| ▲ | Beijinger 3 days ago |
| Since your money is gone, I would file a complaint here: ACCC (Australian Competition and Consumer Commission): The primary enforcer of gift card laws, ensuring businesses comply with the three-year minimum expiry, clear terms, and fair practices. |
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| ▲ | thelittleone 3 days ago | parent | next [-] |
| It's baffling that gift cards are so popular. You're essentially paying to decrease the value of your own money by restricting its use and adding an expiration date (and handing to someone as a gift as if it's a thoughtful alternative to cash). An even more egregious case is the corporate credit card. The company dictates its use exclusively for business expenses, yet pushes all the liability onto the employee. The business gets a massive, interest-free credit line with absolutely no risk. The company gets the float, and the employee gets the bill and the potential credit damage if anything goes wrong. </rant> |
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| ▲ | plutokras 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | I still don't get why my friends and family think gifting a less liquid form of money is better than just giving cash. Gift cards are the best proof against the existence of the homo economicus, that's for sure. | | |
| ▲ | thebytefairy 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Because it shows some thoughtfulness. 'I know you like x so here's money to spend on that'. Cash looks like you didn't bother. | | |
| ▲ | Barrin92 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | tbf 95% of the time when I get a gift card these days it's Amazon or a big retail chain, that ain't exactly a deep cut in the gift department either. We should probably normalize Chinese Red envelopes because honestly I'd take a nice envelope with a hand written note and some crisp bills over the annoying gift cards (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_envelope) | |
| ▲ | jama211 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | Also some people struggle to spend money on themselves without guilt. Gift cards absolve that guilt as they can buy that thing without feeling bad about it |
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| ▲ | immibis 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | Same reason they gift you a book instead of a can of petrol. By giving you a gift card, they're forcing you to buy something sold at a specific store chain, not to buy more petrol. | | |
| ▲ | cosmic_cheese 3 days ago | parent [-] | | It can also be a way to make sure e.g. “fun money” gifts are actually spent as intended, getting around things like sense of responsibility, overbearing spouses, etc making the recipient feel obligated or pressured to spend it some other way. |
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| ▲ | jeroenhd 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Gift cards are great for companies you don't trust with (up-to-date) payment details. Amazon, Google, Apple, whatever evil megacorp you can think of, they all have made the news with stories like these, and they have proven time and again that they will stand by and defend their arbitrary decisions in court if they have to, because involving basic human intellect in the chain is too much of a fraud risk. Even if you like their services, who knows what they'll do when they have access to your credit card information directly. I can completely understand why someone would pay for their services with gift cards bought from a well-known, respectable store instead. | | |
| ▲ | g947o 3 days ago | parent [-] | | This story proves that none of it matters if your money along with your account vanish because the megacorp doesn't like your gift card for whatever reason. In fact, it is far worse than paying with a credit card directly in terms of risk. At least, when something goes wrong (which rarely ever happens), the bank has your back. On the other hand, I have seen too many cases where people find their gift card codes invalid. | | |
| ▲ | Marsymars 3 days ago | parent [-] | | > At least, when something goes wrong (which rarely ever happens), the bank has your back. Not really helpful when your account is the important thing though, you can't do a chargeback without your account getting banned. |
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| ▲ | jotaen 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | It seems OP bought the gift card themselves as a means to top up their account balance (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46252989). They basically used the gift card as an alternative payment option. | | |
| ▲ | Beijinger 3 days ago | parent [-] | | Sometimes you can buy gift cards with a small discount (cash back) |
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| ▲ | shermozle 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Book a date with TASCAT. I haven't used the Tasmanian one but in NSW it cost me a couple tens of dollars from memory and I got a response in days. Once the case lands with the _LAWYERS_ who are expensive, it'll get resolved. |
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| ▲ | inkyoto 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | Civil tribunals in Australia (an equivalent of small claim courts in other countries) do not involve lawyers in vast majority of cases and encourage self-representation instead. In fact, the NSW Civil Administrative Tribunal explicitly requires the Tribunal’s explicit permission for a person to be represented by somebody else, including a lawyer. But tribunal's decision is binding on the commercial entity, should it be found at fault and incurs penalties for avoidance or non-compliance with the decision. | | |
