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caseysoftware 3 hours ago

> So it was never about security at all then, was it?

Never was.

I flew every other week prior to covid and haven't once been through the scanners. For the first ~6 years, I opted out and got pat down over and over again.

Then I realized I could even skip that.

Now at the checkpoint, I stand at the metal detector. When they wave me to the scanner, I say "I can't raise my arms over my head." They wave me through the metal detector, swab my hands, and I'm done. I usually make it through before my bags.

Sometimes, a TSA moron asks "why not?" and I simply say "are you asking me to share my personal healthcare information out loud in front of a bunch of strangers? Are you a medical professional?" and they back down.

Other times, they've asked "can you raise them at least this high?" and kind of motion. I ask "are you asking me to potentially injure myself for your curiosity? are you going to pay for any injuries or pain I suffer?"

The TSA was NEVER about security. It was designed as a jobs program and make it look like we were doing something for security.

sargun an hour ago | parent | next [-]

What ethnicity are you? I went through an airport -- and nobody else got screened except me. What was special about me? I was the only non-white person in the airport. Upon complaining, this was the response:

> Random selection by our screening technology prevents terrorists from attempting to defeat the security system by learning how it operates. Leaving out any one group, such as senior citizens, persons with disabilities, or children, would remove the random element from the system and undermine security. We simply cannot assume that all terrorists will fit a particular profile.

chaboud 2 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

I used to have a Sikh manager who wore a turban. Whenever we traveled together, he would get "randomly" stopped. While they were patting him down, he would inevitably chuckle and say something like "So what are the odds of being 'randomly' selected 27 times in a row?"

I don't know the specifics of the process for selection, but I can confidently say that the process is bigoted.

caseysoftware an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I'm brown, very brown. A Native American, in fact.

ada1981 16 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

I was so confused last time I traveled as I watched this brown skinned family getting shaken down for ID by TSA and they literally just waived me past and said didn't need ID. Mind you I've never not been asked to show ID to TSA before this.

spike021 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Today was the second time in a year I went into one and my crotch got flagged because of my pants zipper. nothing in my pockets. no belt. nothing hidden. etc.

I was then subjected to full pat down and a shoe chemical test as a cherry on top.

Might need to try convincing them next time to let me do the metal detector instead.

What's the point of this higher fidelity scanner if it can't tell the difference between a fly and a restricted object?

cozzyd 13 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Derek Smalls?

zoklet-enjoyer an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Are you sure it was the zipper?

spike021 39 minutes ago | parent [-]

it's a guess from looking at the screen where the red square is placed right around that zone.

runako an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> When they wave me to the scanner, I say "I can't raise my arms over my head."

IANAL but I would be very cautious about lying to a federal agent, or anyone acting in a capacity on behalf of a federal agent (this is all of TSA).

caminante an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Yep. It's asking for FAFO with civil $$ or even criminal penalties.

From what I see, it's low risk, though the parent's smartass approach might get you some punishment. Not worth skipping the detector via lie.

caseysoftware an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Who said I'm lying?

jader201 30 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

It seemed implied by:

> Then I realized I could even skip that.

It would make sense that you weren’t injuring yourself prior to realizing this.

Again, implied. But agreed, you didn’t say it.

runako 43 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Fair! I was going to go back and edit, but my comment was more for other people who read your comment thinking it was a good idea for them to do (assuming they can raise their hands over their heads).

caseysoftware 37 minutes ago | parent [-]

Since the TSA cannot force you to prove it - after all, they're not medical personnel to evaluate it and not willing to risk your injury - whether someone lies becomes irrelevant.

fsckboy 22 minutes ago | parent [-]

"i can't raise my arms over my head" doesn't contain the word "medically". could be religious reasons, or simply personal superstition.

desireco42 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This is genius, thank you for sharing. I don't fly often, mostly because it became from glamorous to brutal experience.

actionfromafar 2 hours ago | parent [-]

The Republicans say you should dress up better, then it’s glamorous.

kevin_thibedeau an hour ago | parent [-]

Make sure you bring a change of workout clothes too for the exercise room between flights.

sgvfc 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[flagged]

renewiltord 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Lots of society is like this. For example, red lights. I run them all the time and nothing happens. You just have to pay attention. It's why the police won't ticket you in SF. It doesn't matter. If anyone else complains you just yell "Am I being detained" a few times and then hit the accelerator. Teslas are fast. They can't catch you.

rPlayer6554 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Another pro tip is to not pay at restaurants. If you can leave the restaurant fast enough before they give you the bill, they must have forgotten to charge you and sucks for them! The trick is not to bring bags so you can fake a trip to the toilet!

Yiin an hour ago | parent [-]

if you're not joking, actions like these are why we can't have nice things in society, it's cancerous behavior and just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

cwnyth an hour ago | parent [-]

I think the two comments above yours are poking fun at the guy who is committing a felony by lying to federal agents. They're just making it obvious what he's doing is really shitty, anti-social behavior.

caseysoftware 40 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

You are grossly misinformed and making an assumption.

