As someone using Linux to build web applications, I wonder what about the Apple ecosystem could make it worth to have such a Damocles’ sword hanging over me my whole life.

Am I missing something? My current perspective is that not only am I free of all the hassle that comes with building for a closed ecosystem, such as managing a developer account and using proprietary tools, it also comes with much harder distribution. I can put up a website with no wait time and everybody on planet earth can use it right away. So much nicer than having to go through all the hoops and limitations of an app store.

Honest question: Am I missing something? What would I get in return if I invested all the work to build for iOS or Mac?

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jemmyw 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

Plenty of things do work better as a native application. Packaging is a pain across the board nowadays. Apple is pretty good, you pay a yearly fee if you want your executable signed and notorized, but they make it very hard to run without that (for the lay person). Windows can run apps without them being signed but it gives you hell and the signing process is awful and expensive. Linux can be a packaging nightmare.

	▲	TekMol 3 days ago \| parent [-]
		What works better as a native application?

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snowe2010 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And that website is hosted somewhere, you’re using several layers of network providers, the registrar has control over your domain, the copper in the ground most likely has an easement controlling access to it so your internet provider literally can just cut off access to you whenever they want, if you publish your apps to a registry the registry controls your apps as well.

There are so many companies that control access to every part of your life. Your argument is meaningless because it applies to _everything_.

A trustless society is not one that anyone should want to be a part of. Regulations exist for a reason.

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ang_cire 3 days ago | parent [-]

Not wanting centralization under one company does not equal advocating for "trustless society".

All the things you mentioned (registrars, ISPs, registries, etc) have multiple alternative providers you can choose from. Get cut off from GCP, move to AWS. Get banned in Germany, VPS in Sweden. Domain registration revoked, get another domain.

Lose your Apple ID, and you're locked out of the entire Apple ecosystem, permanently, period.

Even if a US federal court ordered that you could never again legally access the internet, that would only be valid within the US, and you could legally and freely access it by going to any other country.

So in fact, rather than everything being equivalent to Apple's singular control, almost nothing is equivalent (really, only another company with a similarly closed ecosystem).

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snowe2010 3 days ago | parent [-]

If aws decided to block your access to their ecosystem you would lose so so so much more than Apple blocking your access to theirs. If the US decided what you said, t1 networks would restrict your access across much of the planet.

Your logic makes no sense since you can easily switch to Google or whatever other smartphone providers there are (China has a bunch).

But of course those providers can also cut you off, so what I said still applies.

	▲	ang_cire 2 days ago \| parent [-]
		First off, AWS cutting off your AWS account does not block you from visiting other websites that use AWS, it just means you can't use AWS itself as a customer. Apple's ecosystem OTOH means that OP's issue with iCloud disabled their account globally across all Apple services, not just within iCloud itself (and in fact, to further illustrate the difference, losing access to your AWS console account doesn't cut off your account for Amazon.com shopping). > Your logic makes no sense since you can easily switch to Google or whatever other smartphone providers there are (China has a bunch). The person above was asking about why they as a developer would want to risk their time and effort developing for iOS. Any work developing for iOS in e.g. switft or objective-c, is not portable for other platforms like Android. If they lose their Apple account, any time they spent developing for iOS-specific frameworks is totally wasted, is their point. > If the US decided what you said, t1 networks would restrict your access across much of the planet. No offense, but you have no clue what you're talking about. There are in fact court orders where internet access is restricted as part of criminal sentencing. Here's a quick example guide [1]. No part of that involves network providers cutting you off. [1] https://www.uscourts.gov/about-federal-courts/probation-and-... How on earth do you imagine a "t1 network" provider would determine that a person using their network from the UK is actually a person from the US with a court order against using their network? And to be clear, the court orders don't compel ISPs to restrict access, or attempt to enforce blocks like you are suggesting.

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wiseowise 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If you're full in Apple ecosystem, like my GF, you get:

- Shared clipboard across devices - Shared documents - Shared browser - Shared passwords - Free, quality office suite - Interoperable devices (use iPhone as camera on Mac, for example) - Payments across different devices (use clock to pay, for example, shared with your iPhone)

All of this with just one account without any third-party service.

And billion of things more, probably, I'm not a full Apple head.

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TekMol 3 days ago | parent [-]

Strange, I don't need any of that.

And when I hang out with people who ARE in Apple's ecosystem, to me it seems they struggle more to get things done than me.

Why would I want a shared clipboard across multiple devices?

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ValentineC 3 days ago | parent [-]

> Why would I want a shared clipboard across multiple devices?

I guess you've never had to type something first on your laptop to paste in a phone app, or vice versa.

Or open a link from a phone messaging app in your laptop browser.

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TekMol 2 days ago | parent [-]

In the rare case (maybe once per month or so) where that happens, I start a script on my laptop that starts a webapp both the phone and the laptop can open in their browser and send text to each other.

The overhead of starting it and typing "laptop.tekmol" into the browser on both machines is only a few seconds.

That seems mich saner to me than to constantly have some interaction between the two devices going on.

	▲	akho 2 days ago \| parent [-]
		> That seems mich saner Normal people just message themselves on tg or wherever you send and receive messages. Geeks use KDE Connect. Whatt you do is weird.

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3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

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