered one of the "three estates" because at the start of the French Revolution destroying civil society, enacting a military dictatorship, and starting a series of wars throughout Europe was considered outside the Overton Window.

This perhaps holds some lessons for America today.

tialaramex 2 hours ago | parent [-]

I think there is a layer of truth to the idea that MAGA captured what England would call the Fourth Estate, the News Media.

England is weird because its model looks like that French model, except that it intertwines the nobility and clergy. Basically an Archbishop and a Earl both sit in Parliament as Lords, while the Commoners control only the Commons of the Parliament. Now today the Commons runs things, but that's relatively modern, in the 19th Century it was completely normal for the Prime Minister to be a Lord, and while some of them were only technically Lords, having in fact been elected but just also nobility anyway for one reason or another, or being ennobled while serving as PM because nobody thought that was a bad idea - others were never elected at all.

So weirdly the place which came up with the "Fourth Estate" only really had two other estates, although everyone reading will have known about the French concept too.

In the era when Lords routinely become PM (it would still be legal to do this today, but it's hard to imagine it happening, although the Tories did give a Lord one of the Great Offices of State so never say never) almost all those Lords were born into it. Today basically nobody sat in the Lords was born to it (there are about two dozen left, when they die or retire that's the end of it) but there are still always a dozen or so bishops, and Iran is ironically the only other place [except the Vatican which barely counts] where religious leaders are in government by fiat in the modern world...

Edited to mention the Vatican before somebody else does.

vkou an hour ago | parent [-]

MAGA has captured the media, if not entirely by design, but entirely in practice.

Thanks to a combination of attacks from the executive, attacks from the oligarchs (Buy a paper and fire everyone who says things you don't like), or the simple fact that sane-washing MAGA insanity sells papers, the 'independent' press is everything but.

It is non-stop carrying water for the most insane lunacy, and is trying to convince us that it is fine and normal and desirable.

nostrademons 30 minutes ago | parent [-]

So I find claims that MAGA (or any other group) has captured the media to be self-contradictory: if they actually had, you would not be writing that, and I would not be able to read it. By definition. Capturing the media means that there is only one official narrative, and the population is completely unaware of anything outside of that narrative. Like the period from ~1950-1995, where you had the big 3 TV networks, and then each city had their own newspaper that basically owned a local monopoly, and they all basically printed/aired the same stories and same viewpoints.

IMHO what we're actually seeing is a huge fragmentation of the 4th estate. There is now a viewpoint on the Internet for everything, no matter how insane. That's part of what people don't like about it. This fragmentation of media has allowed airtime for MAGA views that would've been considered far outside the Overton Window just a decade ago, but that was the point of the Internet. And it's not really to the exclusion of other views, it's just that you have to go looking for the other views.

mvdtnz 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

But your government is constantly acting illegally. Isn't it time for Americans to... do something? It's clear that your legal framework isn't working.

nearlyepic an hour ago | parent [-]

Do what, exactly? Throw away our lives? 40% of the nation would rather die than vote for anyone other than a racist, and another 40% would tsk-tsk and say “that’s not how you’re supposed to do it”. There’s no revolution coming to save the day.

autoexec 15 minutes ago | parent [-]

> Do what, exactly? Throw away our lives?

I think the founding fathers were pretty clear about what the American people are expected to do if the systems they put into place aren't enough to preserve freedom. If the colonists had just bent over and spread their cheeks saying "We sure hate being fucked but oh well! what else can we do? Throw away our lives?" we'd still have a king instead of just a wannabe. I'd be very nice if things don't come to that, but ultimately the responsibility to preserve our freedom and democracy is ours. It seems like there are plenty of people lined up to take them from us if we're willing to surrender it. The problem we have now is an uncomfortably large minority seem happy to do just that.

darig 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

brookst 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It would only be ironic of you assume those same people who thing the EU over-regulates also support this US government regulation.

