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dankwizard 10 hours ago

Not sure why poeple don't just put the phone down? We really are the most sheltered gentle generation. Oh no, this app is taking up my time, we need to BAN IT.

nunez 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Not drinking or gambling works so well for alcoholics and gamblers. Who needs rehab anyway?

SirMaster 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

And are their laws about how much I can go gamble at the casino right now or how much I can go buy at a liquor store and drink tonight?

Pretty sure too much gambling and too much alcohol is worse than watching too many short videos. So how can we say that spending time on figuring out how to block people from watching too many short videos is a better use of our time and resources than limiting gambling and drinking.

flocciput 8 hours ago | parent [-]

There are laws about the age you can be to gamble or drink, restrictions on the establishments where these things can occur, and you can have your license revoked for driving while under the influence, or be banned from a casino. Don't act like those are totally unrestricted activities.

ajam1507 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

And yet we're talking about a case against social media companies and not a case against casinos or distillers.

nunez 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Distinction without a difference. The social media companies re-use the playbooks these two industries practically invented. Yet social media doesn't have government-mandated surgeon general warnings or 24x7 support hotlines.

eigencoder 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Yeah because casinos and distillers already have laws regulating their use

flumpcakes 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That's not how addiction works. If you could "just stop" then it isn't really an addiction.

dmix 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Huh, that's exactly the solution to addiction? Step 1 is always changing your behaviour patterns to break out of habits and avoid things that draw you into it.

Make your bedroom a phone-free zone, charge it in the living room overnight, use the built in parenting and screentime controls that every modern phone OS has, don't let your kids stare at the screen all day. Etc.

This isn't rocket science. Self control is one of the most important things you need to learn. It sucks and it's hard but it's basic life stuff.

The only difference with social media addiction vs drugs/gambling is that it's not socially ostracized like other addictions so people ignore it.

NoPicklez 7 hours ago | parent [-]

I think we can all agree that the solution is to stop, but that it is difficult to do so.

I'm not addicted to alcohol or gambling, but I know that it takes significantly more willpower for those that are to just stop than it does for me to not have that chocolate bar at night.

There is a proportionality to it

ajam1507 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is the lie that keeps people addicted. Plenty of people quit their very real addictions every day. If you imagine you're helplessly addicted, you will remain addicted.

aucisson_masque 10 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Tell that to a drug user. It works the same way.

And when the app is developed purposely to make people addict, that’s an issue.

You can’t just blame the user when their chance to have a normal app usage have been rigged.

Aeglaecia 9 hours ago | parent [-]

re adults it does fall to individual responsibility , re kids we can partially blame parents for not taking care of their kids properly , overall the enemy of our attention has quadrillions of dollars which is fairly difficult to fight against

davewritescode 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Nice straw man.

Nobody is talking about banning anything, we’re talking specifically about holding social media companies accountable for marketing to children a product that is knowingly addictive and potentially harmful to their health.

Part of the issue with social media is that no reasonable parent lets their 12 year old watch porn or drink but Instagram and ticktock are on a lot more 12 year old’s phone’s than you realize. Social media has network effects and creates tremendous social pressure to not make your kid “different” when half the classroom is sharing TikToks.

I’m not conservative in the slightest but I see no reason to treat social media any differently than alcohol, tobacco or gambling. Available without restriction to adults but limited to children under a certain age.

card_zero 7 hours ago | parent [-]

This stuff is still unclear to me. The addictive drugs, ones that punish a quitter chemically, are not mysterious, but gambling addiction certainly is. "Dopamine" won't work as an explanation - for instance I was once hooked on building a wooden table, which sucked up two months of my free time and lots of money, and damaged my thumbs, and no doubt I was driven by the dopamine rush of learning through the repetitive process of chiseling. But gambling is assumed to be a glitch, not a wholesome obsession. In what way does it differ? The addiction is very old, I'm sure there are accounts from the 1700s, and it doesn't even require a house to reel the gambler in - it could all be about informal games and wagers, still leading to huge debts. It's tempting to blame it on dumb ideas about luck and fate, but the dumb ideas involved could be varied and complex.

That's similar to dumb ideas involving social pressure. When people have a tendency to be dumb about a thing we use the law to restrict the thing, apparently. But this involves, in effect, an authoritative declaration of "that's dumb" by law. I feel personally threatened, then, in activities such as my woodwork, which might have been an equally dumb obsession! I know nobody's at all likely to regulate woodwork, but that's only because it's relatively unpopular. I could imagine a parallel universe where woodwork (portable somehow) becomes a trend that makes a young person feel socially relevant, and then it gets regulated. I think I disapprove of this interference with people's dumb notions.