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Tyrubias 15 hours ago

This was evident everywhere except within the AI industry itself. The rhetoric from many of the industry’s top leaders has been “this technology will eliminate millions of jobs, fundamentally reshape countless other jobs, and automate the use of lethal force, but we’re going to develop it anyways”. Many of the current economic woes, including mass layoffs, have been blamed on AI by the very executives conducting said layoffs. In addition, the major AI companies have shamelessly stole intellectual property to train their models and shoveled AI down everyone’s throats. Is it any wonder that the general public hates AI? The AI industry isn’t exactly doing its best to appear likable.

monksy 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Roy Sutherland has a really good take on AI. Most of the AI companies are targeting a cost cutting proposoition where they should target a value creation one. Targeting and pushing towards a regressive elimination route is tox and destructive to those around it.

Then again the CEOs of these companies want to get their company at all cost to society.

ncouture 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The title of the original article feels like click-baiut to me. It's covering an act of violence under the pretext that people hate AI.

In fact it's a very sad story about a 20 year old throwing their life away instead of fighting for what he believes is right through non-violent activism and/or regulations.

Last year I wrote an article asking the very question "Who will be the next Luddites?", National Geographics followed-up months later. I'm sure many before, after or in-between covered the same topic. There is truth to it, we will be impacted but let's not forget we went through this during the industial revolution and we should be better equipped than ever to fight using meaningful non-violent acts and operations.

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/who-neo-luddites-more-importa...

http://nationalgeographic.com/history/article/luddite-indust...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Luddism

estimator7292 14 hours ago | parent [-]

Non-violent means don't work and get you killed by cops. This is what the people are left with.

atmavatar 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Non-violent protests do work, though they require you hit a critical mass to become effective. There even exists a 3.5% rule[1] in political science whereby authoritarian governments will topple if 3.5% of the population engages in nonviolent protest.

One of the more famous examples here in the US is that of the equal rights marches in the 1960s ultimately leading to the end of segregation.

What I'm not sure of, though, is what kind of impact there is on the required percentage of people participating when we have media outlets like Fox News, which was demonstrated to have fabricated images during events like the Black Lives Matter protests to make them look as if they were violent.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3.5%25_rule

danaris 6 hours ago | parent [-]

While I agree with your basic premise, that 3.5% "rule" is much more of an observed effect than an actual rule.

There needs to be an actual mechanism for the protests to bring about the fall of the authoritarian regime. Unfortunately, in our current context, a lot of the feedback mechanisms that should cause protests to change actual policy and affect the people in power are broken, largely due to the Republicans' efforts over the last several decades to eliminate accountability both from the actual institutions and as a valid concept in our national consciousness.

nozzlegear 11 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Non-violent means don't work

MLK Jr.'s Civil Rights protests are an obvious counterpoint to this claim.

esalman 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If you get killed by cops that does not necessarily mean the means are not working. All good things in life come at a sacrifice.

collingreen 13 hours ago | parent [-]

It doesn't necessarily mean it is working either though.

Not all sacrifice needs to be all or nothing.

globalnode 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

but violence doesnt work either, even if you conquer a whole nation (or social class or insert w/e here), you didnt really win and oneday they will get their revenge, so you're better off trying the non-violent way

slg 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Does anyone else see the disconnect between how Americans talk about our history compared to how we talk about political violence of today?

How can we glorify Thomas Jefferson and teach kids about him saying "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants" only to then condemn the spilling of any modern blood? Truly what is the difference between torching a warehouse of toilet paper compared to tossing some tea in the harbor?

How can we condemn one and celebrate the other without being hypocrites?

collingreen 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Propaganda and "history is written by the victors"

Propaganda is the difference between rebels and freedom fighters.

hackable_sand 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I don't think anyone should be glorifying Jefferson.

You could have written L'Overture instead and it would have been a great example.

cindyllm 12 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

Balgair 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

So, at my BigCo, this rings very true.

We've tried to internally pitch many ideas to the larger organization before but mostly got nothing back.

Finally, one of the various board members talked to my boss and told them that, essentially, it has to be top line growth, not bottom line savings.

We looked this up and it came down to some MBA mumbo-jumbo about how X% of growth is better than that same X% of savings once you run the math (?). Look, I know, that's not how percentages work and I know that savings actually do matter. But in 'I have an MBA-land' the mantra is topline > bottomline.

