A slight left-field suggestion, but have you tried asking this 'competent jerk' if he wants to go for a coffee (or pint, depending on your culture)?

He might just not be aware he's being a jerk, have you tried having a casual, non-confrontational chat with him and raising your concerns?

ie "I respect you as an engineer but you can be difficult to work with sometimes"

Maybe he just isn't aware?

Sometimes you just need to communicate more and build alliances

▲

golly_ned 8 days ago | parent | next [-]

We are remote. He’s been told at least a few times.

I can do this over 1:1 over remote, but it definitely doesn’t feel the same.

We have a team onsite in a few weeks. I could do it then. I still think it’s more likely than not that things will go sour, especially since the rest of the team will actually be there, and I’ll be letting him know a lot of the team has had issues with him.

The rest of the team is extremely passive and conflict-averse. It’ll be awkward then.

I can try a remote 1:1 since I think there are more ways to keep a cap on this.

The very fact that I have to tiptoe around this makes me realize this guy is super volatile and angry. Even reducing our 1:1 cadence, which I did for all team members simply due to too much meeting load on me, led him to cancel them altogether.

▲

29athrowaway 9 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The guy clearly is an underperformer that knows he cannot win through merit and instead wants to win by playing dirty.

Do not reward aggression towards you with attention and empathy.

You have to stay away from such people. The guy is likely someone with behavioral issues, bad personality traits and the undermining/sabotage could be a sign of a low skill workplace psychopath trying to manipulate and create a psychopathic fiction. You are not a therapist and it is not your job to fix that person.

When fire has nothing else to burn it consumes itself. Just don't add more fuel to the fire. Don't let that person be in your head, drain your energy. Do not ruminate about interactions with this person. Practice mental hygiene and focus on what's important: collaboration, your actual job, your goals, your friends and family, or something you can contribute in any way...

▲

jmkni 9 days ago | parent | next [-]

There isn't nearly enough information in OP's post to draw that conclusion.

▲

collingreen 9 days ago | parent [-]

I disagree - years of behavior pattern plus other people leaving for exactly the same reason is plenty of information.

In your eyes what WOULD be nearly enough information to draw that conclusion?

	▲	9 days ago \| parent [-]
		[deleted]

▲

cwmoore 9 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

“Do not reward aggression towards you with attention and empathy.”

Source?

I really dislike this style of framing.

▲

29athrowaway 9 days ago | parent | next [-]

Why would you let yourself be drained of your energy by someone who is determined to undermine your role and create a precedent that you can be disrespected without consequences? Not only having to tolerate the person but giving them your time and attention? Using your energy that would otherwise be meant to do your job efficiently, advance your career and meet expectations outside of work with your family and friends, etc.

If someone wants to play a different game, let them play alone. It must be clear that the game is collaborating towards a common goal, and if you want to play a different one then you will be playing alone.

We are a band, we are all playing an instrument for the same song requested by a customer, and if you want to play another song I won't start playing the notes of your song that nobody requested.

You can be kind to others, but you also have to be kind to yourself, your employer, and have respect for your profession and the sacrifice others have made to help you attain the position you have.

▲

theultdev 9 days ago | parent | next [-]

"kill them with kindness"

it's very effective in a lot of cases, with no downside.

best case scenario, they were unaware and re-adjust how they talk to you.

worst case scenario, you know they are just being an asshole and you can go back to hating them.

If it all fails, my go to is patronizing kindness to taunt. Much better than complaining or arguing.

▲

29athrowaway 9 days ago | parent [-]

Some toxic people can be good at provocation, victimization and distorting situations. An attempt to improve things over a cup of coffee can be distorted as rumors, slander, harassment, intimidation, threats, etc.

A person that reached adulthood while being toxic throughout their life is probably competent at it at this point. While you were focused in acquiring your skills, they were probably getting better at being toxic. So you are probably not prepared for a direct confrontation with a veteran sabotaging jerk. Do not play a game you have never practiced as the away team because you are probably not going to win.

The more you have advanced your career, the more you have to lose while engaging someone. And in this case you have not much to win, against a person that has less than you to lose. Just using up your time and distracting you from your job is a win for a saboteur.

Anything you say can be held against you, so unless you've talked to a workplace attorney better stay out of it. If the situation is affecting you psychologically then engaging the person can affect you even more. Seek therapy if that helps, or channel your frustration through physical activity.

The best you can do is to limit your interactions to the professional level, and limit the topics to what he is working on. Everything else is your business and not his and you can seek additional collaboration at your discretion.

▲

jmkni 9 days ago | parent [-]

Honestly, you come across as quite negative yourself.

There's a saying, "If everywhere you go smells like shit, maybe it’s time to check your shoes"

▲

29athrowaway 9 days ago | parent [-]

I try as much as possible to stay out of politics and believe in merit. If someone advances their career through merit, I will be the first to celebrate with them.

But at the same time, I do not believe in the power of "let's have a coffee" in a situation like this. There are core beliefs that a cup of coffee will not change.

If someone believes in playing dirty, believes in that basic respect is earned not given, and other rotten beliefs... that person was a bad hire, and needs to have an expedited firing.

▲

theultdev 9 days ago | parent [-]

Lots of assumptions you're making there.

Better to just have the cup of coffee and see.

You'd be surprised how easy it is to disarm people with kindness, you should try it.