It's N=1, but I believe both that the EU approach discourages investment and innovation in the EU, and that this US policy will do the same in the US.

9dev 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It’s a bit in general, because if you actually read the EU AI legislation, most of it follows the right ideas and provides more safety, in the sense that OpenAI and Anthropic used to pretend to care about, but never really did.

brookst 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The ideas are debatable but generally correct. The EU's problem is that regulation stops at the ideas, and it is intentionally designed so to be impossible to ensure compliance in advance. So the regulation is really after the fact and a subjective judgment by regulators. So there's tons of risk even if you genuinely believe you're complying with the prescribed intents.

My opinion on EU regulation would flip 180 degrees if they offered any kind of pre-clearance where you could propose a product, feature, or policy and be told in advance if it meets their subjective requirements.

IMO you can have clear, specific requirements in advance, or you can have a body that provides interpretations of spirit-of-the-rules regulations in advance. Having neither is a problem.

(yes, I'm aware of the argument that if you tell companies what's legal in advance they will just do the bare minimum or find loopholes... I don't find that to be a legit rule of law system)

9dev 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I understand that desire entirely, but I’m not sure if it would work that way. Take an ISO 27001 certification (or SOC, if you like): There is no one clear set of things to do, but both guidance and requirements that you need to address and be able to defend your concrete implementation.

And I generally like that a lot better than having a set of hard this-way-or-no-way checklists that invariably consist of 80% bullshit ceremony for giant corporations. ISO nudges you toward that too, but if you’re able to deliver the same security guarantees with less, auditors will usually be happy.

The same, in general, works for GDPR regulations as well: The law is mostly about doing the right things, but not spelling out the billions of cases and permutations and strategic decisions involving privacy in one way or another.

dreamfactored 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

It's deliberately not prescriptive as the implementers are the ones best placed to solve for requirements - you don't want policy makers providing technical checklists. And it's not unstructured - ISO 42001 essentially encodes it.

Aerroon 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

With the way things are, having to disclose training data will basically make it impossible for an EU AI to compete.

9dev 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Im not happy with the AI act in entirety either, but my point was that it’s hard to read it and say "this isn’t generally the right thing to do", where right means responsible and beneficial to society as a whole.

criddell an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Maybe this is a good opportunity for the European AI companies to jump ahead?

jessepasley 24 minutes ago | parent [-]

Lol

dopidopHN2 4 minutes ago | parent [-]

The US is already behind and has been technically. Can't wait for that part to sink in. This start to be a source of second hand embarrassment when I see US folk think their country is still leading the race technically.

dylan604 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Is it really ironic or just yet another example of how the current administration just keep finding ways to line their pockets? Big Tech has lots of money, and they'd just like to get a little taste. Placing arbitrary restrictions is a pretty good motivator for those being restricted to find some way to make necessary contributions.

al_borland an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> there is no established policy on safety guarantees

Which is the government’s own fault.

Elon Musk talked back in 2018 about how he went to Washington and met with Obama and Congress, but they did nothing.

In 2020 Andrew Yang’s entire run for president was centered around the risk of AI displacing job. He lost, no one did anything.

A couple years later we say the consumer facing LLMs start to roll out. Still, no one does anything.

They have time to micromanage the industry, but in all these years they haven’t found the time to establish any meaningful policy?

frollogaston an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I'm fine with this in principle, it's more like regulations last. They looked at the end result and decided it was too powerful to let loose. But also expect the Trump administration to unfairly use it as leverage against US corps.

Meanwhile EU prevented itself from building competitive LLMs in the first place.

yapyap an hour ago | parent [-]

its the typical US regulations for consumer but not for corporations, disgusting

refulgentis 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Our AI czar, David Sacks, whined and moaned about the idea of regulation, even said Anthropic begging for some guidance was asking for “regulatory capture” and was gloating about how right he was they wanted it, 2 weeks ago.

