| ▲ | danirod 2 days ago |
| Heh, lucky you, at least you get a message. My ISP just drops traffic to the affected IPs. No ping, no traceroute, just a spinner in the browser until it says "page not found". Every response and comment from LaLiga, the football organization responsible for this, has been so far that this is a minor issue that only affects a few bunch of nerds who talk about "docker images" or "github repositories" or "whatever that means". Meanwhile, there are testimonies of smart home devices like anti-theft alarms or automatic doors, that stop working whenever there is a football match, because their backends rely on Cloudflare. Last week, a woman asked for help on social media, as the GPS tracking app she uses to see where her father with dementia is, went offline during a match. It was getting late and he still wasn't back home, and she couldn't locate the tag he was wearing to find him: https://www.infobae.com/america/agencias/2026/04/05/laliga-d... It's hard to say this, because no one should experience an event like this, but as stressful as these are, it's the only way to make the mainstream people care about this censorship. "I cannot pull a docker image" will never be on nightly news, but safety and personal security is a more powerful driver for discourses. |
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| ▲ | pxc 2 days ago | parent | next [-] |
| > Heh, lucky you, at least you get a message. My ISP just drops traffic to the affected IPs. No ping, no traceroute, just a spinner in the browser until it says "page not found". This is generally how the GFW works in China. Instead of an overbearing nanny like a school or corporation's DNS blocker, you're left with a sense that you're on a version of the Internet that is just intermittently and somewhat mysteriously broken. And indeed, in China, a lot of things that probably aren't fully intended to be blocked are not reliably accessible. Implementation varies, so you get strange routing and peering issues. It feels like an Internet that isn't fully formed, that hasn't finished coming together yet. Nation states and corporations obviously gain some things sometimes by having Internet censorship/blocking frameworks in place. Maybe, sometimes, ordinary people even benefit, too, if it helps shut down illegal and genuinely harmful businesses. But it feels like the whole world is gradually trending towards more and more Internet censorship without realizing that we are un-building a miraculous thing that took enormous effort and cleverness and expense to build. I wish we could think about this not only in terms of freedom (and we absolutely should think about it in terms of freedom), but how we are disintegrating the infrastructure of communication and computing. |
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| ▲ | goodcanadian a day ago | parent | next [-] | | This is generally how the GFW works in China. Instead of an overbearing nanny like a school or corporation's DNS blocker, you're left with a sense that you're on a version of the Internet that is just intermittently and somewhat mysteriously broken. Oh boy, an excuse to share my favourite great firewall story on a visit to China. Keep in mind, this is 15 years old, so probably doesn't represent the current state of affairs. At the time, my daily news reading habit had me checking BBC and CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation). The BBC site seemed to be working fine, but whenever I clicked on an article on CBC, it was blocked. A few minutes later, I went to show my wife that CBC articles were blocked, and I clicked on the same one again, and it loaded. I clicked on another: blocked. Tried it again after a few minutes and it loaded. Someone was screening the articles in real time for me. When I was done reading, I clicked on several of the weirdest headlines I could find, and after a few minutes, everything was blocked again including ones that had previously worked. | |
| ▲ | RiverCrochet 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Your last paragraph: it is sad. But we had successful global networks before the Internet (the PSTN, telegraph) and we'll certainly have global networks after this at some point in human history. Perhaps in the the time between the Internet and what's next, the world will become a bit more mature about a few things. | | |
| ▲ | Spooky23 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Those predecessor networks weren’t problem free. Many conversations to “interesting” places were monitored. The counter-reaction to this era will include additional communication control. | |
| ▲ | jazzyjackson 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | this is teleological thinking. it's not necessarily the case that things get better over time. | | |
| ▲ | dingnuts 2 days ago | parent [-] | | there's a lot of evidence things do generally get better over time, though. Jon Haidt and his ilk... I forget all involved... have done research into it obviously it can be bumpy and maybe there's a Great Filter or you happen to live during a bad period but life is certainly much longer and less brutal than it was for 99.9% of human history | | |
| ▲ | sigbottle a day ago | parent [-] | | Things have mostly gotten better through centralization and unification, which is certainly a way of getting better. |