| ▲ | cthalupa 3 days ago | parent [-] | | > do not involve lawyers in vast majority of cases and encourage self-representation instead. Sure, but if it's a corporation, who is going to represent the corporation besides a lawyer? In the US, some states explicitly do not allow a lawyer and require a different officer of the company represent them, but plenty do allow lawyers. If Paris is taking Apple to the tribunal, there's no single human equivalent to Paris on Apple's side. This seems like the exact sort of situation where a lawyer is approved to represent somebody else. | | |
| ▲ | thelittleone 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | You also get things like Stripe with mandatory arbitration. The arbitrator is chosen by Stripe. Naturally arbitrator wants to keep Stripe as a client. Stripe terms allow them to hold the funds until 'investigation' is concluded but while held, they have the right to invest the funds and keep the profit. | |
| ▲ | inkyoto 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | > Sure, but if it's a corporation, who is going to represent the corporation besides a lawyer? Under common law, lawyers (in the US sense) are not required on either side in the case of handling a dispute or a small claim. Specifically in Australia, the company would have a complaint department, and the case would be dealt with by a complaint officer, not a lawyer. If the scope of the case exceeds the tribunal's authority, the case is handled in the state's district court or in a federal court for cross-jurisdictional matters. The official title of the person representing the defendant (e.g. a company) in a courtroom is the barrister, but the case documentation and legal advice are provided by a solicitor. | | |
| ▲ | jackvalentine 3 days ago | parent [-] | | Hi, I’m closely involved in xCAT cases for my Australian organisation. We send an in-house lawyer to represent us at every mediation and hearing. Every complaint that goes to an official body is dealt with by the lawyers at that point. Only if they complain directly to us does our “complaints department” handle it. | | |
| ▲ | inkyoto 2 days ago | parent [-] | | I can't speak for CAT's outside NSW, but in NSW, under section 45 of the «Civil and Administrative Tribunal Act 2013 (NSW)», a party (including a company that is the respondent) is not entitled to be represented by any person unless NCAT grants leave (permission) for representation[0], which is a separate step – the company must seek leave first for each case. Only certain NCAT case types give an automatic right to representation, so a company can have a «lawyer» appear without seeking leave. NCAT’s own guidance[1] lists these as: Administrative review and regulation
Professional discipline
Retail leases
Then there is also a separate provision in the Consumer and Commercial Division for high value claims (e.g. over AU$30k) – NCAT’s guideline indicates it will usually permit legal representation where the other party has a lawyer, where there are complex issues, or where a party would be disadvantaged without representation.Since I do not know the nature and specifics of your Australian organisation, I have nothing else of significance to contribute on that particular topic. To sum it up, the most common dispute scenarios involve the following sequence of events: consumer ↝ complaint department ↝ state/federal level regulator, e.g. Department of Fair Trading (NSW), ACCC (federal) or similar ↝ ombudsman or xCAT or a court. The regulatorory step can sometimes be skipped. [0] https://ncat.nsw.gov.au/how-ncat-works/prepare-for-your-hear... [1] https://ncat.nsw.gov.au/how-ncat-works/prepare-for-your-hear... |
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| ▲ | shermozle 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | https://tascat.tas.gov.au/ |
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| ▲ | parisidau 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Absolutely, but that doesn't solve my immediate issue of my devices and accounts, but of course I will do that. |
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| ▲ | b112 3 days ago | parent | next [-] | | There are escalative methods to employ in such situations. In many legal jurisdictions, a 'demand letter' holds weight. These can be served by courier, with proof of delivery as valid. One aspect of such a letter is a hard, specific time by which you will start legal action, along with associated additional costs. You have two paths after the letter. The first is small claims court, or normal court. In many places, small claims court does not allow lawyers, and the judge will even have to explain any confusing terms. Which means the playing is leveled, including reduced or no disclosure requirements, and legal cost assignments. Where I am, it's $100 to file. The goal is to force a fix, at threat of legal consequences. I am sending an email. | |
| ▲ | Beijinger 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | "Beat the Grass to Startle the Snake" (打草惊蛇) You would be better off in the US. Trust me, nothing creates bigger fuzz than complaining to financial authorities. | | | |
| ▲ | inkyoto 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | It appears that the only way to reach Apple Customer Relations is by way of writing a formal letter to: Apple Pty Ltd, PO Box A2629, Sydney South NSW 1235 |
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| ▲ | dimaulupov 3 days ago | parent | prev [-] |
| It is saturday! Guy had a trouble during non-business times and advice to make a complaint to ACCC?
People who unlock accounts do not work on weekends, it is not front line of support who works all the time.
What happened with giving a chance to people (which is Apple consists of) to actually do something before complaining to 4 letter agency?
Also ACCC will not deal with such complaints. It says right on their home page. |
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| ▲ | faidit 3 days ago | parent [-] | | I didn't see a timeline but there were indications that the author has been trying to resolve this for much longer than one day. Regulatory agencies can forward complaints to other authorities and act based on them even if they can't resolve the particular issue for the complainant. |
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