I wonder if he understands why, now.

GaryBluto 4 hours ago | parent [-]

> Anthropic begging for some guidance

Anthropic was "begging" to make it harder for competing companies to be founded.

ronsor 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They got the "leopards ate my face" ending.

refulgentis 4 hours ago | parent [-]

No, it’s not leopards ate my face / irony / comeuppance, because that would involve regulation.

I understand it’s very satisfying if you wanted Anthropic “punished” for asking for real regulation to see this. I can’t deny there was a little bit of me at first that felt that way.

It’s untenable, a first order reaction, that I regret intellectually, because if you were against regulation, you’re certainly against waves whatever this is.

ronsor 3 hours ago | parent [-]

I don't want anyone being punished. I want everyone to stop acting stupid.

I would've much preferred if Dario hadn't run his mouth so much.

blackqueeriroh 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

You actually think that would’ve changed things? I don’t. We’d still be here.

refulgentis 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Your position is “he made it happen by saying he didn’t want it to happen” with maybe a side order of “when he knows Mr. Trump doesn’t like him”

I posit that these ideas are common, and come from a place of Mr. Trump is more or less a normal president because they all do bad stuff, and regulation is Creating Monopilies. To wit, there’s 0 reason to believe the person you originally replied to’s claim that Anthropic wanted to kill startups. It’s just a random implication of what bad regulation can do.

gsibble 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Exactly.

refulgentis 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Source for this? :)

WarmWash 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

On some level though we have to be cognizant of the potential for harm these models have.

LLMs are still a little loosey goosey, and we are right on the cusp (if not there already) for an agent to hack a bank and steal money for some rando teenager with a penchant for jail breaking.

The regulations are and will be negative, but don't lose sight of what LLMs can do off the leash.

yunwal 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> On some level

The appropriate level would be regulation though? Like I just don't get how we can argue that arbitrarily throttling companies is ok.

WarmWash 3 hours ago | parent [-]

OpenAI fired the starting gun 3.5 years ago before anyone in the industry had a sound safety plan, and not much progress has been made since.

So here we are, it's probably going to me messy and err on the side of over-bearing.

yunwal 3 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm fine with erring on the side of overbearing, as long as it's not blatant cronyism

mrngld 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Too overbearing though and you get... Mistral? A continent that hasn't been on the leading edge of anything (other that expansion of the regulatory state) for decades, and Europe feels it in their employment numbers.

Current French (8.2%), Spanish (10.3%) or even Swedish (8.6%) unemployment would count as a disastrous recession in the US. In the US we call 2007-09 the "Great Recession", which peaked at 10.0%, and that relatively brief time left a generational mark. That's a somewhat routine number by EU standards.

Not to mention you end up with bizarre effects. If the UK were admitted as the 51st state it'd immediately be the poorest. (Yes, some EU countries are wealthy, but they're also the size of US counties, if we cherry pick just Manhattan we could make some spectacular comparisons too)

So, it's a complex issue but the tradeoffs are absolutely tangible yet often dismissed.

5upplied_demand an hour ago | parent [-]

> Current French (8.2%), Spanish (10.3%) or even Swedish (8.6%) unemployment

This obviously doesn't tell the whole story, because it only measures people actively in the workforce. Meanwhile, a far larger portion of Sweden's population is actually employed compared to the US.

Sweden's laborforce participation rate is 76% and in the US it is 62%. Sweden's employment rate is 69% and US's is 59%. Which statistics are more important?

Edit: had wrong employment rate

matt123456789 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Bank should be more secure, if a random person with an LLM can hack them, they should have paid 100 random blue teamers with LLMs to hack them first to get more secure. Not AI's fault.

itintheory an hour ago | parent | next [-]

> blue teamers

Pretty sure you mean red team here. While I've heard people refer to any offensive security (eg including blackhat) as 'red team' , it typically means people you've hired or contracted to try to break into your systems, whereas the blue team are people you've hired to build and operate your security defenses. Red and blue team are both your employees / contractors but perform different functions.