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| ▲ | mschuster91 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | > But we had successful global networks before the Internet (the PSTN, telegraph) These were ripe with espionage, wiretapping and sabotage. Access to it used to be highly restricted as well, up until the 90s for example you were only allowed to connect government-licensed modems to the German PSTN directly. | | |
| ▲ | RiverCrochet 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | > These were ripe with espionage, wiretapping and sabotage. Just like today's Internet. BGP spoofing, CALEA, DDoS. > Access to it used to be highly restricted as well ... And this is where the regression or "downfall" is beginning. Access to the Internet (as in ability to send/receive arbitrary data to the wider Internet) is something I bet is going to be increasingly restricted, but most people won't notice because they don't understand the difference between apps and the Internet. I'd be surprised if direct access to the Internet is possible for consumers in the next 10 years. Everything will have to be through approved apps (age assurance is going to be the catalyst) that work over registered tunnels contracted through ISPs, if there isn't an outright blurring or merger between the concepts of phone/CPE, ISP and CDN. Your non-tech layperson will not know any difference whatsoever if all they use are their phone plan, streaming/banking apps and Facebook. | |
| ▲ | angry_octet 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Surely this was simply the nature of Deutsche Bundespost / Deutsche Telekom? Like, of course you had to use hardware they had approved to connect to their network. This was the same in many places. The cost of hardware and connection time limited connections, and no one had cryptography except the government and ultra nerds. | |
| ▲ | sneak 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | There was also no way for a normal person to easily and cheaply communicate with 20 million people in realtime. | | |
| ▲ | RiverCrochet 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | If you're a normal person, you still can't, but it definitely looks like you can by ad-supported social networks. If you have 20 million followers on Facebook, your posts aren't guaranteed to reach them, unless you pay Facebook as an advertiser. Running a web server that handles and actually gets 20 million simultaneous connections for any length of time requires you to spend/have money or not be a normal person. |
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| ▲ | nrds 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | > a version of the Internet that is just intermittently and somewhat mysteriously broken. That's actually just how the Internet is. Nothing to do with the great firewall. |
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| ▲ | freetanga 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| All people affected should file a complaint with your ISP and with Oficina de Atención al Usuario de Telecomunicaciones claiming financial loss for arbitrary service censorship. |
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| ▲ | embedding-shape 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | I've been filing complaints since a year ago, told others to do the same too, nothing happens. There been moments I've meant to deploy fixes to issues but I cannot, because some tooling goes offline. I've claimed financial loss, claimed sanity loss and everything in-between, but I'm afraid unless something reaches the European/EU courts, Spain will continue to be in the pocket of the La Liga owners. Straight up fucking censorship with wide collateral being completely accepted in a Western country in 2026, beyond comprehension how this is allowed. | | |
| ▲ | ryandrake 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Whenever I get a little down over how much power unelected corporations have in my country, I can at least cheer myself up a little by being thankful that something as stupid as football doesn't have enough power here to control whether or not I have internet access. | | |
| ▲ | necovek 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | La Liga is basically operating like an "unelected corporation" as well. | | |
| ▲ | mrroper 17 hours ago | parent [-] | | The problem is probably just distributed responsibility. If I lived in Spain I'd set their website as my proxy for everything that doesn't work before I filed my complaints so they could directly address each problem.. |
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| ▲ | embedding-shape 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Ignorance is a bliss, agree :) Sometimes we all need to force ourselves into that so we can get a bit more joy. | |
| ▲ | sneak 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | It would if it were bigger business in your country. Try torrenting an MCU movie and see what happens to your ISP account. | | |
| ▲ | bombcar 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Someone in Texas torrenting an MCU slop doesn’t disconnect me from half the Internet. | |
| ▲ | voidUpdate a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | In my experience, nothing... | |
