| ▲ | cannolicannon 3 hours ago |
| The big players are just awful at marketing; too many SKUs and models - it takes a paragraph to figure out how 2 Dell laptops from the same release year differ. Just hired a new colleague who prefers Windows. Dell seemed like a reasonable option for a good laptop. Here is Dell's current lineup: - Dell Laptop (with 14, 15, 16 inch variants) - Dell Plus (with 14, 15, and 16 inch variants) - Dell XPS (with 13, 14, and 16 inch variants) - Dell Premium (with 14 and 16 inch variants) - Dell Pro Essential (with 14 and 15 inch variants) - Dell Pro (with 14 and 16 inch variants) - Dell Pro Plus (with 14 and 16 inch variants) - Dell Pro Premium (with 14 and 16 inch variants) - Dell Pro Max (with 14 and 16 inch variants) - Dell Pro Max Plus (with 14, 16, and 18 inch variants) - Dell Pro Max Premium (with 14 and 16 inch variants) It's maddening trying to sift through the differences at this level. Then when you select a model, there can upwards of 8 different pre-built options to review. |
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| ▲ | laffOr an hour ago | parent | next [-] |
| I never understood why they didn't use the Apple "UI". Where Apple presents fewer models (say N models), and when you select one, each is configurable for screen size/RAM/CPU/whatever (say K picks), yielding N*K possibilities, many Windows laptop sellers present a list of N*K SKUs where you need to triple check what the difference between SKU A and B. |
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| ▲ | detourdog 8 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The last time (2005) I was faced with this issue and had to buy a Dell laptop. There were also Windows license issues to consider. I was going to be doing unattended installations and the Windows licensing required the original purchase be a particular SKU or I would need to buy second Windows licenses to install over a network. Which is a whole other set of frustrations. |
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| ▲ | Reason077 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Apple isn’t this bad, of course, but they’re slowly heading in that direction. The number of overlapping iPad models and variants, for example, is getting kind of crazy these days. Now there’s the MacBook Neo and a rumoured new MacBook Ultra in the pipeline. The easy days of “pick standard or pro, select a display size, select RAM & storage” are starting to fade. |
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| ▲ | SllX 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | The iPad line makes a lot more sense when you’re just shopping and realize you’re just on a price ladder. Start from the bottom and climb up picking up features along the way until you reach the point where you’ve got what you want or you’re not willing to spend more money. The Neo is either easy to recommend or rather easy to not recommend. It has a fixed 8GB of RAM. I think that’s too little for a modern Mac operating on the modern web. Others… disagree. Either way, it might entice some schools and school districts assuming they can volume discounts where 8GB is probably enough and it fills the spot in the Walmart part of the sales channel previously occupied by an 8GB RAM M1 MacBook Air Apple hadn’t sold itself in years. | | |
| ▲ | dhosek 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | From all the reviews, those of us who are skeptical of 8GB of RAM are very much wrong (I’m guessing it’s lingering PTSD from being stuck on underperforming systems with too little RAM that makes us buy much more RAM than we actually need). I’m inches away from buying a couple of these for my kids. | | |
| ▲ | nessus42 6 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I have an M2 MacBook Air with 8GB of RAM that I bought a couple of years ago. For browsing the web, listening to music, watching TV and movies, using Gmail, Google Sheets, Google Docs, etc., it's just fine. OTOH, for my development Mac, I have 64GB of RAM. (Though 32GB would probably be fine.) | |
| ▲ | jrockway an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Back in 2000 I got the M1 Air with 8G of RAM (needed the cheapest Mac to test some arm64 stuff) and that laptop served me very well. I never felt RAM-limited. I was always expecting to run out of memory during a big Bazel build or something, but never did. It isn't the most powerful computer in the world but I never ran into any problems... so it's probably an OK compromise for most people, especially in the world where RAM is scarce because of AI datacenter buildouts. | |
| ▲ | seunosewa 30 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Large Java apps like Android Studio are not good at managing 8gb of RAM. Emulators are terrible as well. They don't play well with the swap feature. | | |
| ▲ | thinkindie 19 minutes ago | parent [-] | | I believe the Neo doesn't necessarily target Android Studio users as their primary segment. |
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| ▲ | mschuster91 an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | > I’m guessing it’s lingering PTSD from being stuck on underperforming systems with too little RAM that makes us buy much more RAM than we actually need Mac devices have been able to get away with less RAM (and higher priced upgrades) for well over a decade. During the Intel era, they were the first ones to adopt SSDs as the default option while everyone else still installed spinning rust. That alone provides for way faster swap storage to conceal a relative "lack" of RAM. And when they went for their own fully integrated stacks of soldered RAM and SSD? Then everything went off the rails - close proximity and no sockets means very low latency for both RAM and persistent storage on one side and on the other side it also allows for much higher bandwidth because of much cleaner signals - remember, even at "measly" hundreds of megahertz you're already in the territory requiring precise PCB design. On top of that, macOS's scheduler seems to be much, much more efficient and outright better in constrained RAM (and CPU) settings to provide the feeling of "the system is still responding" than either Windows or Linux. The only setting where macOS goes into molasses is when you not just run out of RAM but of free disk space as well. |
