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margalabargala 4 hours ago

"Financial damages".

So what? Causing someone financial damages isn't illegal. Your boss causes you financial damages when they fire you. Your competitor causes you financial damages when they offer a discount.

If Micay was a 50% owner, sounds like he didn't do anything illegal. Immature maybe, which simply puts him at parity with the other party involved.

kennywinker 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Immature maybe

Yeah, that’s the issue. I don’t want people who behave immaturely, impulsively, or vindictively, having a key role in something as important as my phone os. I want stability, maturity, and thoughtfulness.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

That is what CopperheadOS, and now GrapheneOS, provides. Its a level of "battle tested" that most OS and app devs never have the opportunity to have. Deleting the signing keys during a hostile takeover attempt rather than submitting to pressure or greed is an amazing quality that is rare to find. Nobody behaved or is behaving immaturely, impulsively, or vindictively.

exceptione 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Understandable wishes, but you might have to put something from yourself into it if this is a pressing concern. Or you will be left to your own corporate devices.

kennywinker 3 hours ago | parent [-]

What exactly are you suggesting? If i go help out at the graphene os project, that won’t change their leadership. Should I make my own fork?

exceptione 3 hours ago | parent [-]

The GOS (GrapheneOS) lead had responded to criticisms like yours that he gladly retreats inside his tech role if others would take it upon them to refute the claims from rivals. So if you are that balanced, normal person, you could take that work out of his hands. Or help fund a full time PR person.

«In 2018, matters between Micay and Donaldson came to a head over Donaldson’s desire to pursue business deals with criminal organizations, and his attempts to compromise the security of CopperheadOS, including by proposing license enforcement and remote updating systems that would allow third-parties to have access to users’ phones. As part of this process, Donaldson began to demand that Micay provide Donaldson with the “signing keys” - i.e. the credentials required to verify the authenticity of releases of CopperheadOS. Donaldson advised that, in order to secure certain new business, potential customers required access to the Keys.»

Micay is rightfully paranoia, just having a GOS phone makes some government agencies quite mad. There are many ways a project like GOS could die, disinformation could certainly kill it. Other projects don't help the case if they throw mud at it. Rather, they should focus on their real technical shortcomings, but such articles aren't written somehow. https://eylenburg.github.io/android_comparison.htm

EDIT

  > Should I make my own fork?
You could contact him to offer your help where he falls short.
HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent [-]

Micay is not paranoid. Paranoia implies unsubstantiated fear. But they acted responsibly under pressure and the project is upfront with what happened to the public and to journalists alike.

goodpoint an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Then avoid GrapheneOS

cf100clunk 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Mental health and wellness issues in high tech research and development are everywhere. I would suggest that you focus on the product and what it can/cannot do for you.

kennywinker 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Suggest away. It’s still a factor in my decision making, because if I can’t trust the developers to behave well, i can’t trust the product to continue to do what it says it can do for me.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent [-]

They have proven to "behave well" for years. Destroying the signing keys in the midst of a hostile takeover is the responsible thing to do. Its for the safety of their users. Thats a commendable trait to have.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

None of the GrapheneOS development team is mentally ill or unwell.

goodpoint 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

When you have to trust the OS images generated by the authors it becomes a massive issue.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent [-]

You always trust the developers of software. The only way to stop that is to not use the software.

joyous_limes 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

rigonkulous 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The path to maturity requires immaturity.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Deleting the signing keys for the sake of protecting ones users is the mature and responsible thing to do.

ryanmcbride 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Things aren't only bad if they're illegal. There's plenty of bad things one can do that are perfectly legal, and plenty of good things one can do that are totally illegal.

abnercoimbre 3 hours ago | parent [-]

And there are legal remedies to create deterrents without a court. Boycotts, journalism or new competition.

4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
Avamander 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

More like the coordinates of a home were burned to protect its occupants. It was a practical choice, not an ideological one.

dmbche 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If you own something you can do what you want with it including rendering it useless

amalcon 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

If you own all of it, yes. If you only own most of it, the minority owners do have some rights -- just fewer than you do.

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Micay owns the whole project. Ownership of the project was not exchanged or divided, part of the explicit terms of the agreement were that Micay would hold the keys and ownership of the project just as they always have.

dmbche 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Sure!

Avamander 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

HybridStatAnim8 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Thats a characteristic all modern OSs and modern apps have. You need to trust the key holders, always. Some people make their own builds for this reason. Depends on tge threat model.

Avamander an hour ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]