| ▲ | fn-mote 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | Out of curiosity, what does happen? | | |
| ▲ | Semaphor a day ago | parent | next [-] | | AFAIK not much in most of the world, in Germany you get a letter from lawyers wanting ~1000 EUR | | |
| ▲ | SturgeonsLaw a day ago | parent [-] | | In Australia the court ruled that they can only sue for the cost of renting the movie, so they don't bother trying to recoup their ten bucks | | |
| ▲ | iamtedd a day ago | parent | next [-] | | That's interesting. Do you have further reading? I've seen AFACT v iiNet, but that doesn't look to be the source of "cost of renting", just that the ISP isn't responsible for their users. | | |
| ▲ | SturgeonsLaw a day ago | parent [-] | | Yep, check out Dallas Buyers Club v iiNet Here's some commentary on it: > Justice Perram discussed the idea of speculative invoicing within Australia > Representing to a consumer that they have a liability which they do not may well be misleading and deceptive conduct within the meaning of s 18 of the Australian Consumer Law and it may be equally misleading to represent to someone that their potential liability is much higher than it could ever realistically be. There may also be something to be said for the idea that speculative invoicing might be a species of unconscionable conduct within one or other of s 21 of the Australian Consumer Law or s 12CB of the Australian Securities and Investments Commission Act 2001 (Cth). > Further, even if speculative invoicing was deemed to be lawful within Australia, the damages that the individual may be liable to are often calculated differently to that of the United States. In Australia, damages are compensatory in nature, meaning to compensate the plaintiff for the loss suffered. One Intellectual Property Lawyer has been quoted as saying, ‘If a film costs $20, the damages would ordinarily be expected to be $20.’ https://www.kells.com.au/insights/business/dallas-buyers-clu... |
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| ▲ | Sanzig a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Canada is capped at $5k for noncommercial infringement, and even at that amount it still isn't worth it for the copyright holder to go to court. |
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| ▲ | sneak 21 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Your ISP sends you a "strike" letter, and eventually cancels your service if you continue to receive them. |
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| ▲ | rock_artist 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If anyone who’s capable in Spain set a petition or the relevant steps and put it on HN. I’m pretty sure any Spanish resident in HN would be more than happy to take part even if it means to send a Bizum for the cause. (Sadly as living in Spain for about a year I’m still not in such place to raise this or understand the full steps needed) | |
| ▲ | drnick1 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If this is done at the DNS level, run your own DNS. If not, use a VPN. Taking this to the courts is a long term solution, but in the short term you want to act on your own to evade censorship and oppression. | | |
| ▲ | gschizas a day ago | parent [-] | | > run your own DNS Can you expand on that? How would you go about running your own DNS that wouldn't be affected by football leagues? | | |
| ▲ | martheen a day ago | parent [-] | | If it's purely DNS blocking (no IP redirection or blocking), your own recursive resolver (eg, unbound) shouldn't be affected, assuming the ISP doesn't also intercept unencrypted DNS queries. If there's also interception, encrypted DNS upstream might help (assuming they're not blocked entirely, repressive countries do this, so far not in EU) I don't think any of them will help in Spain case though, I believe the ISP/court choose to block the IP range entirely, which hit Cloudflare customers. DNS hijinks won't solve those. |
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| ▲ | dariosalvi78 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | these things need to be brought to an international court who would require the government to act. Otherwise nothing happens, because institutions are completely corrupt. It takes time, money and a strong legal team, but maybe IT companies maybe can put this together? | |
| ▲ | lentil_soup 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | how do you make claims, here: https://usuariosteleco.digital.gob.es/? Can't find a way of doing it with Cl@ve | | | |
| ▲ | emptysongglass 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Because the EU as a whole is quite happy to censor and generally wield the same tricks as "non-Western" countries in their desires to combat misinformation (however our EU bureaucrats define it), child abuse materials (see Chat Control that thing is not going to go away), and hatred (oh boy). We've never guaranteed the right to free speech and because we haven't it's a slippery slope all the way back down to the furnaces of autocracy we sprang from. The Spanish president has come out on record saying we don't deserve anonymity on the internet. | | |
| ▲ | megous a day ago | parent [-] | | Not sure why you get downvoted. EU censors quite a bit. I can't read about 10 Telegram channels that I could access just 3 years ago, and the list is growing.
