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doctorzook a day ago

This seems... troubling to me.

Essentially, the judge found that this qualifies as fair use because (a) publishing this with commentary is "transformative" even through "Defendants used the exact, unaltered [photo] in the blog post"; (b) "the blog post is not focused on the [photo]"; and (c) "there is no indication that [the use] impacted or has potential to impact the market or value of the Photo".

As an amateur photographer, this doesn't give me warm fuzzy feelings about posting anything I shoot online. By the reasoning here, a company (as in the commercial site here) can use my photos so long as the use is incidental and doesn't earn them too much money -- or at least impact my revenue, which is currently $0.

Heaven help me, though, should I misuse a corporation's copyrighted works, even purely personally.

bawolff a day ago | parent | next [-]

> By the reasoning here, a company (as in the commercial site here) can use my photos so long as the use is incidental and doesn't earn them too much money -- or at least impact my revenue, which is currently $0.

That is how copyright has worked since forever. This isn't something new. Copyright is primarily about protecting your ecconomic rights (and attribution rights. In some countries also the integrity of the work). Its not meant as a way for you to fully control what happens to your creative output.

This particular case does seem very borderline though, if you are selling (or potentially selling) your photos, them using it as an illustration without permission is something that would be commercially negative to you and speak against fair use. I wonder to what extent the judge wasn't thrilled to be bothered by something with so few views and as a result was more sympathetic to thd blogger. I'm somewhat doubtful this would go the same way if it wasn't about something so inconsequential.

dofm a day ago | parent | next [-]

> Copyright is primarily about protecting your ecconomic rights

One of those economic rights, somewhat inconvenient to your argument, is charging for editorial usage.

The entire function of what remains of the stock photography economy relies on the basis that usage can be billed for. Not sure how else a photographer is ever going to earn money.

If we get to "it's not as if you were making money out of it before" as an argument, which this is approximate to, then the ability to earn as a photographer is destroyed.

ShinyLeftPad 19 hours ago | parent [-]

I think it is obvious that legal system is adapting to new interests of megacorps. Some time ago they were super pro copyright, but now it's a big big problem for them.

> The blog post is transformative because “the Parker Train Photo is part of a broader work as published in the blog and accompanies fashion guidance, rather than being part of an anthology of the Photographer’s work.”

It reads like it's from parallel universe

dofm 19 hours ago | parent [-]

I know! Totally bizarre —- I think photographers' trade groups are going to have to seek some kind of clarification on that, because it's the end of the profession in the USA otherwise. Bonkers.

doctorzook a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If a company stops publishing a book or piece of software, is it free to share because there's no longer an economic interest?

gpm a day ago | parent | next [-]

It would likely weigh in favour of a finding of fair use, but by itself not be sufficient to make wholesale sharing of entire book without some other special circumstances fair use. (not a lawyer, not legal advice)

ravenical a day ago | parent | prev [-]

Well, it ought to be.

doctorzook a day ago | parent [-]

I'm okay with that. What troubles me is that there seem to be two sets of rules at play.

cratermoon a day ago | parent [-]

“The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread.” - Anatole France

"Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect." - Frank Wilhoit

RobotToaster a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>Its not meant as a way for you to fully control what happens to your creative output.

Most countries deal with this under moral rights[0], but these aren't really protected in the USA.

[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights

bawolff 19 hours ago | parent [-]

Even countries with strong moral right regimes usually have quite significant limitations on what they protect. Typically its about ensuring credit and making sure the work is presented in a way that preserves its integrity. Although there is significant variation between countries.

fsckboy a day ago | parent | prev [-]

>Copyright is primarily about protecting your ecconomic rights

no, copyright is about creating an economic right where one didn't exist before.

bawolff 19 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Copyright didn't come out of nothing, it largely evolved out of censorship regimes. Having copyright being about protecting authors economic rights instead of being about censorship or printer's ecconomic interests, was a huge step forward.

pluralmonad 21 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

So mostly it is restricting natural property rights.

msabalau a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Somehow we'll all have to endure a world where you don't post your amateur photos online because you are "troubled" that you might not be able to shake down a personal stylist for incidental use on their blog.

j-bos a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Let's not forget this was a photo of a painting.

anonred a day ago | parent [-]

It is not. https://www.artsy.net/artwork/melvin-sokolsky-parker-train

j-bos 14 hours ago | parent [-]

Ah my mistake, thanks for the correction.

z3c0 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Heaven help me, though, should I misuse a corporation's copyrighted works, even purely personally.

This imbalance is the issue. The photographer attempted to use a fraudulent system designed for the wealthy. Hopefully the loss disillusions those among us hoping for scraps. As an amateur photographer, post all you want, and expect nothing in return. If you shoot digital, keep your raw files to harvest lower-fidelty, online-ready formats. If you shoot film, you have both the scans and the negatives.

kmeisthax a day ago | parent | prev [-]

I think the judge was just reaching for an excuse to kill the lawsuit.

The reason why Fair Use exists is because we have a copyright law, a First Amendment, and common-law courts that are empowered to legislate from the bench[0]. That last bit is important: everything the courts rule can potentially become new law that binds the hands of future courts. This means the court needs to be careful when issuing their ruling.

They can't rule that the statute of limitations has passed, because the files were hosted continuously on a web server. If they did rule this way, then any online infringement can become unprosecutable so long as you keep the website up for 3 years before anyone notices.

They can't rule that it's de minimus. The whole photo was used.

They can't rule innocent infringement[1] because that requires specific facts that are not present in this case.

