So in general you think that making frontier AI models more offensive in black hat capabilities will be good for cybersecurity?

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Uehreka 21 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I’m not GP, but I’d argue that “making frontier AI models more offensive in black hat capabilities” is a thing that’s going to happen whether we want it or not, since we don’t control who can train a model. So the more productive way to reason is to accept that that’s going to happen and then figure out the best thing to do.

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whimsicalism 18 hours ago | parent [-]

I think this is a popular rhetorical turn nowadays but I actually don’t agree at all - relatively few actors have the ability to train top models.

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freedomben 14 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It only takes "relatively few" to be a huge problem. Most serious threats come from nation states and criminal gangs, and they definitely do have the ability and resources to train top models. Beyond that though, I would bet many of the nation states even have access to a version of OpenAI/Google/etc that allows them to do this stuff.

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flir 16 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Can't we be pretty sure it will only get easier, and more common?

	▲	whimsicalism 16 hours ago \| parent [-]
		why does that mean we should do it now?

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abigail95 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Does it shift the playing field towards bad actors in a way that other tools don't?

	▲	ACCount37 18 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Yes. The advantage is always on the attacker's side, and this can autonomously find and exploit unknown vulns in a way non-AI tools don't. Sure, you can also use the same tools to find attack surfaces preemptively, but let's be honest, most wouldn't.

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bilbo0s 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Frontier models are good at offensive capabilities.

Scary good.

But the good ones are not open. It's not even a matter of money. I know at OpenAI they are invite only for instance. Pretty sure there's vetting and tracking going on behind those invites.

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artursapek 21 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Of course. Bugs only get patched if they’re found.

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tptacek 20 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

People in North American and Western Europe have an extremely blinkered and parochial view of how widely and effectively offensive capabilities are disseminated.