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▲ lwansbrough 3 days ago

No, the US has completely and utterly destroyed all credibility it had. It is a farce.

There is no hope for it to return. US allies have credible evidence that the American populace are untrustworthy, uncaring, and frankly, stupid.

The only way for the US to restore credibility is to prosecute. And then survive another 100 years without doing it again.

The remaining influence it has economically and militarily should be considered to be "running on fumes."

US allies are looking for an exit strategy and aren't going to reconsider. Russia won.

I fully anticipate this to be downvoted, I don't care. You are coping if you think America can pull itself out of this.

▲jayd16 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

This is a very silly take. It's going to take America 100 years to restore credibility? It didn't even take post war Germany that long.

▲withinboredom 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

As an US American living outside the US and just spending last week at a tech conference with nearly no US Americans there; this subject was pretty popular to overhear. Essentially, people are asking whether anyone should take the US seriously anymore, as a tourist destination, a place to continue career/education, a political ally, etc.

The gist was that the US is cooked from a reputation point of view. Whether that has any meaningful impact is yet to be seen.

▲jacquesm 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

Don't forget: as a tech partner. It's all momentum right now, and true, there is a lot of that. But lots of little conservative decisions are beginning to add up.

▲Ray20 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Who cares what people asking? America's reputation has long been built on the fact that America has the largest economy, the largest army, and does whatever the f.сk it wants.

▲ryoshoe 2 days ago | parent [-]

The thing is that "does whatever the f*ck it wants" might have negative consequence in regards to "America has the largest economy". If the current GDP growth trends continue, it looks that China will surpass the America on this front unless there are significant changes in either country.

▲CalRobert 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

I’m hoping we finally see more investment and talent shift to Europe.

▲Ray20 2 days ago | parent [-]

Why would they go there? Well, except in situations where they're not needed in America due to a lack of talent?

People don't go to America because the American president is a charming and polite gentleman. They go there because a talented factory worker can easily make 150k a year, and a talented software engineer 500k a year.

And what does Europe offer to those people? One and a half times a cashier's salary and commuting to work by eco-friendly bike? Seriously?

▲withinboredom 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

I make about half of what I did in the US, but take home more money. Insurance is cheap, no expensive healthcare, no car insurance, no car payment, childcare is subsidized and basically free, all other insurance is <4% of what I paid in the US, etc. Home is expensive, compared to what you get in the US, but payment is about the same.

All that in the US was over 7-8k a month of my paycheck, gone. I get all of that for less than 2k a month.

Let’s not even discuss how advanced the EU banking system is compared to the US… although it has been a few years since I’ve been back, so maybe it has gotten better?

In any case, the EU offers good jobs and a work/life balance you usually can’t find in the US, with smart people that you also usually can’t find in the US. It does have its warts, but it also isn’t candy mountain.

▲CalRobert 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Well, in my case about 4 times a cashier’s salary (but really a cashier should be able to afford a good life too), and my kids can bike around so I don’t have to be their taxi and they aren’t stuck at home. Also a functioning democracy.

▲lwansbrough 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You may recall the Germans were forced by the allies to restore their credibility. Many hanged as a result. So if you ask me if the Americans are capable of fixing this problem themselves, my answer is no.

▲raincole 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Germany never becomes the scientific and mathematical hub of the world as it once was. And it won't for the foreseeable future. So yeah, 100 years is on the optimistic side.

▲burnerthrow008 2 days ago | parent [-]

This is an under-rated point. Prior to WWII, most people pursuing doctorates in scientific fields learned (at least a little) German. Because German was the language of science.

Not anymore.

I fear that we're all going to need to learn Chinese.

▲clan 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Do you understand how flat and wartorn they were? Do you wish the same for the US?

If you are willing to take such extreme shortcuts then you can emulate the new Germany.

If not then understand that trust is a fickle thing. Quick to erode and hard to rebuild. What one administration detroys cannot simply be reinstated by the next.

Maybe 100 is a bit hyperbole. But at least 50. Being a neighbor to Germany I can assure you the reconciliation was not "quick" for us to be fully restored. And we still shiver when we follow Musks friends in Germany.

I love and is impressed with Germany and Germans. But it has not been an easy path for them.

Nothing good has ever come from Europe when we lean too far to the right. Be careful in what lessons you choose to take from us.