You're thinking of being interviewed by a Federal agent. At no point are you being interviewed at a TSA checkpoint. Generally, they have two agents present for that so they can act as witnesses for each other. The FBI specifically uses the 302 for such an interview. Can you cite the relavant US Code here? I can.

Further, you're assuming I'm lying.

As someone who was present (in the room) as DHS was being formed and witnessed the negotiations around the TSA, the "really shitty, anti-social behavior" is sharing misinformation.

zoklet-enjoyer an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Lying to TSA and other government representatives is patriotic

hackyhacky an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"Obeying the law, no matter how pointless, wasteful, or destructive, is a virtue."

Does it make you feel good to participate in a meaningless charade of security theater? Or would you rather spend your time doing some of value?

throwup238 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

What if the police department has Teslas?

RajT88 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Quite a modest proposal.

WaxProlix 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Holy shit that's genius, but I do worry about the minor degradation of respect for actual disabled folks if it becomes 'weaponized' in a widespread way

ryanscio 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Serious question: why?

Most people I know who object to full-body millimeter-wave scanners either do so on pseudoscientific health claims, or “philosophical” anti-scanner objections that are structurally the same genre as sovereign-citizen or First-Amendment-auditor thinking.

wpm 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I should not need to show an anonymous TSA agent my genitals, even if they are in black and white on some monitor theyre viewing in some back room, to get on a plane.

hackyhacky an hour ago | parent | next [-]

> I should not need to show an anonymous TSA agent my genitals

Unless you want to!

tkuraku 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

At least currently the images are never seen by a person and are deleted after ATR.

WaxProlix 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Sure thing, and my Facebook account was hard deleted when I asked them to.

its_magic an hour ago | parent [-]

Are you implying that Mark Zuckerberg is a liar, sir?

deaux an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

You'll need to add a /s, else most here won't realize you're being sarcastic.

You are, right?

AngryData 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I could ask the same serious question, why should I have to? There is zero reason to suspect me of being a suicidal maniac. Should we have such scanners to walk into a busy store or bus or subway system? Why don't private pilots and passengers have such screenings?

prashantsengar an hour ago | parent [-]

Tangential: Here in India we have security guards with hand-held metal detectors in malls, railway stations, and urban transit rails (metro) stations.

The first time I visited a different country I was surprised to see my friend accompany me to the check-in counter and even further to drop me off. In India they wouldn't let you enter the airport if your flight doesn't depart soon enough.

AngryData 23 minutes ago | parent [-]

I don't think anyone in the US really cares about metal detectors, humans don't naturally contain metal and it is done completely hands off with no extra visual or biometric information or saved data. Plenty of people in this thread who opted out of other security measures still walked through a metal detector without any special note. Court houses and police stations have often have metal detectors that even a Senator or President would have to walk through. The same cannot be said of direct imaging of your body though or facial recognition or anything. If you wouldn't put your children through the process to go into school each day then it seems completely bonkers to require it for any form of mass transit.

baubino 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There are legit health reasons to opt out of the scanner. I know because I have one of those conditions and have never been through the scanner.

hackyhacky an hour ago | parent | next [-]

That's fine, but you don't need a health condition, legit or otherwise, to opt out. It's enough to say "I would like to opt out."

bitexploder an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Millimeter wave scanners have a health exemption? Like because it would always detect something on your body?

avalys 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

What is an example of such a condition?

jacquesm an hour ago | parent [-]

Pacemaker, pregnancy, probably others.

OneDeuxTriSeiGo 17 minutes ago | parent [-]

Studies have all come out clean on pacemakers and mmWave. No detectable interference in the hardware or on an EKG while in a mmWave scanner.

I could imagine other conditions potentially but pacemakers have been ruled a non issue for mmWave by academic studies (albeit I can understand still exercising caution despite that).

jMyles an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

To me it's just a vote against the profiteers who make those machines.

Also I kinda like the process better; the pat-down is nothin', and you can a full table to yourself to recombobulate.

> First-Amendment-auditor thinking.

Uhhh, I like that kind of thinking. Is there something wrong with first amendment auditors now?!

zoklet-enjoyer an hour ago | parent [-]

First Amendment auditors have usually been attention seeking individuals making click bait YouTube videos. It's been interesting seeing the transformation from that to what we're seeing with people monitoring ICE.

sndean an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

I, too, dislike walking far. Here’s how I faked my way into a handicap parking tag.

hackyhacky an hour ago | parent [-]

> I, too, dislike walking far. Here’s how I faked my way into a handicap parking tag.

Cute analogy, but.

Handicap parking tags provide value to those who need them. Depriving them of parking makes their lives harder.

On the other hand, TSA is pure theater, as TFA makes clear. Avoiding this needless ritual saves time for the passenger, for the TSA officers, even for the other passengers, and does not increase risk at all. It's pure win-win.

sndean an hour ago | parent [-]

That’s fine and it is of course security theater / jobs program. I was put off by the feigning of disability to avoid a scanner and/or some inconvenience. This kind of behavior is okay, even great, but please come up with a more tasteful way. Otherwise I hope it’s a parody.

deaux an hour ago | parent [-]

There may be no more tasteful way, this is likely the only way.