It's not about gutting moderation. They want you to dox yourself to get online. It's a pro-censorship authoritarian-friendly move. I don't believe the narrative that Meta is behind it all either. If they are, they are probably serving someone else.

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8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

[deleted]

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echelon 14 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Here are just some of the things you can do with tracking:

- Dox, coerce, blackmail, and ruin political candidates, powerful CEOs, and wealthy people. If they watch a category of porn that is embarrassing or have an affair, suddenly you have leverage against them. You can parlay that to accomplish lots of things.

- Make it impossible to talk about certain things and eventually eliminate those things. Porn today, abortion tomorrow. LGBT, women's rights ... it's a tool to start enforcing an ideology. Eventually these things can be disappeared entirely, not just the discourse. You just cordon off and begin washing it away bit by bit, year by year. Once the control mechanisms are in place, it cannot be stopped.

- Kill anonymous communication. This can pin identities to online comments. You can then punish people of the ideology you don't like by denying them jobs, auditing them, etc. This has a chilling effect on political opposition. This also makes it much harder to leak or report information safely and harms the ability to whistle blow.

- In general, this also pushes society into more religious, more conservative views. With it comes a lack of skepticism and a greater appreciation for authority.

- Ultimately, this is a step into 1984. If we go down that route, we will eventually be owned in whole by the authoritarian powers at top. This entire conversation will be memory holed.

Once a right is lost, we will not get it back. Then it's just one step after another into hell.

We must fight this.

Our lives, our freedom, our future - depend on it.

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scott_paul 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I disagree with almost all of your political opinions, and some of your positions I very much hate. But we should be free to have the argument, without the thread of handcuffs or the threat of starvation. Although I use my real name here, sometimes I prefer not to, and that should be allowed.

The right to actual real privacy is the same thing as the right to actual real freedom of speech, and we should harm anyone who is trying to take that most basic foundation of all rights away.

I agree with Alexander Solzhenitsyn.

	▲	echelon 13 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Regardless of how we (mis?)align on social and economic issues, we should align on dislike of authoritarianism and surveillance. It is our common enemy. ---- Edit: I can't respond to comments anymore (HN rate limits on downvotes and commenting within a single thread), but I also wanted to respond to a sibling comment: > "your team" Just because I believe in personal freedom of people from the government does not mean I'm left-wing. I agree with some democratic party policies, and I disagree with some others. I'm not strictly a libertarian either, because I believe government regulation is necessary to prevent monopolies. But over-regulation is also stifling to progress. But it shouldn't matter what my politics are. Social and economic issues are orthogonal, and frankly, not as potentially dangerous as this one issue. Democrats and Republicans alike should be aligned on their disdain of surveillance and authoritarianism. Either party in power (or any power) can use it against the "other side" (or the entire population outside of the oligopoly). These tools are nothing but evil and designed to control. Once they start sinking their teeth in, they only sink in deeper. Every free person should hate them.

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scotty79 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> ruin political candidates, powerful CEOs, and wealthy people

This is mostly fantasy propagated by works of fiction. In the real world release of any evidence of sins has practically zero impact on the wealthy people and when it very occasionally does have an impact it just happens in cases of people who weren't wealthy enough for the circumstances.

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rudhdb773b 13 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The government can do a whole lot more than embarrass CEOs and powerful people they don't like. Look at how China controls its tech CEOs by making them disappear until their views align.

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echelon 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The Epstein Island isn't just a fantasy playground for sickos.

Every single one of those people has a noose around their neck and is being told what to do. They have a gun to their head now.

The intelligence apparatus has been exploiting dynamics like this for a long time.

	▲	rdevilla 13 hours ago \| parent [-]
		The west runs on blackmail. If they can't find any dirt on you, you're not getting into power, and that's a fact.

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pembrook 13 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You've accurately described what could happen with right-wing authoritarians in power. You've not described what could happen with left-wing authoritarians in power.

Don't be fooled that your team doesn't have people with the same impulses. Privacy and civil liberties exist to protect us from abuse of authority on all sides.

- "Oh I see John is connected to this account. I really don't like this HN comment and opinion he posted, I find it deeply offensive. Put him on the bank KYC fail list."

- "We'd love to give you this mortgage backed by the US government, but why didn't you post the right flag in support of the new hip thing?"

- "Before you login to your retirement account, how much wealth are you secretly harboring there from this job we think you unfairly got due to your privilege?"

- "If you just let us monitor your activity and the ideas you see, we'll stop you from wrong-think and will create a utopia"

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rdevilla 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Good luck, man. Nobody cared in 2012, and even less people care now. The west is lost. 1984 is already here.

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echelon 13 hours ago | parent [-]

Don't give up!

If you think the heat has started, you're mistaken. We're not even in the fire yet. It can and will get waaaay worse.

We've been able to push back against these efforts time and time again. Don't stop. Call your legislators. Talk with your friends and get them to do the same. Vote against politicians that support it.

It does work.

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int_19h 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The problem is that, as a constituency, we are and have always been a tiny minority. Call and vote all you want, it won't change a thing because most people just don't care - or at least don't care enough. And there aren't any good (as far as they are concerned) arguments to convince them otherwise.

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rdevilla 13 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Whatever you think the scale of surveillance is, I assure you it is 100x worse.

North America is rooted. There is no recovery plan.

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timschmidt 13 hours ago | parent [-]

My understanding is that Abraham Lincoln literally had all the nation's telegraph lines routed through DC during the civil war, and AT&T has been an honorary branch of the US government ever since.

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rdevilla 13 hours ago | parent [-]

That tradition was carried into the modern era.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

	▲	timschmidt 13 hours ago \| parent [-]
		I'm aware. And the GP you're responding to's username is echelon. I think they're aware as well.