So, then we started to pitch ideas around growth (new lines, more customer sales, more customers, etc). Which went ... nowhere ... again.

Time goes by again, and another helpful person reaches out and tells us that our ideas are 'not worth considering' as they 'don't meaningfully impact revenue targets'. Again, essentially, just to justify the salary-time that these internal boards spend, the idea has to be net positive. Then it we learned that, no, it has to impact the revenue to 1%. For our BigCo that in the ~$10M ballpark. We do have the customer base to support that, but it is in the revenue ballpark of Atari or the Hypixel servers.

Look, either way, the run-around that I get told is that for AI projects that we pitch internally: 1) Top line growth only 2) ~1% increase in revenue (~$10M).

Now, why anyone would not just go take that ~$10M idea and not just make a company themselves is beyond me, but I don't get paid the big bucks, so who knows.

Still, that is what these BigCos are looking for: Growth in the ~$1-10M range.

autaut 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I think tech ceo got a little bit too excited and their mask fell off and started saying “oh yeah, you don’t like it? Too bad nothing you can do about it”. You’ll see them quickly backpedal to woke 1.0 when it turns out they were a bit too quick about it.

Gigachad 14 hours ago | parent [-]

And when people showed up at Sam Altmans house.

z3c0 14 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Not to mention, it doesn't actually create the productivity promised at the lower rates promised. The most enthusiastic proponents are middle-management, not actual doers.

It's an expensive route to mediocrity, which doesnt offer an edge in a market where everyone is using the same snakeoil.

the_snooze 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They got way over their skis on this one. There's a difference between "impressive" tech vs. "operational" tech. That difference usually boils down to prioritizing engineering rigor over marketing.

EA-3167 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Unreliable mediocrity, because you simply can never be sure when the damned thing lies/hallucinates unless you double-check everything.

So now you're wrangling an "AI" system and you're doing most of the work you would have had to anyway. ...And when you don't it can get really embarrassing.

https://www.abajournal.com/news/article/elite-wall-street-la...

Not the first time, surely not the last. The problem is that so much money is tied up in this thing, and the moment the music stops the bag holders are going to be utterly doomed.

girvo 11 hours ago | parent [-]

> the bag holders are going to be utterly doomed

Good news, the plan is for us to be the bag holders as they rush to IPO.

yoyohello13 15 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I’m frankly more shocked that people in the industry are surprised the general public hates them. Like it’s been non-stop fear mongering and hype from them for years, AI has basically done nothing to improve the lives of normal people, wtf did they expect?

SpicyLemonZest 15 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They didn't expect anything else and aren't surprised. "The X industry is discovering..." is one of those stock phrases that people just kinda deploy willy-nilly; the article contains no argument that anyone in the AI industry didn't know or didn't expect this.

emp17344 14 hours ago | parent [-]

Presumably these companies on the verge of an IPO don’t want the public to hate them or their product. It wasn’t exactly a calculated maneuver - they made a decision to leverage fear-based marketing and it backfired.

SpicyLemonZest 13 hours ago | parent [-]

It wasn't any sort of maneuver! It's what they genuinely believe! Both OpenAI and Anthropic have been telling people about the existential risk of powerful AI since the very day they were founded; OpenAI has been at it since 2015, 8 years before they had any meaningful product to market.

Sam Altman still says, after being the victim of anti-AI violence, that "the fear and anxiety about AI is justified" and "it will not all go well".

People simply refuse to believe that AI companies are serious about this, and get twisted into knots trying to understand why AI companies would choose this messaging under the premise that they can't be serious.

operatingthetan 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If they are in a cult that shuns outside opinions, it could be a surprise when they find out...

threethirtytwo 14 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

People hate admitting the truth. Everything you said here is utter bs that people say to lie to themselves.

I’m sick and tired of AI hatred without people facing the truth. People hate AI because AI is on a trajectory to replace them and become better than a human. That is the fundamental reality.

Look don’t get angry at me. If you are on HN chances are you’re most likely delusional and completely wrong about AI. The majority of HN called vibe coding useless and said LLM have no potential. Now my company won’t even hire someone who hasn’t used Claude and I haven’t touched a text editor or ide in half a year. Same with the teeming hordes of experts on HN who said driverless cars will never come. All wrong. People on this site need to stop jumping on these band wagons of stupidity and pointless blame games.