All due to "vioalted laws of [my country]". (said near-east related channels have nothing to do with my country, government just doesn't want me to read them) Some people deemed "russian assets" are not just censored, but stripped of ability to leave EU and prevented from being able to live in EU at the same time by financial sanctions, etc. Of course this doesn't happen to actual politicians in power, for whatever reason those never get sanctioned by EC, despite doing more "damage" than random blabberheads on twitter. It's a mess. | | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape a day ago | parent [-] | | > EU censors quite a bit "EU" doesn't censor anything, there isn't even any authority nor infrastructure that could do that. Individual countries, like Spain, does have a bunch of censorship though, this is pretty clear and evident already. But I think if you want to share something useful or even informative, you need to add what country this experience of yours is about, because it's not true in any/every EU country. |
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| ▲ | madaxe_again a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | It’s football. I’m pretty sure there are a great many countries you could induce to do insane things if the populace could be made to believe that said insane things will help football. I mean, didn’t El Salvador and Honduras go to war over football back in the 60’s? And I seem to recall there was a football match which helped precipitate the dissolution of Yugoslavia - national identities coalesced around football tribes. |
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| ▲ | bakugo 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Sadly, it won't accomplish anything. La Liga seems to have enough political power in the country to bury all of that. Probably bribing everyone involved. | | |
| ▲ | cluckindan 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Corruption at that level could mean organized crime. Is there a culture of betting through illegal bookies, are they fixing matches, or ¿porque no los dos? | | |
| ▲ | hunterpayne 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | No, its worse than that. If you wish, learn about FIFA and how it works. At least the mafia fears the government somewhat...FIFA doesn't. | |
| ▲ | hdgvhicv a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | FIFA makes the mafia look like a bake sale committee | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Well, I think when the organized crime is registered as proper businesses and they have the judges on their side even if the law isn't, I think we just call that "for-profit capitalism" nowadays. | |
| ▲ | dualvariable 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | penalti para el real madrid! | | |
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| ▲ | 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | loloquwowndueo 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It would be great if there was a webpage with clear instructions on how to do this, maybe fill out a few questions and get a printable pdf you can mail, or at least telling you how to file an online complaint. Making complaints very low friction will lead to more of those and perhaps more attention to the issue. Snail mail uses up physical space so it might get more attention, it would be hilarious to see news reports of truckloads of complaint mail being dumped in front of the whatever office. | | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape 2 days ago | parent [-] | | > It would be great if there was a webpage with clear instructions on how to do this, maybe fill out a few questions and get a printable pdf you can mail, or at least telling you how to file an online complaint. Making complaints very low friction will lead to more of those and perhaps more attention to the issue. This is a great idea, we definitively should make this happen! If people are curious on collaborating on something, reach out, email in profile (English or Spanish emails welcome!). |
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| ▲ | pixl97 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yep, flood them with complaints. | |
| ▲ | estebarb 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | At this point the protests should be against the matches themselves. But let's be honest: nobody cares anymore. | |
| ▲ | bluecalm a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | It's Spain man. Nothing will happen, maybe they will call their buddies in La Liga to ask what's up if the complains pile up and then will ignore all of them if they are assured everything works as expected. |
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| ▲ | xp84 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Who cares if she can’t find her elderly father? A small price to pay to preserve the stratospheric prices on football TV rights!!!! |
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| ▲ | vasco a day ago | parent [-] | | The thing is it doesn't protect anything. All it does is funnel money to VPN providers | | |
| ▲ | xp84 a day ago | parent [-] | | It does something: the people who pay for the TV rights threaten the league or whoever if they don’t try to push for this type of BS. It’s not about whether it’s actually effective at stopping those who do pirate. It’s about placating whatever media conglomerate paid €XXX million for those TV rights. |
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| ▲ | the_gipsy 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It's ridiculous and wrong what LaLiga does. But it's also a weakeup call to consider ditching cloudflare's centralization. |
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| ▲ | estebank 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | The companies relying on cloudflare won't be in Spain. If you buy a GPS tracker by a Canadian company, developed in India, manufactured in China, they are unlikely to know, even it they cared, that a single country that accounts for a tiny percentage of their sales breaks fundamental internet infrastructure on the regular "because fútbol y dinero". And when purchasing a product, there's no "bill of materials" telling you about the services it relies on, beyond "internet connection" at best. | | |
