| ▲ | rocketpastsix 3 hours ago |
| I think you underestimate how many people actually care about mass shootings. |
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| ▲ | tokioyoyo 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| Caring with no significant action in prevention doesn’t really signal caring. Sure, it sucks, headlines get printed for a couple of months, then people forget and move on. To put it in the most disrespectful and sad way, it looks like more people have been on the streets for Knicks games than most (any?) school shootings of the past decades. |
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| ▲ | dylan604 an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | I think your assumption of lack of caring is misplaced. The citizens clearly care, but have no power to do anything about it. Those in power are the ones that do not care or are paid not to care. | |
| ▲ | SecretDreams 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | It's just harder to get the average joe charged up to fight a battle with anything meaningful on the line. Americans are used to living relatively cushy lives where they don't sacrifice their QOL to make the lives of their countrymen better. The closest thing to that are people in the military, and it's probably been a while since the US military is improving QOL, on average. People will continue to be complacent on multiple fronts until it absolutely comes to a violent boil. I don't really see half measures or peaceful protests changing anything. And maybe I'm pessimistic, but I think the upcoming elections will either not change enough or be strongly manipulated to maintain the status quo. | | |
| ▲ | tokioyoyo 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | >harder to get the average joe charged up to fight a battle with anything meaningful on the line Doesn't this imply that on average people just don't care? So, school shooting preventions are just way down in the list of "things I care about", when you have "cushy lives where nobody wants to sacrifice their QOL". | | |
| ▲ | SecretDreams 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | It means they don't care enough to meaningfully make sacrifices for change. To deal with school shootings is to change the constitution. The American constitution is basically wired for school shootings. To change the constitution is basically a civil war. Things aren't binary. Many people care deeply about school shootings. But they don't have the means or power to organize to stop them and, individually, they are powerless. | | |
| ▲ | tokioyoyo 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | They’re not binary, but when an issue persists for decades, over the course of multiple administrations, and political landscape… it shows either the country is incompetent in terms of solving an issue, or the issue is not a priority. I wholeheartedly believe US can solve issues when it’s an important one. And thus, I think, for an average American it’s not an issue. Decades is a very long timeframe. Countries have achieved more in shorter periods. | | |
| ▲ | SecretDreams 25 minutes ago | parent [-] | | > I wholeheartedly believe US can solve issues when it’s an important one. What's the last important issue in the US that was democratically resolved? |
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| ▲ | nish__ 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Enforcing the global use of the petro dollar is what keeps Americans living cushy lives so be careful disrespecting the military personel. | | |
| ▲ | SecretDreams 23 minutes ago | parent [-] | | My post was not disrespectful. It was matter of fact. And if the Petro Dollar only persists by use of force or perceived force, it's probably not a sustainable system for humanity. So hopefully we can go back to a soft power maintained Petro Dollar? |
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| ▲ | graphime 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > I think you underestimate how many people actually care about mass shootings. Less than 1% of the population, that’s for sure. You remember the last protest about school shootings? Neither do I. |
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| ▲ | throw__away7391 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Well they happen in schools and children don’t vote. If this had been a wave of senior center shootings, something would have been done a long, long time ago. | | | |
| ▲ | throwaway-11-1 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I get what you’re saying but in the last 20 years can you think of any mass protest that accomplished anything substantial? I don’t really blame people for giving up on it as a tool for change. TBH only truly effective one I can think of would be Jan 6 | | |
| ▲ | Topfi 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I can, just not in the US [0]. I always presumed this is linked to the health care being provided by employers rather than having a more robust safety net that allows for civil disobedience without having to fear existential risks. However, I also can’t forget that the French have their safety net not as a God given right, but because they fought for it via (often not just civil) protest. Reference also the statements MLK JR made concerning the willingness of white moderates to engage in actually effective disobedience, even when their financial situation allows for such. [0] https://thenonviolenceproject.wisc.edu/2023/06/02/recent-pro... | | |
| ▲ | peyton 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | There are more people not on employer-provided health insurance in the US than exist in France. How does your presumption work given that fact? | | |
| ▲ | Topfi an hour ago | parent [-] | | I just checked and it's 54% in the US [0] vs 0% in France (cause basic public healthcare isn't tied to employment). So, unless you are referring to absolute numbers (not very helpful when comparing countries of different sizes), I'm not sure what you are referring to. I will admit that my purely personal thesis on this front goes a bit beyond healthcare. I feel that a robust safety net, iron clad right to protest and a large, at least reasonably financially stable (meaning no existential financial fears for at least the majority of citizenry, i.e. above roughly 60% middle class for a given economy) are needed to allow for protests in such a manner that the citizenry are both capable, willing and informed sufficiently to protect their own interests and democracy as a whole. Having the right and ability to protests is needed, just as much as being comfortable enough to have the time to actually stay politically engaged (consistent financial strain being a reasonable cause for why one doesn't stay informed in my book). France or my home country of Austria (imperfect countries like any other, I will (un)happily admit) on that front are in the 65%-75% range, whereas the US appears to barely get above 50% purely by income along with higher health care costs in general and employer linked plans for as stated above the majority, so these are somewhat interlinked in my view. Same reason, albeit less extreme, why in war-torn countries, long standing brutal dictatorships and the like, the citizenry rarely is able to create any proper action agains their oppressors, not because they are accepting of the status quo, weak, or anything of the sort, but because when one is starving and trying to help their family unit survive, even beyond the risk that action can pose, their often isn't any time to actually consider it. "A republic, if you can keep it", in my opinion is a high demand from the public. They need to have the tools, rights and resources to actively defend it. Not saying France is perfect here, but I will say that it is easy to just raise our finger at the US populous without considering the whole picture. [0] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/portion-insured-americans-w... |
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| ▲ | graphime 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > I get what you’re saying but in the last 20 years can you think of any mass protest that accomplished anything substantial? Nope. Even the Jan 6 one didn’t really change our quality of life. And damn, that was a protest, by American standards. | | |
| ▲ | vrganj 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | It was a protest as much as the Beer Hall Putsch was. | |
| ▲ | boston_clone 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | January Sixth was not a protest, it was an attempt to interfere with government processes to prevent Biden from being elected - so a really shitty attempt at a coup. |
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| ▲ | Jcowell 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The author said nothing of the people but of the government itself. 12 years ago, elementary school children were slaughtered and even that wasn’t enough to ban guns. |
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| ▲ | andrew_lettuce 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Thoughts and prayers doesn't count as truly caring |