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burnermore 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

See, here is what I've observed. I don't expect to change your POVs. Nevertheless...

The issue started when Israel was ready to have recognition from Saudi Arabia on their statehood. This would make Hamas irrelevant. And puts Sunnis (Iran) lesser recognised. Meanwhile Shia's (Saudi) will become the defacto in the Muslim world and half of Muslim world would either tolerate or be OK with Israel. Hamas attack on Israel at Oct 7 stopped that. Hamas has been supported by Iran for a long time. So in the whole Gaza - Israel thing, Iran was backing Hamas. Then they proxied with them by providing assistance. Then they eventually directly got involved.

You need to understand, there was good period of peace between Israel & Palestine until Oct 7.

While I reject US toppling govts around the world, Iran's hand is not clean in this one. But also, US thought this would be as easy as Venezuela and killing Iran's leader will stop this. Interfering in other countries biz have consequences. And in this case, it's true for Iran & US.

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coldtea 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

>You need to understand, there was good period of peace between Israel & Palestine until Oct 7.

Yes, in the year before Oct 7. alone Israel army had only killed about 40 Palestinian children (34 alone between Jan and Nov 2022).

Not to mention Iran has been a target since 2001: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNt7s_Wed_4 - if not since 1953 (their 1979 changes being a response to the 1950s western invervention that installed a dictatorship), if not since forever:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Game

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ribosometronome 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Sure, if you consider Israel killing several hundred Palestinians each year and having a thousand hostages, sorry, "administrative detainees" indefinitely incarcerated without charge as they continued to colonize Palestinian land peaceful.

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docdeek 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Pretty sure you have your Sunni and Shia confused there.

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Erem 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Sunnis (Iran)…Shia (Saudi)

These are reversed

	▲	burnermore 37 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		My bad. I meant that and typed exactly the opposite. Thanks.

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Hikikomori 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Mowing the lawn and stealing land in the west bank is what you call peace?

Israel even killed Irans negotiators last year when they were getting close to a deal. This situation is engineered, Netanyahu has wanted this for decades.

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dns_snek 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> You need to understand, there was good period of peace between Israel & Palestine until Oct 7.

What a disgusting and patronizing rewriting of history. This "peace" was enforced by ongoing occupation of Palestine and abuse of the people living there.

	▲	yard2010 5 hours ago \| parent [-]
		More pragmatic: peace was Palestinians getting to keep their houses standing and israelis not getting butchered by bloodthirsty monsters. Everything else is implementation detail I'd love to discuss.

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koshergweilo 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I have no idea why you would assume Israel had to resort to extortion to get Trump to help them bomb Iran. We bombed Venezuela a few weeks ago, no extortion required.

It's far more likely he was did it because Hegseth thought it would be more manly or something more ego driven than extortion. More likely it's just another example of flooding the zone to forget about the Epstein files and the stagnating economy

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dmos62 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> flooding the zone

I've often struggled to find a concise way to say "control public narrative by crowding out other headlines". Thank you for sharing the popular term for this [0].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flood_the_zone

	▲	koshergweilo 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		No problem! It's one of things that when you see it, you start to see it everywhere. The concept also has broad explanatory power: it explains seemingly irrational actions from otherwise shrewd actors such as Elon Musk spending so much on Twitter and a lot of Trump's smaller controversies

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potatototoo99 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Venezuela is in the eastern hemisphere, just like Cuba, and it seems they want to control that entire part of the world. Iran would be of no concern to the US if not for Israel.

	▲	koshergweilo 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		> Iran would be of no concern to the US if not for Israel. This is only true if you completely ignore the Sunni Shia split and our relationship with literally every other country in the Middle East excluding Israel. Edit: This is evidenced by the fact that when Iran was attacked by The US and Israel, they bombed a bunch of neighboring countries with US bases. None of those countries have alliances with Israel. (Although they are certainly less hostile than other countries in the region)

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4gotunameagain 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I am thinking the theories are true because of the must larger negative repercussions of that action.

They are strengthening the regime (US intelligence services were aware of that before the attack and had informed the president), they are destabilizing all their oil producers, they are risking great economic cost..

It only makes sense if indeed they either extorted him, or if he is indeed demented / deranged.

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names_are_hard 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Or he's just a manchild who likes doing things that he thinks will make him look strong.

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autoexec 5 hours ago | parent [-]

Picking on someone vastly weaker than you (especially while they're already getting beat up by somebody else) doesn't make you look strong, it mostly just makes you look like an asshole, and probably an asshole who is too scared or too weak to go after somebody who can actually fight back.

	▲	koshergweilo 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		> it mostly just makes you look like an asshole This is true, but only for a certain percentage of the US population. Large swaths of this country think that picking on our weaker neighbors evidence of our strength

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koshergweilo 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

You make it sound as if Trump is some kind of rational actor who would never willingly put his hand on the stove.

Indeed every negative repercussion you have mentioned has already been previously inflicted on us without any extortion required.

> They are strengthening the regime

Us action in Venezuela has only strengthened the PSUV's grip on the country.

> they are destabilizing all their oil producers, they are risking great economic cost.

Liberation day. Need I say more?

This administration is quite willing to risk stability and the economy to assuage Trump's ego.

I mean he campaigned on stuff like "the so-called enemy doesn’t respect our country any longer." Blaming "Kamala Harris’ weakness" for this loss of respect. What else shows strength like literally blowing up your adversary?