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Workaccount2 3 hours ago

Range is the misconception, because people view range through the "sit and fill up then drive till empty" paradigm.

That is not how EVs work or how they should be used. They should be charged overnight/when you are doing something else, and on road trips should be charged to align with other stops even if those stops are 10 minutes. It's rare that I have ever done the "sit in the car for 40 minutes waiting for charge", and extremely common to do the "Put car on charger for 13 minutes while going into [insert any of the gazillion places with chargers in the parking lot] to use the bathroom, stretch legs, and get a snack, or see a landmark"

Also you usually structure it so you arrive at your destination with very low charge, because you fill up while there. I've yet to be at a hotel with a gas pump in the lot.

Again, EVs function differently than gas, and that change of paradigm really gets people ruffled up and confused.

ashtonbaker 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I actually leased a Kia EV6 recently without too much research into the charging situation, assuming that in 2025 it was probably pretty well figured out, and I could just do as you propose and just charge in small bursts at the grocery store etc. But:

- It didn't come with a home charger at all. They're not cheap.

- It came with a J1772 adapter, but no CCS adapter. The car itself has NACS. So I'm limited to Tesla superchargers, which are expensive, unless I buy a new adapter (not cheap, or cheap, but suspicious Temu brands).

- The experience of using all of these different branded charging points is _awful_. You need to create 10 different accounts with a bunch of terrible apps. The maps to find charging infrastructure seem universally awful.

- Pretty common to arrive at a charging location to find that some nutjob has hacked off all the charging cables. The only reliably maintained charge points are the larger, more expensive high speed charging locations.

I think a lot of the issues would be solved if I was more committed to the car and the house that I'm living in, and installed a home charger to charge at night. But the charging experience out in the world is absolutely _dismal_ when compared to gas vehicles, even if you change your behavior.

mdavid626 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That’s exactly the problem. I’d be happy to use an EV daily, as I drive short distances. But when I drive longer, then I don’t want to waste hours on charging.

The other day I drove 700km in just about 5.5 hours (German Autobahn). Few stops to pee. With EV that would be few hours more (!). If this doesn’t bother you, then it’s fine. It matters to me though.

Sometimes I also drive early in the morning 600km, and in the afternoon back, so I’m home until 22:00. With EV, that’s just impossible.

plorkyeran 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

As long as there's a fast charging station somewhere along the route you'd need more like 30 minutes to charge midway through, not multiple hours.

You also surely recognize that your driving patterns are very atypical and a car not working for them says very little about how suitable the car is for the market as a whole.

bluGill 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

A fast charging station that is working, that has the correct connector for your car (including adapters you carry), that your car will work with (Tesla hasn't opened their superchargers to call cars with the NACS connector), that you have an account with... There are too many things that just are not there.

One top of that you need to find a charger. They are all over, but many of them are slow speed chargers. There are also a lot of gaps, if you pass a charger with 50% battery remaining you can't be sure you will make the next one. (most cars can pass several gas station with 5% gas in the tank and still make it to one). You need to ensure you will get back to your car when it is charged so they don't charge extra (this is a problem if you are at a concert or something and are trying to charge while doing something else that can't be interupted)

Someday all the above will be fixed. Everyone agrees NACS is the future connector, but it isn't rolled out. Someday every "gas station" will have a charger with the gas pumps (or perhaps something else?) - at least along routes where people often make long trips. Someday you won't need a phone/account, just swipe a card - or so I hope. But someday isn't today.

mdavid626 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Assuming car can charge that fast. This is why I said “price and range”.

Renault 5 EV charges with 11kW.

Workaccount2 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

In your typical 475km EV sedan, you would only need about 20 minutes of charging to do that 700km.

This is why I am like a broken record repeating that EV misconceptions kill EVs. You are applying gas car logic to electric cars, which is what people do, and stops them from getting an EV.

But it's wrong.

mdavid626 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Are you assuming 250kW chargers? …and cars which can charge that fast?

Renault 5 EV charges with 11kW. This is the size of car I need.

Workaccount2 2 hours ago | parent [-]

If you often mowed a town park, you wouldn't buy a hand-push lawnmower and then be upset about lawn mower technology.

The Renault 5 is a town car. Its specs are closer to a golf cart than a motorcar. It fills a niche, but if you are traveling often, a different EV would suite you better.

pixl97 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The big problem here is we need a hybrid stage in between.

I have a hybrid now, it's still a conventional powertrain, and it's not chargeable. That's not exactly what I want, but it's what I could get.

I want a fully electric drive train hybrid with around 100 miles capacity on the battery, then a generator that's big enough to keep it running if the battery is drained.

100 miles gets you through the average day without having to use gas.

An electric drive train turns your engine to a generator that runs at a fixed speed and is more efficient. It also massively reduces the complexity turning into a system more like an EV.

And, if I go on a long trip, the car still gets me to where I'm going without charges (unless I choose to so I can save gas).

JohnMakin 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> They should be charged overnight/when you are doing something else

This is fine if you're a homeowner. For a huge chunk of people living in denser housing, this is not feasible, and at best impractical.