| ▲ | encom 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | >fundamental internet infrastructure I'm not saying this situation isn't bullshit, but the bigger problem is that CloudFlare is now "fundamental internet infrastructure". This is precisely the situation that the internet was designed to prevent. Yesterday I got stuck in endless CloudFlare CAPTCHA's, trying to access theretroweb.com. I had to give up. Many such cases. I hate CloudFlare so much, it's unreal. | | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | > This is precisely the situation that the internet was designed to prevent Right, but on the other hand, our constitution and laws are supposed to give us the rights to access a internet where the government cannot block entire companies who host websites, because a few bad websites are hosted there. Not to mention all us freelancers, contractors and just in general computing users, who sometimes want to continue working although 90% of the country is watching football, we should be able to do so even if pirates use Cloudflare for shitty stuff. I agree that Cloudflare sucks, people should avoid defaulting to putting Cloudflare in front of absolutely everything they do and I too get stuck at the CAPTCHAs sometimes. But that doesn't remove the fact that Cloudflare, just like every other lawful company, should be allowed to be visited during La Liga matches. | | |
| ▲ | rightofcourse a day ago | parent | next [-] | | The LaLiga post seem to accuse Cloudflare of unlawful activity directly by protecting criminals, not just the illegal streamers. At least my reading (of Google translation) is that they target Cloudflare here and it works "as expected" since Cloudflare is the bad guys. | | | |
| ▲ | bombcar 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | I’d love for a way to put all my sites behind Cloudflare only during La Liga matches. | | |
| ▲ | drob518 a day ago | parent [-] | | Why? | | |
| ▲ | bombcar 13 hours ago | parent [-] | | Because if everyone did it, the absurdity of La Liga being able to Iran the entirety of the Spanish internet might become apparent. | | |
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| ▲ | j0057 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It takes very little money to rent massive botnet capacity to perform crippling DDOS attacks. Unfortunately there are only very few CDNs capable of absorbing that kind of attack. | |
| ▲ | girvo a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | I’d happily use anything else, but it (with CF Tunnels and its DDoS and caching systems) is what lets me self host on my little home server on today’s internet. Would gladly move to some other system (or systems) |
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| ▲ | otabdeveloper4 a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | > breaks fundamental internet infrastructure I think lots of countries block Cloudflare whole-sale. Laundering IP addresses for (or against) shady purposes is, in fact, Cloudflare's whole business. It's a wonder Cloudflare isn't being blocked more often. |
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| ▲ | miki123211 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The only reason this happens is because Cloudflare's centralization makes precise censorship impossible. That's bad in this particular case (as it results in over-broad censorship), but good in general, as it makes censorship harder. Without Cloudflare, you can censor whatever you want. If you have the support of an (undemocratic) government on your side, you can even DeDoS them, making sure that information critical of you cannot see the light of day. | | |
| ▲ | sigbottle a day ago | parent [-] | | That's actually an interesting argument for centralization, when it comes to interoperability concerns. I have never thought about it. Of course, the standard response against centralization is that the centralized entity can sneak backdoors and turn at the drop of a hat. Maybe something like a signal-like model might be good, in that regard, as opposed to mesh networks. |
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| ▲ | direwolf20 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Cloudflare has nothing to do with it. Actually you should further insist on using Cloudflare in Spain to increase the collateral cost of this ridiculous government decision as much as possible. Make it so not a single website works during football, and see if the government changes their tune. | | |
| ▲ | cryptonym a day ago | parent [-] | | If cloudflare is providing services to illegal websites, they very much are in full control of the situation. They knowingly choose to keep hosting that content, and have legal customers exposed to that risk. You may like that the platform is open by default to everybody, but that's the obvious consequence. | | |
| ▲ | lukan a day ago | parent [-] | | Does cloudflare refuse a court order to take down a site? I don't think so. | | |
| ▲ | cryptonym a day ago | parent [-] | | Are blocking unlawful? I don't think so. Their country their rules. Business-wise it's risky to deliver your service from IPs that also serves dirty content. Technical solutions exists, even if you want to stay on Cloudflare. | | |
| ▲ | drob518 a day ago | parent | next [-] | | But it also highlights the fact that the idea of blocking “dirty IPs” is at best a blunt instrument. Every ISP has abusers. Some are worse than others at self-policing their customers. Cloudflare is reputable and better than most. Given the huge breadth of sites sitting behind Cloudflare, it’s crazy, IMO, to block all of Cloudflare. | | |
| ▲ | cryptonym a day ago | parent | next [-] | | It does not block all of cloudflare, it blocks their shared IPs.