Normally in this sort of case, the courts would rule that a crime had been committed but not award any damages. Unfortunately, Congress decided that if you register your copyright, you are automatically entitled to an insane damage award. Otherwise, it would never be financially profitable to sue for copyright infringement in all but the most airtight cases, and copyright would be unenforceable.

The next available legal tool to dismiss the case is Fair Use, and that is so fact-intensive that you can get particularly arbitrary with what is and isn't binding precedent. In particular, the market usurpation factor (part C) can be adjusted to emphasize or de-emphasize the harm done to the original work. If a blogger uses a photo for a blog post with 43 views, there is no potential of market harm. If that same blogger gets a million views, then suddenly there IS a market harm and the courts will be more favorable to you.

My personal opinion is that the statutory damage award for registered copyright was a really fucking stupid idea. People who do not have a constructive[2] revenue stream should not be on the hook for damages they can't pay. If you want your photo off the blog post, that's one thing; but you shouldn't be able to demand life-ruining sums of money from legally careless bloggers.

Why? Because that's the basis of a very long-running extortion scheme that has been enabled by our copyright system. It started with the RIAA suing grandmas whose kids downloaded KaZaA, and only got worse from there, involving criminal enterprises started by lawyers who would upload fake porn to The Pirate Bay and then extort people who downloaded it. Really, there needs to be some kind of legal cutoff to immunize the ordinary man on the street from this bullshit while still allowing lawsuits against people actually involved in creative industry. But Congress hasn't bothered doing that. So the courts have to make it up as they go.

[0] You may have heard that certain other countries "don't have Fair Use". This is facially true because they aren't common-law countries, not because they don't have free speech. In civil-law countries the role of Fair Use is instead taken up by legislatively-granted exceptions to copyright.

[1] There is a specific defense to infringement called innocent infringement that the defense can use if they have evidence that they attempted to license the work in question.

[2] "Had or should have had", "known or should have known", etc. In law, a judge can coercively impute all sorts of things "constructively". You can have constructive knowledge, owe a constructive debt, etc.

RobotToaster a day ago | parent | next [-]

>You may have heard that certain other countries "don't have Fair Use". This is facially true because they aren't common-law countries

The UK is a common law country and technically doesn't have fair use. We have "fair dealing" exceptions, but these are stricter in than American fair use. This is in part because the laws originated from EU legislation which is normally written to suit Napoleonic law countries...

pbhjpbhj a day ago | parent [-]

I don't think Fair Dealing is strict because it derives from EU law - what makes you say that?

UK copyright legislation largely started with the Statute of Anne in 1810 (or thereabouts). I'm not sure we can blame the EU! Much of what we have now derives from ratification of the Berne Convention in the early part of the 20th Century. Although TRIPS also impacts things. The most recent changes to the CDPA 1988 derive from WIPO treaty, IIRC, rather than from EU law itself.

It has certainly felt like there has been undue influence of UK copyright from USA-based interests over the last few decades.

RobotToaster a day ago | parent [-]

The fair dealing part of the CDPA was modified later to implement the EU Information Society Directive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_and_Related_Rights_R...

leephillips a day ago | parent | prev [-]

“life-ruining sums of money from legally careless bloggers” is deterrence. Don’t do the crime if you can’t .....

crote 21 hours ago | parent [-]

So what happened to the whole "no cruel and unusual punishments" thing?

leephillips 21 hours ago | parent [-]

These are civil penalties. I wonder if the prohibition against cruel and unusual punishments applies to the (high) statutory punitive damages. Any legal scholars want to help us out?

kmeisthax 9 hours ago | parent [-]

As far as I'm aware, the 8th Amendment does not apply here. I mean, just because the punishment is high doesn't mean it's cruel, and it's certainly not unusual, if it applies to everyone. There are certainly some defendants who would not be deterred without the ability of copyright law to generate absurdly high damage awards. And, of course, nothing legally stops a court from assigning punitive damages in a copyright case. In fact, that probably would have worked out better for the Internet age than the law the MAFIAA[1] bought.

That being said, a lot of constitutional provisions don't apply the moment you step foot in a civil court. For example, you actually can be compelled to self-incriminate, 4th Amendment be damned[0], so long as it's not a criminal proceeding. Likewise, there's caselaw stating that the 8th Amendment flat-out does not apply until the US is named as a party on the lawsuit.

On the other hand, SCOTUS has also thrown out punitive damage awards on 14th Amendment due-process clause grounds. In this case[2], we even have a math formula: punitive damages cannot exceed 10x the compensatory damages. Of course, because copyright already has very high statutory damages, we rarely even need to impute punitive damages to get billion dollar awards.

This is all dancing around another question, though: why do the damages have to fit the crime and not the person? Europe assigns scaling damages based on the defendant's ability to pay, and that would neatly solve the problem of well-pocketed copyright scofflaws that Congress attempted to fix with a sledgehammer. The problem is, American law doesn't actually do this. As far as I'm aware, it's not outright unconstitutional to scale fines to income, but given that it's unusual, I could imagine SCOTUS also finding it to be cruel. I mean, you are singling out the rich for being rich, and America was built to protect the interests of the rich.

[0] When I asked Gemma 4 what it thought of an earlier version of this post, it pedantically pointed out that the only legal compulsion civil courts can apply is an adverse inference - i.e. juries and judges in civil court are allowed to assume you're hiding evidence of guilt, whereas in criminal court they're not. I don't think this distinction matters.

[1] RIAA + MPAA = ???

[2] https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/538/408/