| ▲ | Mashimo 4 hours ago |
| > What exactly is being de-valuated for a profession that seems to be continuously growing A lot of newly skilled job applicants can't find anything in the job market right now. |
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| ▲ | DebtDeflation an hour ago | parent | next [-] |
| Likewise with experienced devs who find themselves out of work due to the neverending mass layoffs. There's a huge difference between the perspective of someone currently employed versus that of someone in the market for a role, regardless of experience level. The job market of today is nothing like the job market of 3 years ago. More and more people are finding that out every day. |
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| ▲ | embedding-shape 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Based on conversations with peers for the last ~3 years or so, some of retrained to become programmers, this doesn't seem to as absolute as you paint it out to be. But as mentioned earlier, the situation in the US seems much more dire than elsewhere. People I know who entered the programming profession in South America, Europe and Asia for these last years don't seem to have more troubles than I had when I got started. Yes, it requires work, just like it did before. |
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| ▲ | DJBunnies 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | Nah it's pretty bad, but congrats on being an outlier. | | |
| ▲ | embedding-shape 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Literally the worst job you can find as a programmer today (if you lower you standards and particularly, stay away from cryptocurrency jobs) is 10x better than the non-programmer jobs you can find. If you don't trust me, give a non-programming job a try for 1 year and then come back and tell me how much more comfy $JOB was :) | | |
| ▲ | RHSeeger an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | > Literally the worst job you can find as a programmer today (if you lower you standards and particularly, stay away from cryptocurrency jobs) is 10x better than the non-programmer jobs you can find. This is a ridiculous statement. I know plenty of people (that are not developers) that make around the same as I do and enjoy their work as much as I do. Yes, software development is a great field to be in, but there's plenty of others that are just as good. | |
| ▲ | nake89 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > give a non-programming job a try for 1 year I have a mortgage, 3 kids and a wife to support. So no. I don't think I'm going to do that. Also, I like my programming job. EDIT: Sorry I thought you were saying the opposite. Didn't realize you were the OP of this thread. | |
| ▲ | kamaal 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | >>Literally the worst job you can find as a programmer today (if you lower you standards and particularly, stay away from cryptocurrency jobs) is 10x better than the non-programmer jobs you can find. A lot of non-programmer jobs have a kind of union protection, pension plans and other perks even with health care. That makes a crappy salary and work environment bearable. There was this VP of HR, in a Indian outsourcing firm, and she something to the effect that Software jobs appear like would pay to the moon, have an employee generate tremendous value for the company and general appeal that only smart people work these jobs. None of this happens with the majority of the people. So after 10-15 years you actually kind of begin to see why some one might want to work a manufacturing job. Life is long, job guarantee, pensions etc matter far more than 'move fast and break thing' glory as you age. | |
| ▲ | queenkjuul 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I was a lot happier in previous non-programming jobs, they just were much worse at paying the bills. If i could make my programming salary doing either of my previous jobs, i would go back in a heartbeat. Hell if i could make even 60% of my programming salary doing those jobs I'd go back. I enjoy the practice of programming well enough but i do not at all love it as a career. I don't hate it by any means either but it's far from my first choice in terms of career. |
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| ▲ | raincole 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Because tech corps overhired[0] when the interest rate was low. Even after the layoffs, most big tech corps still have more employees today than they did in 2020. The situation is bad, but the lesson to learn here is that a country should handle a pandemic better than "lowering interest rate to near-zero and increasing government spending." It's just kicking and snowballing the problem to the next four years. [0]: https://www.dw.com/en/could-layoffs-in-tech-jobs-spread-to-r... |
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| ▲ | IAmBroom 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I think it was more sandbagging than snowballing. The pain was spread out, and mostly delayed, which kept the economy moving despite everything. Remember that most of the economy is actually hidden from the stock market, its most visible metric. Over half the business is privately-owned small businesses, and at the local level forcibly shutting down all but essential-service shops was devastating. Without government spending, it's hard to imagine how most of those business owners and their employees would have survived, let alone their shops. Yet we had no bread lines, no (increase in) migratory families chasing cash labor markets, and demands on charity organizations were heavy, but not overwhelming. But you claim "a country should handle a pandemic better..." - what should we have done instead? Criticism is easy. | | | |
| ▲ | Hendrikto 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | It seems like most companies are just using AI as a convenient cover for layoffs. If you say: “We enormously over-hired and have to do layoffs.”, your stock tanks. If you instead say that you are laying off the same 20k employees ‘because AI’, your stock pumps for no reason. It’s just framing. |
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| ▲ | phkahler an hour ago | parent | prev [-] |
| >> A lot of newly skilled job applicants can't find anything in the job market right now. That is not unique to programming or tech generally. The overall US job market is kind of shit right now. |