If you are doing serious business you may not want to do it on IPs that are also used for shady content.
IP reputation is a well known strategy, used by emails and other firewalls. | | |
| ▲ | drob518 a day ago | parent [-] | | Okay, so they aren’t blocking whole ranges. Yea, you definitely don’t want to share an IP with a spammer or malware site. I thought they were blocking whole ranges. |
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| ▲ | direwolf20 a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | In other countries, like Italy, they made a system where domain names are fast-tracked for blocking within minutes. I hate to say it but Spain managed to do something even worse. |
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| ▲ | direwolf20 a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Country-wise it's risky to block the entire internet when football is on. | | |
| ▲ | cryptonym a day ago | parent [-] | | 1 - Cloudflare is not the entire internet.
2 - They close people who decide to go with a cheap/free shared host. Solutions exist if this market is important to your business. | | |
| ▲ | saintfire 18 hours ago | parent [-] | | Just a small 30% of the top 10k sites. Needing to find solutions to a problem completely manufactured by sports and television is the problem. | | |
| ▲ | cryptonym 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | Cloudflare is a private company, they might (unwillingly) benefit from hosting illegal services. They don't implement a quick or proactive process to take down content that is obviously illegal. The money made by illegal streaming websites doesn't end in good pockets, which raises further concerns. Such streaming is quickly spawn for the event, then disappear. Even if you fight them legally after the event, they operate from countries that won't cooperate. Cloudflare could change their policy to take down quickly obvious abuse during live events. They could proactively check new customers before allowing public traffic. People can vote against protecting property if they think it creates unreasonable effects. Not sure where you got your stats but top website owners can easily deploy technical solutions to this issue. We live in a complex word. This problem is not completely manufactured by bad people at sports and television companies. What should right owners do? Accept that content they own is streamed illegally, for profit, and not use recourses the law provides? |
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| ▲ | trailheadsec 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | I agree with this take (that it’s a wake up call). Makes one question their entire app design and if using Cloudflare is “good enough” for managing CDN, tunnels, etc. for their apps. |
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| ▲ | tobz1000 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > there are testimonies of smart home devices like anti-theft alarms or automatic doors, that stop working whenever [...] because their backends rely on Cloudflare. The fault here lies 100% with horribly designed IoT devices that turn into bricks when they lose internet connection. |
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| ▲ | shibapuppie a day ago | parent [-] | | Yeah the horribly designed alarm system that can't alert a central authority that something has gone wrong. Maybe we should just put huge air raid sirens on our homes instead? |
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| ▲ | matheusmoreira a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > Every response and comment from LaLiga, the football organization responsible for this, has been so far that this is a minor issue that only affects a few bunch of nerds who talk about "docker images" or "github repositories" or "whatever that means". Translation: go away kid, we're trying to make money here. |
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| ▲ | boredatoms 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Perhaps its time to put a VPN into all your CI jobs |
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| ▲ | tryauuum 2 days ago | parent [-] | | You can't fight political issues with clever technical solutions | | |
| ▲ | toast0 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | It depends on what the political system is trying to do. A VPN won't help against government blanket outages, where the target is complete control of communications, and attempts to circumvent may result in extreme penalty. In this case, where the government policy is to stop unauthorized streaming, and collatoral damage is acceptable, a VPN hosted in a more favorable location is likely to work enough. Afaik, I don't think Spain has the political appetite to block VPNs and such during football matches. You can still fight the political issue with political means, but in the mean time, you can also get work done. | | |
