| ▲ | OptionOfT 8 hours ago |
| I'm from Belgium, and even with public transportation, there are a large group of people dependent on their driver's license. But if you ask someone if they'd drive without insurance, or without driver's license they look at you like you've asked them to do the impossible. Whereas in the US no-one bats an eye when that happens. Half the time the cops just issue a ticket, and don't even tow the car. And now people who obey the law need to take out extra insurance for under/uninsured motorists. |
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| ▲ | JumpCrisscross 8 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > if you ask someone if they'd drive without insurance, or without driver's license they look at you like you've asked them to do the impossible To wit: Europe's 1.8% (and Belgium's 0.7%) uninsured-driver rates are a fraction of America's 15% [1][2]. [1] https://www.mibi.ie/ireland-may-have-highest-level-of-uninsu... [2] https://www.iii.org/fact-statistic/facts-statistics-uninsure... |
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| ▲ | 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | [deleted] | |
| ▲ | retired 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | In countries like The Netherlands it is impossible to drive around uninsured. So that is probably why the number is so low. | | |
| ▲ | JumpCrisscross 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | > it is impossible to drive around uninsured How? | | |
| ▲ | retired 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | Because fines are automatic. If you register a vehicle to your name and don't insure it within 28 days you get a €500 fine. The government can fine you up to three times a year for a total of €1500. And that is if you actually pay the fines. If you do not pay the fines and let the fees stack up, you are looking at around €4500 per year. And if you are caught driving uninsured that is a €700 fine on top of all that. With many police cars now having ANPR systems it just isn't possible to drive around uninsured without receiving fines that cost way more than just getting insurance. | | |
| ▲ | JumpCrisscross 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | > If you register a vehicle to your name and don't insure it within 28 days you get a €500 fine Oh, this is actually a really good idea. Wild we don't link those systems. | | |
| ▲ | retired 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | I still see dozens of unplated mopeds in The Netherlands so the system is not perfect but they are trying to fix it. |
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| ▲ | aziaziazi 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > there are a large group of people dependent on their driver's license Are there "no licence cars" in Belgium and the US ? Basically a moped motor and a seat inside a box. 45kmh and no highway, but a bit more confortable and fast than a ebike for rural environment. |
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| ▲ | tmtvl 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Those do exist in Belgium, but (joke starts here) that's because Belgium is enormous, far too large to get proper public transport going (joke ends). I am seeing more and more cargo e-bikes (e-cargo bikes?), which I find a positive change, though it does differ from place to place (Antwerp's fairly okay for bikes, same for Leuven, Brussels was pretty bad last time I was there). | |
| ▲ | Avicebron 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Not really, the cross section of people who lose their license/insurance and those that could use something like an ebike reliably for their commute is practically zilch. The US is really big and a lot of people have rural 30+ minute commutes where it snows ~6 months out of the year. | | |
| ▲ | aziaziazi 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Oh I was’t clear: I’m not talking about an ebike but a very small and underpowered car like this one https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35210572 There’re somewhat popular here for those that doesn’t have a licence and offer some of the advantage but are less dangerous to others. | |
| ▲ | andrepd 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > The US is really big and a lot of people have rural 30+ minute commutes The size of the country in which a commute is contained is immaterial to the length of that commute. What you mean is not "the US is big" but "things are really far apart in the US". Which they are, but precisely because of car-centric (car-only, actually) design. | | |
| ▲ | retired 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Things being far apart in the US predates cars. Rail made that possible. | | |
| ▲ | jeromegv 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Rails encouraged density around the train stations. Rail is not responsible for the car sprawling type of communities which are mostly a 20th century phenomenon. |
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| ▲ | vector_spaces 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| You are right that this happens frequently in the United States compared to Europe, but you are overstating the degree to which this culturally and legally acceptable. People who are doing this are not typically broadcasting it to others, and I can assure you that when they do, for the most part people will tend to "bat an eye" at the very least. Note that motor vehicle insurance in most of Europe is more tightly regulated and generally more affordable than in the United States. Also, I suspect the car-dependent individuals in urban areas with robust public transportation in Belgium are generally vastly higher income than the typical uninsured compulsory driver in the United States. Happy to be corrected though |
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| ▲ | JuniperMesos 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| > But if you ask someone if they'd drive without insurance, or without driver's license they look at you like you've asked them to do the impossible. > Whereas in the US no-one bats an eye when that happens. Half the time the cops just issue a ticket, and don't even tow the car. A lot of the people driving without insurance or licenses in the US are illegal immigrants, which means enforcement of driving illegally is caught up in the same cultural-war fight over immigration law enforcement that has dominated American news since Trump got re-elected. "And now people who obey the law need to take out extra insurance for under/uninsured motorists" is specifically an anti-illegal-immigrant talking point. |
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| ▲ | jeromegv 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | It’s almost like there’s consequences to making it as hard as possible for people to be legalized. |
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