| ▲ | asar 16 hours ago |
| The model is (like Composer 2) based on Kimi K2.5 and they claim SOTA performance for 1/10th of the cost. The tweet also mentions that they've started a new model from scratch on Colossus 2 (xAI/SpaceX Cluster). Really impressive how they've made this jump from being called the vscode fork with no moat just a couple of months ago. |
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| ▲ | onlyrealcuzzo 15 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > Really impressive how they've made this jump from being called the vscode fork with no moat just a couple of months ago. Impressive, yes. But they still don't have a moat... |
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| ▲ | infecto 11 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I am not sure we should dismiss what they have today. Nobody has yet to come close with a full package ide that works well for coding. Is that not a moat? It is easy for my to in my head discount it, thinking that I could build something myself but between autocomplete and their workflow for agent use, it feels like they have some tangible moat emerging. | | |
| ▲ | virgilp 42 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | If we ignore cost (which is kinda hard to ignore), I feel Codex kinda' does it for me. Sure it's not really an editor but I find I don't need that _that much_ and it's easy to launch an external editor (they actually have the feature). The ironic thing is that half a year ago, after trying factory.ai I thought chat-first interface was a stupid idea that will never work. | |
| ▲ | chillfox an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Have you tried Zed? I haven’t tried Cursor, so don’t know how they compare, but I like Zed a lot. Anyway, would love to see a comparison from someone who has used a recent version of each. | | |
| ▲ | turastory 43 minutes ago | parent [-] | | A few years ago I tried Zed when it was still pretty early, but eventually settled on Cursor. I gave Zed another shot a few days ago because Cursor’s worktree support still feels pretty weak. In my setup I use multiple agents like Claude Code and Codex, and Zed’s ACP support makes it pretty nice to manage them all as “threads” in one place. Worktree switching also feels much smoother. Overall the experience was pretty good, but the way the agent and editor are integrated still feels a bit lacking, and tab completion is the big one for me. Cursor’s tab completion is still the best I’ve used. So now I’m using both. For work that needs a lot of focus and careful iteration, I use Cursor. For things that are easy to split into worktrees and hand off to agents, I use Zed with Claude/Codex. |
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| ▲ | alach11 12 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Isn't a large user base and the data collected from those users a moat of sorts? | | |
| ▲ | onlyrealcuzzo 11 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | A moat is when you have something other's can't easily get. Every MAG 7 / FAANG company already has more users and more data... That's not a moat. That's traction. | | |
| ▲ | wilg 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | That's not X. That's Y. | | |
| ▲ | uxcolumbo 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Been a bit out of the loop. What's wrong with using very short sentences like 'That's not X. That's Y.'? | | | |
| ▲ | DonHopkins 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I fear the day that large parts of perfectly valid English language and punctuation are off limits for humans to use because LLMs use them too (having learned them from humans), and somebody will always whine and post low effort "slop" comments that are much more annoying and less useful than the slop itself, or even incorrectly whine about human written text that happens to match your hyper-sensitive slop detector. Plus you are always running the risk of being rude and insulting when incorrectly labeling text actually written by humans as slop — making a jackass of yourself — and opening yourself up to being trolled by humans purposefully inserting em-dashes and catch phrases just to trigger you. That's not clever. That's gullible. How much cognitive and physical effort and time do you put into trying to figure out if everything you read is slop, then complaining about it? If that's your job or calling in life, you could be easily replaced with AI. Find something more creative to do with your time. If you really object to low effort slop, and not just relish it as an opportunity to whine, then how about instead of posting low effort whines about slop, you put in the actual effort to do something about it, and rewrite the slop in a way that won't trigger your slop detector, then post that instead, to train AI not to write slop. Is your problem that it's slop, or that it's AI generated? Because your whining about low effort AI generated slop without contributing to the conversation or addressing the point of the comment you're replying to is just low effort human generated slop. Please don't post slop while complaining about slop. |
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| ▲ | AussieWog93 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Honestly the data itself is probably worth heaps even in the company itself collapses. Early attention engineering when humans were still in the loop!!! | | |
| ▲ | NitpickLawyer 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | > Early attention engineering when humans were still in the loop Exactly. Cursor was the first product used by tons of devs on real codebases. Just the signal "acceptance rate" is huge and can't be easily captured w/ synthetic data. |