Can we talk about that rather than blame corporations for being what they’ve been since before AI? Yeah corporations are psychopaths and corrupt and nobody cares. Same story till the end of time. We are on a cusp of a paradigm shift and your skills as a programmer are about to be utterly trashed because an AI is on trajectory to dominate your skills.

Face reality.

Starman_Jones 11 hours ago | parent | next [-]

>> People hate AI because AI is on a trajectory to replace them and become better than a human. That is the fundamental reality.

Let’s explore this fundamental reality a bit. The “and” necessitates both parts of the clause be true, but would people hate AI if it became better than them but didn’t replace them? That’s an easy no; Big Blue and AlphaGo didn’t cause mass hatred, and machines have been broadly better than humans in some capacity for centuries - that’s literally why we build machines.

Would humans stop hating AI if it replaced them, but wasn’t able to become better than them? Again, no. So the second piece is both incorrect and unnecessary, and what we’re left with is “People hate AI because it’s on a trajectory to replace them,” which is accurate, but not exactly revelatory; many people have already come to this same conclusion, including in this very comment thread. So the good news about your face reality line is that you’ll find a lot of people already facing that direction alongside you.

threethirtytwo 10 hours ago | parent [-]

>but would people hate AI if it became better than them but didn’t replace them? That’s an easy no;

Yes they will. Jealousy. But they'd never admit it. What are you proud of? What skill do you value and identify yourself with? Say AI did it 1000x better than you but some law was in place to prevent it from replacing you. You'd love that law, and you'd make up some excuse to to hate AI.

>Big Blue and AlphaGo didn’t cause mass hatred

Excuses. Just think a little rather then finding some obvious surface level reasoning that fits within your own bias. First nobody hates those things because it's only a select niche that takes pride in their chess or go skills. Those people will hate alphago if alphago was a direct challenge to their identity as a player. But laws are in place to prevent that as in tournaments only allow humans. Why are such laws in place? Because go and chess are just games. They produce no intrinsic value so it doesn't hurt the bottom line if you restrict AI in that case.

This isn't the case for programming and any other field out there that can be replaced by AI. Ai will be directly attacking a business skill you use to pay the rent and it is currently challenging my identity as a programmer. And laws to restrict this will be actively fought against because monetarily and utility wise there is actual real world benefits to AI.

But why do I even need to spell this out to you? You're not mentally deficient. You're not stupid. All of this is obvious. Why do I have to literally tell you why your example is biased when it is OBVIOUS. It's because you're lying to yourself. You subconsciously avoided the obvious reasoning above. You chose convenient rationale to fit the narrative YOU want. Nobody hates "alphago" lol, did you see that koreans guy face when alphago fucking dominated his ass? Come on bro.

That is the reality. And you are denying it. When there's two people in disagreement and one of them is lying to themselves... how do we know which one it is? The lie is so convincing that both people believe in it.

I'll tell you the best way to determine this. The best way is to see which persons reasoning aligns with their identity and biases. Which person is constructing a logical scaffold that is optimistic? Because lies are told to cover up the horrors of reality. Guess what? I'm a programmer. I hate AI. But I cannot lie to myself. You? Probably made up all kinds of lies about how you're not afraid of AI taking over your job cuz AI can't do this... or that... or whatever bs to help you sleep at night.

Starman_Jones 5 hours ago | parent [-]

I don’t think your argument around jealousy holds as much weight as you think it does. I’d encourage you to revisit your logic and work through the implications for yourself. Does it need to be AI to provoke this response? Would another human being better provoke this same response? What conditions actually trigger it?

I’d also recommend you read more about Lee Sedol’s matches against AlphaGo. I don’t think your description of it syncs up with the actual event, and certainly isn’t supported by his post-AlphaGo performance.

Finally, most of your post isn’t really supporting the point you’re trying to make. In particular, “Ai will be directly attacking a business skill you use to pay the rent” is just restating what I’m arguing. If you misunderstood my position that badly, it would be good to take stock of your own position, because I really think that the core of it - people hate AI because it’s threatening their livelihood - is pretty obviously correct, and you just need to remove the breathless hyperbole from your thesis to get something that most people already agree with.

nmeagent 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Now my company...

Which company is that? Do let us know so I can make sure to never be your customer.