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| ▲ | fl0ki an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think the big difference is that if you just want to optimize for some objective, it's usually very clear how to do that from Apple's options, so there's not much research to be done. It can still be challenging to choose what's the best value when it's your own money, but at least you know what you're getting, and the quality hasn't been a concern for years. | |
| ▲ | enraged_camel 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | >> The number of overlapping iPad models and variants, for example, is getting kind of crazy these days. One of the first things Steve Jobs immediately did after returning to Apple in 1997 was to kill most of Apple's product line-up, which had exploded in his absence. Too bad he's not around to save them from the same over-segmentation anymore. | | |
| ▲ | 0x457 21 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I think It makes sense for iPad line up to be this way. Very clear feature segmentation that make sense. Most is directly result of underlying hardware. For consumer it's also very easy: - decide on size - go from your budget - if still too many SKUs go by features What features? Thunderbolt, Screen, Apple Pencil, Face ID Alternatively if you know what features you want, start with that. If you're struggling to choose which iPad you need then you might want an iPad for the sake of having an iPad (in which case get Air). | |
| ▲ | thewebguyd 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | The goal is different. Jobs wanted to make the product spread simple to understand. Apple's current method is a pricing ladder, make it simple to spend $200+ more than you planned. MacBook Neo, $599. Great but maybe I want Touch ID & more storage, ok $699. Well at this point now it's "only" $300 to get the air which is much better. Well, now that you're already spending $1000, might as well just do the extra $500 and get the pro..." Every product lineup is designed that way. It gets you thinking "eh, what's an extra $200" and slowly moves you up until you land at the highest tier. Now that everything is using the same silicon, it costs Apple very little to maintain all these variants (that are mostly binning), so there's little reason not to. | | |
| ▲ | snuxoll an hour ago | parent [-] | | > Now that everything is using the same silicon, it costs Apple very little to maintain all these variants (that are mostly binning), so there's little reason not to. Don't underestimate how much of a bitch it is to maintain all the separate SKUs. This isn't the old CTO days where you had: 1 chassis, N mainboards for different CPU/GPU combinations, a bunch of SODIMM's of varying capacities, and a couple of different fixed storage drives to toss in. When any given MBP has 2 CPU/GPU options, multiple memory options, and multiple storage options, with everything being soldered to the board? Honestly, the Neo is the one product in their portable lineup that doesn't cause a massive headache for logistics. But...even then, Tim Cook is CEO still, and he is a supply chain guy, so you better believe this is top of his list when it comes to their product lineup. You don't increase operational complexity for no reason, because that is where the cost for every product lies for them, it's not just dealing with silicon binning. | | |
| ▲ | mschuster91 an hour ago | parent [-] | | > But...even then, Tim Cook is CEO still, and he is a supply chain guy, so you better believe this is top of his list when it comes to their product lineup. You don't increase operational complexity for no reason, because that is where the cost for every product lies for them, it's not just dealing with silicon binning. Sure... but when looking at sales numbers, HP and Apple are tied by monthly sales volume on Amazon [1], with everyone else being widely behind them. But HP has almost 300 models, Apple much, much less - and Apple can react much, much faster because they almost directly run the production sites and mostly sell themselves, so they can produce an initial run of products and whenever a store or a region runs out of one specific variant, they just tell Foxconn to, say, instead of making a run with black casings they now make a day worth of gray casings, ship that onto a plane and that's it. HP, Dell et al? Their inventory gets distributed by an intricate web of middlemen who all need buffer. [1] https://laptopmedia.com/highlights/august-2025-best-selling-... |
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| ▲ | calf 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | It is giving me choice paralysis, last week I made a mental graph of the ones I wanted and went over all node pairs choose 2, now it's down to waiting for a fall M5 Mac mini paired with either: a MacBook Neo, or an iPad Air 13"; both options are very attractive for my intended usage though the latter seems higher risk since I've never used a 13 inch tablet before. |
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| ▲ | asimovDev 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| at our company we just pick the most current X1 13in Thinkpad 32/1000 for the windows preferrers. |
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| ▲ | brailsafe an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| That Dell Pro Max Plus (that I legit thought might be a joke) is a big horkin laptop for ~$6k+. 3cm thick, nearly 3kg, and you can do wireframes on it, wow! A full HD screen with 500 nits brightness. What a piece of shit product comparatively speaking. I imagine someone would buy it for a niche specific engineering purpose that can only be practical on Intel Windows, but damn. I really don't think it would fair better than a less costly M4/M5 Pro, and would probably be just an awful experience to use daily. |
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| ▲ | gib444 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > Dell Pro Max Premium > Dell Pro Essential At least they have a sense of humour Pro... Essential?! If the sold hotel rooms they'd offer a Deluxe Economy ?? |
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| ▲ | tantalor an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > Pro Max Premium lol |
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| ▲ | andoando 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| And thats just this year's model. |
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| ▲ | n6242 an hour ago | parent [-] | | It's last year's. I read a few weeks ago that they ditched the "Pro Premium" madness naming scheme and they're back to just XPS <size>. |
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