SpicyLemonZest an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

The purpose of policies like this is precisely to ensure that those 100 runs do happen first, rather than allowing a free-for-all where they have to race to secure their systems.

jazzyjackson 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Robbing banks is already illegal

bee_rider 2 hours ago | parent [-]

But we’re entering a somewhat weird situation where a careless/dumb person might actually rob a bank by legitimate accident.

derwiki 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That’s why I’m selling OpenClaw insurance! /s

Barrin92 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>but don't lose sight of what LLMs can do off the leash.

there is no such thing as an LLM "off the leash", it's not a dog, and even if it was a dog the person responsible is the owner. What is this bizarre attitude to a piece of software that makes people think existing laws don't apply?

If your LLM agent hacks a bank, you have hacked a bank, you will go to prison and that's entirely sufficient. People have been hacking banks for decades now, it didn't require the government to regulate C compilers and Emacs.

jstanley 2 hours ago | parent [-]

This is overly reductive.

If your web browser hacks a bank, but you didn't know and didn't expect it to, have you hacked a bank? Why is an LLM different? What happened to mens rea?

autoexec 2 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

A web browser can't decide to hack a bank anymore than a LLM can. Neither have any understanding of what a bank is or any will to act on their own. The person who instructs/uses a web browser to hack a bank (even if it's someone else's browser) commits the crime.

girvo 22 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

> If your web browser hacks a bank, but you didn't know and didn't expect it to, have you hacked a bank?

Depends, as usual. Intent can matter, but depends on the statute (and jurisdiction) in question.

2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]
basisword 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This applies to most things when it comes to the USG/citizens. Protectionism is communist unless they do it. Thinking about developing a nuke? Well bomb you first despite being the only people to ever use them. Free speech and press - unless we don’t like what you say.

alberto467 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Let’s be real, as an EU citizen I have zero doubts that those models would also have been blocked if developed in EU.

I like the US approach better: regulate when the need for it arises, not before when you don’t know how the situation is going to evolve.

ascorbic 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They're not regulating though – they're arbitrarily blocking releases based on no clear criteria. The EU may be legalistic and rules-based, but I'd take that over capricious and arbitrary.

axus 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It would be really nice if the executive were blocking these releases based on some authority the legislative had granted it.

MichaelZuo 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Yeah it seems very shady to do it this way… far worse than the EU.

The fact that they couldn’t clear an already low bar is a really bad sign.

blackqueeriroh 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Yes, Trump is the worstPresident we’ve had, the Supreme Court is captured by conservatives, the Republicans would rather die than vote against Trump, we know all of this.

It’s bad, okay? And it’s not usually like this.

brookst 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The EU is nothing but capricious and arbitrary. Much of the DMA and similar is pure vibes that you can't know if you violated until the regulators do their divinations months or years after you shipped.

LastTrain 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You can’t be serious because “When the need arises” means when your company does not lavish praise on the current administration.

harimau777 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Regulating when the need arises requires also compensating the people who get hurt in the meantime.

TheAtomic 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It sounds nice but you end up with entrenched special interests that later oppose all regulation regardless of the consequences. We have pesticides you wouldn't want anywhere near your children casually used to control weeds on kid's playgrounds, insanely huge trucks that kill hundred each year, the food is garbage...the list is long and tiresome. Trust me brother, if I could live in the EU, I would.

fl0id 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If they were real about risk, they would have to block a lot more models.

JoshTriplett 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> regulate when the need for it arises

I agree. But that need has absolutely arisen. The US government is not exactly the best steward for this kind of thing, but some model other than "race each other as fast as we can" is desperately needed here.

psychoslave 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Let's plan a fire fighter division only once we are actually having some buildings in the city burning down. That people who fear that ridiculous perfectly controlled fire in chemines are ridiculous.