13 hours ago | parent | next [-]
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threethirtytwo 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

12 hours ago | parent [-]
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hackable_sand 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The public also hates the lies and the threats about the tech

salawat 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

>People hate admitting the truth. Everything you said here is utter bs that people say to lie to themselves.

Stares at poster silently from a lotus position waiting for the enlightenment lightbulb

>I’m sick and tired of AI hatred without people facing the truth. People hate AI because AI is on a trajectory to replace them and become better than a human. That is the fundamental reality.

Nu-bie, come, sit, be silent & reflect. When was the last time a tool was made that truly replaced the wielder? Without the wielder, a tool is nothing, without the tool, the wielder still strides as a beacon of divine potential.

>Look don’t get angry at me. If you are on HN chances are you’re most likely delusional and completely wrong about AI.

Continues staring in silence awaiting the moment of enlightenment

>Now my company won’t even hire someone who hasn’t used Claude and I haven’t touched a text editor or ide in half a year. Same with the teeming hordes of experts on HN who said driverless cars will never come. All wrong. People on this site need to stop jumping on these band wagons of stupidity and pointless blame games.

Nu-bie. Does the man disappear because the machine exists? Or is he redirected according to his nature? What nature consumes a man abandoned by his tribe? Surrounded by hoarders of the necessities & means of life? Reflect on this. Reflect also on the potential capabilities of a group of people that through attention to detail, great patience, and acts of artifice on behalf of their fellows once enabled the animation and thinking of rocks. Think very carefully about this.

>Can we talk about that rather than blame corporations for being what they’ve been since before AI? Yeah corporations are psychopaths and corrupt and nobody cares. Same story till the end of time. We are on a cusp of a paradigm shift and your skills as a programmer are about to be utterly trashed because an AI is on trajectory to dominate your skills.

The corporation is as a cup. It's direction is controlled and agency guided by men. It is the oldest form of AI, with us for hundreds of years. The only thing keeping it in check being the occasional times of great strife during which generations of men wrestle the beast, to remind ourselves of wherein our problems truly originate.

>Face reality.

Nu-bie, it is time for you to resume your chores. You have not been enlightened.

dominotw 14 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

not to mention all the AI boosters seems to have the most hatable scammy personalities. why are they all so smug.

magnet for scum like boosters on X, middle managment types, linkedin ai influences, ppl making fake videos on facebook.

rvz 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Not a surprise. Seems like AI is more hated than crypto and this shows that the AI industry is in a bubble.

At least crypto does not take away more jobs than it creates, where as we all know AI takes away more jobs and no-one can give a solution or explain what the "new jobs" are.

Because the value from AI is to automate the jobs from humans. Claiming otherwise is being intellectually dishonest. Same goes for defining "AGI".

YZF 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Crypto sucks energy and creates no value. It's complete and utter speculative garbage that also destroys the planet.

AI has real value. We can argue about whether the cost is worth the value, whether we're on an exponential improvement curve or not, whether it ends up creating jobs or destroying jobs, but AI is mind blowing science fiction that nobody would have believed you will exist 10 years ago.

rvz 7 hours ago | parent [-]

> Crypto sucks energy and creates no value. It's complete and utter speculative garbage that also destroys the planet.

All of what you said is false.

Stablecoins are not speculative and have value, and you can send money at a low fee, low cost, worldwide to wallets on the same day, right now with far less energy than today's "AI".

> AI has real value.

What do you mean by "AI" specifically? LLMs in data centers?

The value in for this mysterious "AI" or even "AGI" paradise is not even for you. It is actually used against you.

> We can argue about whether the cost is worth the value, whether we're on an exponential improvement curve or not

You understand that the current iteration of "AI" needs tens of gigawatts of energy and hundreds of billions of dollars and wasteful amounts of water which causes electricity prices in certain cities to skyrocket?

The way that it is financed appears to be close to fraudulent with vague "commitments" and mountains of debt that would take almost a trillion dollars in revenue to pay off the data centre build out.

> whether it ends up creating jobs or destroying jobs, but AI is mind blowing science fiction that nobody would have believed you will exist 10 years ago.

Assuming after the data centers will be built (if they ever will be), can you name what are those new jobs that will be created from "AI"?

binyu 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> At least crypto does not take away more jobs than it creates

Except sometimes when there's a huge black swan event, or when the bubble pops. Such things can result in significant layoffs even though it's a completely different mechanism.