The US has for decades been engaged in mass dumping of their products to establish monopolies all over the world, and punishing anyone who dares try do anything about it. This isn't better than corporate espionage.

I agree, but the same goes for the US. Remember Echelon.

I'm running Qwen 3.6 via https://huggingface.co/Qwen/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-FP8 and it's pretty great. I'll update to the 3.7 equivalent when that's ready.

It's not nearly worth it to me to get an incremental improvement in performance if it means I have to move to hosted environments with Qwen 3.7 (or Claude or Gemini or whatever).

Which is basically the current primary use for AI is programming more than anything, you hear about AI in programming more than in any other field.

China definitley wants information on all Americans. This commment is so far off the mark you it's on par with "Billionaires aren't interested in taking your money"

As Americans go through life, some of them will become people with power. When you need to leverage that power, having the right knowledge about them can effectively transfer that power to you.

Tiktok was a goldmine, because every 20-something on their way to a future position of power was uploading every single facit of their digital life to CCP servers everyday.

> I'm questioning ROI

If by ROI you mean saving more money than using paid APIs, then I don't think it is worth it. All you gain is full sovereignty over your AI usage.

Currently, Apple is letting some of its models go out of stock in preparation for new models coming in a few weeks. I would expect at least 128 GB models at that time. That said, the memory crunch is hitting everyone.

I'd held off from buying a new personal laptop for quite a few years and felt that the M5-128gb was justifiable once I started really seeing payoffs from using AI at work.

Running w/ Cursor and doing some "nights and weekends" type coding / conversations, I was hitting $100-200 of usage within a few weeks. I know there's probably better ways to manage costs, but I was getting enough value out of it to keep bumping my spend limit from $20 => $40 => $80 => $120 (and then I stopped spending! :-)

Messing around with local-llm, I've settled on `omlx` and `gemma` for "conversational", and I think it's `qwen-120b-a3b-6bit` or something for the "heavy hitter". Gemma "gets it" a lot more, whereas that particular `qwen` tends to fall into the "MuSt WrItE CoOooDeee!" behaviour in a lot of cases instead of holding a conversation, and does an awesome job of randomly spitting out ascii-art diagrams or including full-blown bash shell scripts to illustrate different cases.

My POV is: "Local for slightly slower/casual usage", the ~1% of battery usage per minute of LLM is shockingly accurate (eg: 30 minutes == 30% drop!). "Gemma for discussion and emitting DESIGN-... docs", and "Qwen for converting DESIGN-... to PLAN-...", (as well as implementation, but generally from a fresh context loading the relevant PLAN-... or supporting docs)

...then supplement that with direct Cursor usage in case I screw up some setting on being able to get the local LLM working, or if I need to include literal web-research or really having access to some SOTA model. Using the pi-coder harness locally, web pages are kindof a difficult conundrum as they can be kindof gigantic and are really worthy of special casing, some sort of sub-harness, etc... but the more "stuff" you put into the agent, the less context window (and memory!) you have available, so it's a real balancing act.

The other biggest problem is that you're limited (locally) to ~20-80tps and in some cases you have to chew on or "swallow" the whole prompt up to that point if you end up with some sort of cache miss (TTFT). The `omlx` server does a pretty good job (after you tweak some settings and stuff) of allowing MANY prompt continuations to nearly immediately start generated tokens, but sometimes if I have two agents going (eg: Gemma talking shit about Qwen's output or vice versa) in a longer context window, then you'll take that hit.

"Other people's compute" is definitely more freeing, but even looking at $200/mo usage that's $2400 vs. the ~$6k for a maxed out MBP. Call it $2500 vs. $7500 and you'd say that "local AI gives you a 3-year amortization window for a slower, worse experience" ... but if you're strategic about your usage, the ability to "talk for free" and occasionally "burst" to an online provider or having some hugging-face tokens to try out different models that you can't quite run locally is really nice. Talking to the AI (locally) to even just do non-coding planning without worrying about data leakage or privacy issues is phenomenal, and you end up owning a really nice laptop!

In some ways, seeing the "advantage" of having the local 128gb capacity for LLM, I'm semi-wishing I'd have gotten a mac mini instead, but then I can't quite do the 100% offline stuff (eg: coffee-shop) that the maxed out laptop allows.

If it were a mini running locally, I'd feel more comfortable calling it the always-on "AI brain" to process my emails, run crontab summaries, whatever kindof "open-claw-ish" stuff that you could do w/o relying on having to "keep the laptop lid open all the time". I'm sure there's ways to repurpose things, but longer-term, call it even 3-5 years from now... any sort of 128gb machine will be more than capable where you'd want to have one "doing stuff" locally within your home network (IMHO).

I only tried a very early version of that when it was just a llama.cpp fork and Qwen was certainly better in my tests.

But I was not super impressed with deepseek 4 flash using it from the official API either, so it doesn't seem quantization fault. It is a good model, but nothing out of the ordinary in the few benchmarks I ran on it (with full awareness that benchmarks are biased).

Bosgame M5 (Strix Halo) w/ 128 GB still goes for $2800 right now. SH systems have surged in price dramatically but quite unevenly.

>The best option is likely to rent hardware on Runpod.

Vast.ai is much cheaper, but the broader point here is contestable. The only dimension in which cloud GPU rentals win is cost. You lose the confidentiality, integrity, and availability benefits of local deployments.

And for what? Spend 10-15k for the slopiest of slop code, non deterministic automations, and the ability to spawn an AI gf?

This whole thing is really starting to remind me of the crypto hype phases of 2016-2018 when everyone thought their investment in GPUs was going to make them rich.

What do you recommend for non-Mac setup? I am a Mac user, but its getting expensive, and not seeing reason to jump to the latest M5

M5 Max 128GB for $1k?

Americans have their own frontier models, that's the point. Europeans have quite literally nothing native, so they are forced to choose between the Americans or Chinese, and they dislike both and trust neither.

The Americans can cry about Chinese censorship and turn around and use Claude or Opus or Gemma or whatever, but the Europeans just throw a fit and then have to use one of the two anyway. And that whole crying about something while being completely helpless vis-a-vis doing anything about it is the definition of Europe so far this century. Globally irrelevant outside Germany.