▲jacquesm 3 days ago | parent [-]

Exactly this. The EU has shown what happens when you let a minority run amok with the keys to the weapons locker. The scars are still plentiful and even if the last of the eyewitnesses are dying we are still steeped in the lore of the lead-up, the middle of and the aftermath of World War II. That Germany is seeing a resurgence of this is at least as scary as seeing how many other countries are easily programmed to start their march to the drumbeat of Nazi or ersatz ideology, only with slightly different scape-goats. For now it is not quite enough to tip the balance but that could happen at any moment. I hope we'll see the last of the bullet holes in the buildings patched before we start making new ones. That's the one use I have for russia right now: they seem to help us remember and it seems to serve as a uniting force.

▲CalRobert 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Post war Germany wasn’t Germany. It was rebuilt in the US’ image.

▲hvb2 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

The Germans didn't reelect someone with authoritarian traits.

So yeah, that looks really bad from the outside looking in. There's just no more benefit of the doubt, this is what was voted for.

To put it in English terms:

Fool me once, shame on you

Fool me twice, shame on me

▲cindyllm 3 days ago | parent [-]

[dead]

▲herbst 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Most confusing is how the majority of US people doesn't seem to see any of that while the rest of the world is fully aware that this is exactly what just happened.

▲MangoToupe 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Russia won.

Russia is neither the primary instigator nor benefactor of our dysfunction, and wishes it had 1/100th the influence over our elections that Israel does. This narrative never made any sense to me.

▲cookiengineer 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

You should research what the DOGE script kiddies did before they joined the government. Because that wasn't a coincidence.

▲Telaneo 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_20...

▲MangoToupe 3 days ago | parent [-]

https://www.opensecrets.org/industries/summary?cycle=All&ind...

▲this2shallPass 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

These countries are the top 10 countries by lobbying dollars from 2016 - 2024:

Country Total Spending

1. China $460,738,925

2. Japan $436,459,337

3. Liberia $353,239,848

4. South Korea $325,835,687

5. Saudi Arabia $311,450,797

6. Marshall Islands $285,094,040

7. Qatar $257,773,194

8. United Arab Emirates $242,674,892

9. Bahamas $242,481,453

https://www.opensecrets.org/fara

Some have spent 2x more money than Israel. Israel is 10th. I haven't heard anybody around me mention Liberia or the Marshall Islands, maybe a handful of times in my life.

These are the top 10 Foreign Principals from 2016 - 2024.

Foreign Principal Total Spending

1. Government of Liberia $350,486,671

2. Government of the Marshall Islands $283,901,646

3. Government of China $277,692,350

4. Japan External Trade Organization $277,638,402

5. Government of Saudi Arabia $238,415,218

6. Government of Bermuda $192,046,623

7. Barzan Holdings $155,775,778

8. ANO TV-Novosti $147,069,172

9. Government of the Bahamas $136,148,426

10 Government of Ireland $132,165,695

No Israeli principal in the top 10. It's obfuscated but Russia is in there (ANO TV-Novosti) and Qatar (Barzan Holdings).

Also, in the link you shared of "Industries", Israel is 7th in single issue. Some of the issues 1-6 have 10x levels of money spent. I wish it were broken down even more. I'm most interested in what makes up "miscellaneous issues".

https://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus?ind=Q

▲MangoToupe 2 days ago | parent [-]

Sure, maybe you're right, and the foreign countries purchasing our politicians is a much larger problem than just the one that Israel presents (though, I'm rather skeptical in terms of actual impact on foreign policy and on who gets elected in our country). I still don't think Russia deserves much mention in terms of election interference; they gotta step up their game if they want to compete.

▲shlant 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

do you think these are comparable? are you equating lobbying to the infiltration of government systems or coordinated efforts by Russian assets inside a campaign team to influence elections?

▲MangoToupe 3 days ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

▲notmyjob 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Consider how many of our politicians and administration officials have Russian heritage, on both sides of the isle, and it starts to make more sense. For that reason one should be careful spreading anti-Russianism on the net given the more aggressive policing our Russian overlords anre adopting over hate speech.

▲DaSHacka 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

> You are coping if you think America can pull itself out of this.

I find such a comment from someone who themselves is coping thinking any of this matters outside of extreme online bubbles hilarious.

▲lwansbrough 3 days ago | parent [-]

I guess I misread the article. I thought it was about the US bullying its allies into poverty but I guess it's about nothing at all, actually.