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| ▲ | kkukshtel 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | And its still just a vscode fork | | |
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| ▲ | antirez 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| How much the RL they are doing really improves Kimi K2.5 is to be seen. So, right now, the ground truth is that they combined what they had with a strong open weights model. The RL improvement may be both marginal (since may folks report strong results with vanilla K2.6) and may mostly bias the model towards coding tasks: when a model like this is trained to be generalist, there is a tension between being good at one thing and the other, in terms of SFT and RL. You can see this in the DeepSeek v4 Flash training report for instance but it is a known fact. So if you have the GPUs and a decent RL pipeline that does not run the model you can indeed specialize it a bit more for a given task at the expenses of tasks people will not do inside Cursor. But, so far, the measurable reality is that Cursor uses an open weight model like most could do, and the RL story could be partilly a marketing move to call to Composer 2.5 more than a real strong gain, given that there is no way to verify and K2.5 was already strong. And we also know that they had to partner to do the training, which is also not a good news. |
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| ▲ | liuliu 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Since the frontier is only 8-month ahead of DeepSeek, it is hard to see how model training can be a moat as all the tricks are available from open labs in China. You really just need <100m to bootstrap at this point. |
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| ▲ | wg0 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| This was the only way forward. |
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| ▲ | the_duke 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| In my opinion cursor actually has one of the best harnesses again at the moment. |
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| ▲ | DeathArrow an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| >Really impressive how they've made this jump from being called the vscode fork with no moat just a couple of months ago. With so much money and computing from SpaceX, is not so impressive. |
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| ▲ | Lionga 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| They are still a vscode fork with no moat? Like they lost about 70% of users in half a year which goes to show how there is not even the tiniest of moat. |
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| ▲ | GenerWork 15 hours ago | parent [-] | | I feel like they've been targeting enterprise pretty hard. I know my company uses them, and the companies that hire us also use Cursor. | | |
| ▲ | Squarex 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | All enterprises I know use GitHub copilot as they already have Office, Teams, … wonder how will it change with the recent pricing changes | |
| ▲ | pjmlp an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I can tell my company wants nothing with them. | |
| ▲ | kvetching 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Cursor will definitely win the enterprise for coding. Enterprises aren't going to trust a TUI | | |
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| ▲ | make3 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| why is that part impressive specifically? they got purchased by SpaceX, they have access to infinite compute and cash now. & now they're still losing all of their users to Claude Code and Codex. |
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| ▲ | DeathArrow 22 minutes ago | parent [-] | | >& now they're still losing all of their users to Claude Code and Codex. Why pay for Cursor when I can use GLM 5.1, Kimi K2.6, MiniMax M2.7, Xiaomi MiMo V2.5 Pro and Deepseek v4 for cheap and use whatever harness I want, including Claude Code. It's not like Cursor harness is the best out there. And even if I want to edit the code, I don't need to run the agent harness in an IDE. |
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| ▲ | whywhywhywhy 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It's still a VsCode fork just now with a Kimi fine tune and still no moat... I won't debate that it turns out none of this mattered when it came to being as successful company though and kinda makes anyone who tried to roll their own instead of fork look a little silly. |
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| ▲ | hkleppe 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | "No moat", well... How I see this is that its so important to bundle the model with the right tooling. Like a racecar, having the best engine doesn't help if the rest of the car lacks other winning properties (reliability, aerodynics etc). So for Cursor, which IMO, they put themself in a strong position by having both a solid IDE __and__ a solid+cost efficient model. Those two working great in combination for the task they are designed to solve (coding) is more important than benchmarks |
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| ▲ | 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| [deleted] |
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| ▲ | aurareturn 15 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| I doubt it's a brand new model. It's likely just Kimi K2.5 further trained on coding. |
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