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morgengold 5 hours ago

I have no doubt isreali forces are responsible for a lot of war crimes. At the same time i see how one they cannot think and feel clearly anymore if your neighbours dream constantly about your elimination. All sides just need to stop with that hatred. It leads to so much pain.

wreath 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> i see how one they cannot think and feel clearly anymore if your neighbours dream constantly about your elimination. All sides just need to stop with that hatred. It leads to so much pain.

I think by now we all know this is a straw man, considering the disproportionate amount of power both parties have. There is absolutely no excuse left for what Israel has been doing in Gaza.

mhb 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Has Hamas left Gaza, given up its weapons, surrendered, or changed its charter?

adrian_b 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This will never stop, because on both sides there are people who benefit from the existence of the conflict and they are the ones with power.

The last time when Israel had a PM who was willing to find a way for ending the conflict, he was murdered and replaced by those who want a perpetual conflict.

I have worked in Israel for some years, and the vast majority of people that I have encountered were very nice, but I have also seen a few that were definitely evil, and of course, the evil ones were concentrated in positions like the government or the management of companies.

Because most Israelis live in constant fear that if they would ever lose their technological and financial superiority their neighbors will come and cut their throats, when I was there, and I assume that also today, the majority of the population was exploited in a way that would not be possible in any other country.

Everybody had to work very hard, much harder than in any other country, and prioritize work over anything else, because this was a patriotic duty, like one might have worked in USA during WWII or in Ukraine today or in any country that is at war and its survival depends on how everyone works, except that in Israel the war has been continuous for three quarters of a century.

For the elites of the country this war economy is extremely desirable because they can demand any sacrifices from the workers, since those are supposedly not for increasing the profits of the company owners, but for ensuring the survival of the nation, and anyone who would not want to do what is required would be seen as a traitor.

For ending the conflict, it is not possible to just say that from tomorrow the parties in conflict should stop hating each other. Reparations would be necessary, like Israel itself has received plenty from Germany and other countries.

However, it is very unlikely that Israel will ever have a government willing to end the conflict, instead of keeping it alive as long as possible, to have something with which to scare the population.

burnt-resistor 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Even post Epstein revelations, Chomsky's core thesis in The Fateful Triangle from 1983 still holds. A minority of hateful, brutish war hawks and crazy people on all 3 sides perpetuate a never-ending cycle of violence. The challenge is removing them from power and holding them accountable.

gravisultra 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[flagged]

sreejithr 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

There's another 1000+ "invaders took my shit" issues in the world. Your logic only leads to non-stop fights between everyone

readitalready 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

There are no other countries in the world where the foreign invaders maintain an apartheid system over the native population. Only Israel does that, having one set of rights for the foreign invaders and another set of rights for the native Palestinians. Even the US allows native americans full citizenship.

this2shallPass 35 minutes ago | parent [-]

This framing is flawed. Even if you accept the framing, the claims are false.

Tibet? Kashmir? Crimea? South Ossetia and Abkhazia?

Somewhat similar situations:

Rohingya Muslims in Myanmar are denied citizenship, face persecution, and live in camps under harsh conditions in Myanmar.

Uyghur Muslims in China are detained and repressed through mass incarceration, forced labor, and cultural assimilation.

The Tigray people in Ethiopia face systemic ethnic discrimination, violence, and exclusion.

In the Western Sahara, the Sahrawi people are discriminated against under Moroccan control, facing displacement and human rights abuses.

In South Sudan, ethnic groups face exclusion and violence in a divided state, with political and economic opportunities limited based on ethnicity.

Minimal research disproves the original claims.

Jews are from Judea. Jews are indigenous to the land of Israel, to the region, the Levant. This doesn't mean other people aren't indigenous. The indegeneity of any other group doesn't preclude the basic fact. Jews are indigenous, not foreign invaders.

About 20% of Israelis are not Jewish. They're mostly Arab and they have full citizenship, the ability to vote, form political parties, access courts, get healthcare (and give healthcare as plenty of doctors and nurses are Arab), education. One prominent example: an Arab Israeli (Palestinian? not sure if he identifies as such) judge convicted a Jewish Israeli President. That judge later became an Israeli Supreme court justice. Typical apartheid? Both were full citizens.

The apartheid libel doesn't actually help Arabs, Jews, Palestinians, Muslims, Christians, or anyone that seeks peace and coexistence. It is inaccurate and counterproductive.

gravisultra 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Are any of them doing that with my tax dollars? Is my president starting wars on their behalf? Am I having my rights stripped to stop me from speaking out about any other situation? Nothing impacts Americans like Zionism, it's the #1 problem facing our nation.

ignoramous 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> There's another 1000+ "invaders took my shit" issues in the world...

There's a lot less "invaders are continuing to take my shit". Probably a handful, and every such unresolved, escalating geo-political situation is pushing the world towards a dangerous timeline.

km3r 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Except those people are dead. Those who ethnically cleansed Arabs (and Jews) during the nakba are dead. Almost everyone who was ethnicity cleansed is now dead. At a certain point you need to recognize that a new generation has been born into this conflict, and with it, a change in circumstances. Attitudes like yours ignore that Israelis who were born there don't have another home to 'return' to.

That doesn't mean that Palestinians don't have a right to resist occupation, but the circumstances are significantly materially different today then 40 years ago.

gravisultra 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Joe Biden is older than the state of Israel and Zionists have continuously committed ethnic cleansing and apartheid since their inception. This is an active and current situation.

km3r 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Joe Biden was 6 was israel was created. 6 year olds are not responsible for ethnic cleansing.

And yes, there is ongoing issues (from both sides), but solving the current situation is very different than solving the ethnic cleansing that happened in 1948.

moogly 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]