| It cracks me up when people say Chrome is a monopoly, because a massive amount of computing devices do not even ship with Chrome. Windows computers, Macbooks, and iPhones require users go search out and install Chrome on their own out of their own volition, shipping with entirely functional and decent browsers out of the box that they have lots of patterns to push. Even many Android phones ship with browsers other than Chrome as a default still from what I understand. How is Chrome, of all things, a monopoly? Have words just entirely lost all meaning and now monopoly just means "things which are popular that I dislike"? |
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| ▲ | MSFT_Edging 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Chrome is a monopoly by extending the internet in ways that force users into chrome. Due to market share and Google's prevalence, they have the sway to introduce things that cannot meaningfully be avoided without extreme siloing. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | Outside of WebUSB I personally haven't meaningfully been impacted in any ways. Can you share which ways this is? Note, this is separate from a "so many things are just Chromium", which I agree is an issue, but isn't the same as a "Google Chrome is a monopoly". Because in the end there are still many non-Chrome browsers which support WebUSB which do not end up with a lot of the downsides of Chrome specifically about Google harvesting your data and what not. | | |
| ▲ | CursedSilicon an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | Ah, the "this doesn't fit my very specific technicality argument" You know full well what people mean when they say "Chrome" | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | > You know full well what people mean when they say "Chrome" Yeah, Chrome, the web browser made by Google that bugs you to sign in with your Google Account. Most people don't mean Microsoft Edge when you say "Chrome". Do you call Microsoft Edge "Chrome"? Chrome is a product made by Google that is a web browser. If the argument is Chromium is too interwoven, that's a separate argument. But even then, what does it mean that "Chromium is a monopoly"? Is Linux a monopoly as well? Why or why not? Note you haven't actually given me any other ways one would be impacted like I asked. What are the other majorly missing features Chrome pushes that other browsers don't have that most sites require? What else am I missing by not using a non-Chromium-based browser? | | |
| ▲ | majorchord an hour ago | parent [-] | | > what does it mean that "Chromium is a monopoly" As someone else said earlier, it is a monopoly by extending the internet in ways that force users into using their browser engine. Due to market share and Google's prevalence, they have the sway to introduce things that cannot meaningfully be avoided without extreme siloing. > What are the other majorly missing features Chrome pushes that other browsers don't have that most sites require? This is a different question, please don't move the goalposts. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | > by extending the internet in ways that force users into using their browser engine And yet after multiple times of me asking you've yet to give me a single real feature lost. > This is a different question Its literally the thing we're saying is the problem, how is it a different question entirely?! You're saying the problem is they're adding features that force Chromium, but asking about which features you're talking about is just bringing up unrelated and different questions. | | |
| ▲ | majorchord 43 minutes ago | parent [-] | | It's not so much forcing people to Chrome/chromium for specific features, but trying to increase market share through more subtle means, like paying to have their search engine featured, advertising their products everywhere possible (including inside other people's apps), slowing down their sites (like youtube) on other browsers, or tying in other services (along with way too much personal info) to try to keep people within their sphere of influence. Is Linux also a monopoly? In a way sure, but I think a big difference is they're not "doing evil" as people claim Google is, and all the development/decisions are still made out in the open in a democratic way. Former Google execs have even compared their setup to "running the New York Stock Exchange while trading on it." At least Linux isn't trying to tell people what to do with their software. | | |
| ▲ | philipallstar 31 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | > it is a monopoly by extending the internet in ways that force users into using their browser engine 2 messages later that seems to be contradicted? > It's not so much forcing people to Chrome/chromium for specific features I might've misread. > but trying to increase market share through more subtle means, like paying to have their search engine featured This isn't Chromium, the open source basis of many web browsers. Now you're talking about Google the company. > Is Linux also a monopoly? Monopolies in the sense worth discussing are highly popular things that are held in place by things other than competition. If anything, Google props up Chrome's competitors to reduce this. | |
| ▲ | vel0city 22 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | So now Chrome is a "monopoly" because they're "advertising their products everywhere possible". I guess I can only ever drink Redbull, they're a monopoly, because they're advertising their products everywhere. Seriously? That's our standard of what is a "monpoply"? Words have no meaning anymore. You can choose to use something different. The device you bought probably came with an alternative! Otherwise, the device next to it on the shelf on the store where you bought it likely would have had an alternative browser, because most devices on the store shelves outside of some hypothetical physical Google store don't come with Chrome. |
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| ▲ | majorchord an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Do you actually think the majority of everyone else is being just as pedantic (or cares) about Google Chrome vs chromium-based? For most, for the purposes of market share (the type of "monopoly" I believe they are referring to), I think they count it as one and the same. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | Do most people call Microsoft Edge or Safari "Chrome"? Are the security and privacy implications the same for Edge, Safari, and Chrome? Seems to me like they're still quite different products despite having some similar codebases! | | |
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| ▲ | Dylan16807 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Why do you keep talking about who installs the app? That has nothing to do with whether something is a monopoly, which is primarily about market share. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | If a user is openly going out of their way to go and install a competitor's product despite a perfectly serviceable version coming by default, how can the the one being sought out be seen as a monopoly? The competition came pre-installed! How did the user manage to install Chrome on Windows if Chrome is a monopoly, the only serviceable browser around? They copy the source code from a magazine or something? Get a floppy disk in the mail? | | |
| ▲ | Dylan16807 an hour ago | parent [-] | | Whatever your definition of monopoly is, it's wrong. The threshold is not 100% market share. If that was the threshold no monopoly has ever existed. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city 7 minutes ago | parent [-] | | > Whatever your definition of monopoly is, it's wrong Ok, so enlighten me which standard of monopoly they're so obviously breaking? > The threshold is not 100% market share. I never once said so I'm not arguing it requires 100% marketshare. I'm just pointing out there are tons of workable competitors out there, in fact one has to use a functional and fully featured competitors product to go and install Chrome on most platforms out there. How can one claim Chrome is a monoply when there are tons of competitors out there which work just fine, and for most users their computers came with the competitors products? Please, do enlighten me, how is Chrome a monopoly? |
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| ▲ | wil421 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I’m constantly badgered by google apps on my iPhone to use Chrome. In fact I’m not able to just click a link and open my default browser, I have to see the big chrome logo and a smaller link to choose my default browser. | | |
| ▲ | vel0city an hour ago | parent [-] | | > by google apps on my iPhone Ever thought about just not using those apps if you want to avoid the Google ecosystem? Too bad there's just absolutely no mapping application available on iPhone but Google Maps. Too bad there's no way to send an email on an iPhone outside of Gmail. What's that? A user has to once again go out of their way to install those apps as well? Well isn't that strange. I thought Google was a monopoly on iPhones. |
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| ▲ | traderj0e 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | and even the iPhone Chrome doesn't use the Chromium engine, it's Safari under the hood | |
| ▲ | ranger_danger an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Windows computers Ship with a chromium fork called Edge |
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