| ▲ | swiftcoder 2 days ago | parent [-] | | > Afaik, I don't think Spain has the political appetite to block VPNs and such during football matches Unfortunately nobody is quite sure what appetite they have, because LaLiga is doing this all on the back of a relatively narrow judicial ruling that hasn't been reviewed in a long time |
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| ▲ | peanut-walrus 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yes you can. Fight with clever technical solutions and the politics will follow once the solution becomes common or displays its usefulness. It is in fact the most effective way to fight dumb political issues. | | |
| ▲ | tryauuum 2 days ago | parent [-] | | In my country (Russia) the politics followed, now the ISPs block the OpenVPN and wireguard packets. And sometimes the white list mode is enabled, so you cannot connect, with your clever custom VPN solution, to a host outside the country | | |
| ▲ | necovek 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | You should be able to use things like sshuttle or even tunnel through HTTPS whatever you want, right? As you can control both sides of the tunnel with encryption (comes by default), no MITM-ing unless you are forced to use solutions that install and eavesdrop on your secure traffic too. | | |
| ▲ | out_of_protocol 2 days ago | parent [-] | | 1) they do protocol sniffing, and any inconsistency (including statistical) gets you blocked
2) "white list mode" which engaged sometimes (poorly implemented atm), means nothing goes outside of country at all (means 99.9% of everything is broken). They really want to become North Korea soon | | |
| ▲ | necovek a day ago | parent | next [-] | | Are any streaming sites allowed? It should be really easy to make a VPN through HTTPS tunnel appear to have a traffic pattern exactly like you are streaming videos and/or music (depending in the bandwidth needs) by throwing discardable traffic through when no valuable traffic is needed. Obviously, everything can be cut off, but the point is that if encrypted something is allowed, there should be a way to get anything through. | |
| ▲ | bryan_w 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | If they turn off the internet, that gives you more time to meet your neighbors and do "arts and crafts" and read (cook)books. He's getting so old, at some point the horse throws him off |
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| ▲ | peanut-walrus 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | And eventually even a worm will turn. |
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| ▲ | psychoslave 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | That's actually part of rebellion modus operandi, so totally something realistic. But not within the frame of law and not in the sweet position of someone away from the "I'll die for the just cause" mindset. | | |
| ▲ | tryauuum 2 days ago | parent [-] | | can you rephrase your idea please. What's realistic, fighting stupid laws or corporations with a VPN? Yes, but not for long. They are always stronger than you, they can switch from blacklisting to whitelisting and your VPN becomes useless. What is this "sweet position" you talk about? | | |
| ▲ | psychoslave 2 days ago | parent [-] | | Sorry for being unclear. I was trying to refer to an actual rebel position, which is actors which use illegal practices to achieve their goals agaisnt institutions in place. Which might have the cool attitude imagery attached to it, but which is certainly not an easy one in reality. |
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| ▲ | logicchains 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | You totally can, that's why bittorrent still exists and works fine. | |
| ▲ | fc417fc802 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | That became a popular refrain at some point but the truth of it varies. In fact many political issues are brought about by technical changes so obviously the reverse must be possible as well. What technical solutions can't change is the underlying social dynamics. | | |
| ▲ | necovek 2 days ago | parent [-] | | Even that is IMO untrue: "technical solutions" have indeed changed society at large quite significantly; eg. "social media" is one very influential example, "smart phone" is another, "internet" itself, etc. | | |
| ▲ | fc417fc802 2 days ago | parent [-] | | Aren't you agreeing with me? None of those things changed the underlying social dynamics that humans exhibit but they nonetheless affected widespread social and political change. | | |
| ▲ | necovek a day ago | parent [-] | | We might have different definitions of "social dynamics": to me, it is a marked change when people tune to impress strangers on "social media", vs building their "standing" with peers and neighbours. |
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| ▲ | a day ago | parent | prev [-] |
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