▲

29athrowaway 9 days ago | parent | next [-]

It's not your responsibility to fix it.

Just like if someone showed up drunk at work, showing up with an unacceptable behavior should be seen in a similar lens.

▲

theultdev 9 days ago | parent [-]

Not about responsibility. Just makes your life easier.

Noone is saying it's acceptable, just offering advice on how to mitigate the situation.

Should is the keyword of your last sentence. In a perfect world sure, but the world is not that.

You never know, you may even become friends. Doesn't hurt to attempt once at least.

	▲	29athrowaway 9 days ago \| parent [-]
		Seeking everyone's approval is not a good mindset. You are not there to win a popularity contest but to articulate what is needed clearly, keep people focused, unblocked and to get things done. If you worry too much about being liked by everyone your mental health will suffer. You just have to accept some people won't like you. Also comes across as insecure and less fit for leadership roles.

▲

9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

[deleted]

▲

cwmoore 9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

What is the name of this philosophy you espouse? I am assuming it exists because you seem deeply committed.

Seems to apply simple, clear, and rigid moral determinations to a soft and very complex subject.

▲

29athrowaway 8 days ago | parent [-]

- You cannot control others, only how you respond and what you allow into your life (Stoicism)

- You can be kind, but you also have to be kind to yourself (psychology)

- Collaboration works only when participants share goals (game theory)

- Everyone contributes to one shared output (systems thinking)

- Respecting your profession and honoring the effort that got you to your position (Aristotelian and Confucian role ethics)

- Success comes from discipline, self-restraint and honoring your responsibilities (meritocratic work ethic)

- Identity (and therefore respect) is not reducible to your role, position, recognition, skill level, or socioeconomic status (Eastern philosophy)

▲

cwmoore 8 days ago | parent [-]

I see, so would “self-assured syncretism” be unfair?

As such, is the definite certainty justifiable or more of a personality choice?

Not picking on you, exactly, trying to find why I’ve been hearing this kind of language used so confidently among more or less equal peers, and what it’s actually doing for people.

▲

29athrowaway 8 days ago | parent [-]

Cunningham's Law: "The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."

If I am wrong, someone will point it out and I will have learned something new in the process.

	▲	cwmoore 8 days ago \| parent [-]
		That was rewarding, thanks for the chat.

▲

smus 9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

What source can you possibly be looking for lmao

	▲	cwmoore 9 days ago \| parent [-]
		Yes: haha. Seems like an arbitrary rule stated unambiguously enough that it ought to have a factual basis. But I don’t think it does. I think it’s an emptily authoritative and somehow acceptable heuristic that works for some and not others.

▲

9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

[deleted]

▲

throwaway290 9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

This 100x. But it's not for everyone. If like me you are not good at social stuff it is hard to just get on this casual level and say "so what's been going on? those deadlines amirite?" to who you think is your enemy but it can lead to very nice results and +100 social XP

Maybe it turns out he is nice and all you need is to treat him so like he feels he's respected by you. Give him important jobs etc. It's easier after you go for drink/coffee and become a bit more chill with each other. And if he fails on something sensitive that you gave him then you don't have to struggle for proof to management that he sucks

But maybe BE prepared to confront if he starts it? Maybe it's just me but it's dreadful if you bring it up and this guy shoots you down with some snark and you freeze out of surprise and lose the meeting. I would if you are value to company and he is really being an outright asshole on this meeting be prepared to say "look if you're not gonna genuinely cooperate as your lead I'll officially file a complaint/recommend to boot you from this team/whatever" and leave. Be prepared to talk over your manager to his manager. Get your drink in takeaway cup

Document this guy's sabotages with a summary of what harm it did?

I hate politics

▲

karlitooo 9 days ago | parent | next [-]

I've had mixed success with this. It works when you have a nice person going through a tough time in their life who doesn't realise they are reacting badly to everything. I don't think that applies here because this person seems to believe their rudeness is justifiable.

A habit of being an asshole is not cost effective to fix. And giving validation to their belief that they should have "important jobs" just gives them real power to bully you more.

Instead of rewarding bad behaviour, they need an unambiguous dressing down from someone they respect, and a PIP. But IME it's a waste of time, rip the bandaid off and get someone with better default settings.

	▲	throwaway290 9 days ago \| parent [-]
		> And giving validation to their belief that they should have "important jobs" just gives them real power to bully you more. I think this guy's manager said he won't fire or move him. So then if to avoid sabotage you must respect him and give him important tasks then that's what you do. Even if you think it harms the company. Then you show how it harm the company and you win.

▲

jmkni 9 days ago | parent | prev [-]

If it goes that way, the other advice in this thread is valid.

But at least try the non-confrontational 'lets have a coffee' approach first, especially if OP is their superior (which by the other comments, OP is).

	▲	throwaway290 9 days ago \| parent [-]
		Totally I edited it to say that first. Also, it feels like that guy is defensive and feeling butthurt. So op can try pretend he's awesome and give him all the difficult tasks to prove. If he fails you know what to do. If he is good then less work for you. As the lead you don't need to be always the rockstar, the coolest managers are the ones create chance for teammates to be rockstars. (I had bad leads where it just felt like what is the point for me existing here as a code monkey if this guy sorted it all. Tho I would never sabotage it. I just quit;))