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| ▲ | ori_b 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Did you vote in the primaries for a candidate that might change it? | | |
| ▲ | don_esteban 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Did democrats offer primaries in the last elections? Did voting for Bernie Sanders in the last two primaries (especially the ones when Trump won for the first time) amount to anything? I wonder how long can the American public keep the self delusion that the elections are anything but a theater for the naive, to keep the pretense the public has any say in things that matter. How much has the current administration asked the public about going to war with Iran? | | |
| ▲ | wasabi991011 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Did voting for Bernie Sanders in the last two primaries (especially the ones when Trump won for the first time) amount to anything? He didn't win the primaries though. It would have amounted to something if he got enough votes. | | |
| ▲ | don_esteban an hour ago | parent [-] | | 1) He did not win primaries, in significant part also because DNC was heavily against him. The level playing field thing. 2) If he won the primaries, there is still no guarantee that that would have amounted to anything. First, he might not have won the elections (mainstream media and the whole ruling elites were heavily against him). And even if he won, he might not have been able to do much against the permanent state. I still think the main cause of Trump's wins is the deep disillusionment of the democratic voters by Obama's failure (inability/unwillingness) to impact a meaningful change. | | |
| ▲ | wilg an hour ago | parent [-] | | Everything you're saying here is the exact delusional cynicism that got us here. Stop. | | |
| ▲ | don_esteban 42 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Yes, my stance is cynical. Sadly, it is also factually correct (i.e. not delusional). Which of my statements are you contesting? From my point of view, your stance (play fairly, according to the rules set by your stronger opponent) is delusional. Note that the opponent is not 'republicans', but the whole ruling elites. And no, I can't help you, I am not USian, just an outside observer. Sadly, due to its weight, whatever USA does, heavily influences everybody else as well. |
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| ▲ | wilg 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Democratic_Party_presiden... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_Democratic_Party_presiden... Skill issue. Run your candidate. Convince people to vote for them. > How much has the current administration asked the public about going to war with Iran? THE ELECTIONS are how the public weighs in. | | |
| ▲ | don_esteban 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Re: Skill issue
Money issue. This is not level playing ground, the field is severely tilted.
The referee is bought. But you are saying: You lost fair and square, wait 4 years to have any say in what is going on. Re: THE ELECTIONS are how the public weighs in. When the choice is between Tweedledee and Tweedledum, the public's choice is meaningless. To say nothing about politicians outright shamelessly lying (e.g. Trump campaigning on 'no more wars'). | | |
| ▲ | wilg 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Money issue is also a skill issue, but I have no doubt in the era of free media someone could figure it out. Sorry I didn't invent the idea that there are federal elections every two years, I'm just telling you that you have to win them. Bonus points: this is also how you can change the election schedule or political system! If you're saying both candidates were bad when one was Trump, and the other was Hillary, Kamala, or Joe, then you don't have very good judgement. I agree Trump lying about not starting a war was bad. Many of us have said for years that he is a terrible liar. Please help us. | | |
| ▲ | don_esteban an hour ago | parent [-] | | I agree that Clinton/Harris/Biden are not equally bad as Trump. Trump is monstrously bad (= force the shit hitting the fan NOW), the democratic alternatives were just 'normally' bad (= continue the same old crap driving the shit closer to the fan, ignoring the looming disaster). |
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| ▲ | jrflowers 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I like that I can’t tell if this is some sort of admonition for not voting centrist enough in a primary that didn’t happen or for not voting left enough in a primary that did not happen. It seems like if you’re going to be so bold as to do a callout you might as well say what for (and why you either picked or specifically skipped a primary that did not happen) |
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| ▲ | vkou an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | No. ... But the government flooding cities with thousands of masked thugs with a license to do whatever they want... has so far been an entirely Republican thing. There are more colours to the world than pure black and pure white. There are also a million shades of grey in between, and most of us have the ability to distinguish between them. |
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