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▲ Ask HN: What Cryptography book do you recommend for reading with 10 year olds?
23 points by mike_richards 2 days ago | 32 comments

We are looking for a Cryptography book recommendation to read with our 10 year old who loves making up his own ciphers. He loves reading adult math and science books with us at breakfast like Ignition!, Humble Pi, and The Hunt for Vulcan. All of the kids books that we've found are just puzzles, but I don't want to get something way over his head math-wise. A good history with basic theory behind the different types would be perfect. Thanks!

▲jedberg an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Don't forget about the NSAs CryptoKids!

https://web.archive.org/web/20100128072801/http://www.nsa.go...

(They went offline a few administrations ago, hence the archive link)

You can also jump around the timeline in the archive to see different versions.

▲mike_richards 25 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks, that's great. So glad for archive.org

▲mlyle 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There's an edition of The Code Book for youth: https://www.amazon.com/clp/0385900325?lv=shuf&channelId=500

▲mike_richards 13 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Thanks. I'm torn he loves reading himself, but also when we work through adult books with him. :)

▲robterrell 19 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Seconding this one!

▲advael an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Introduction to Modern Cryptography by Katz and Lindell is from a pedagogical perspective one of the best-structured textbooks I've ever read on computer science topics (and in general, but my exposure to textbooks is a biased sample). It goes into the foundations of cryptographic theory and gives a good basis for understanding and contextualizing even advances that have been made since its publication. I think most children can grasp difficult material if an adult that's good at the meta-skill of teaching is helping them with it via individual attention

▲mike_richards 27 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks for the recommendation.

"I think most children can grasp difficult material if an adult that's good at the meta-skill of teaching is helping them with it via individual attention" That's how we feel too and they appreciate being given that chance if we don't push.

▲cryptoalex 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I would suggest Real-World Cryptography by DAVID WONG. It has good introduction covering basic primitives like various hash functions, MAC, KDF, then sym/asym, and so on, all the way to PQC and protocols design. A nice intro book, maybe your 10 y.o. will find it interesting.

P.S. In fact, I was going to send that book to my friend's son who is about same age, and who got some sudden interest in cryptography recently. So it is safe to say that I am now aware of at least two 10 year olds who have interest in Cryptography. I feel a bit surprised, but in a good way :)

▲mike_richards 2 days ago | parent [-]

Thanks we'll check it out.

He started with inventing his own alphabet and language as he was learning to read and write, which eventually evolved into reinventing the Secret Decoder Ring with increasing complexity, so we want to encourage him in his adventure.

▲vessenes an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Not a book but you could construct a little walk through some historical crypto as fun games to play. Caesar cipher, Vigenere cipher, one time pad, then learn about primes and make some repeating keys..you could do a super simple matrix example to make tiny DES s-boxes. I bet claude could come up with some games / fun little exploration things to do together, and you and your son could do a lot of fun motivating math together. You could anchor it with rewards like pictures of you and your partner or some family history or stuff that feels like a treasure hunt.

Mine are out of the house, but I had a few who might have really liked doing something like this.. could make a nice Christmas present, the first mysterious letter..

▲mike_richards 16 minutes ago | parent [-]

That is a fun idea, and a great Christmas present... which is one of our goals. :)

▲mike_richards 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Besides practical books does anyone have opinions about these?

The Code Book by Simon Singh

The Codebreakers by David Kahn

The Mathematics of Secrets by Joshua Holden

▲rubendev 2 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

The Code Book is what got me interested in cryptography and by extension computer science. I thought it was a fun and varied read.

▲dgacmu 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The Codebreakers is a fantastic book and I highly recommend it. I don't know what I think of it for a ten-year-old, it's been a while since I've read it, but my memory is that it is certainly mathematically accessible, but its length and depth may make it daunting, as it probably exceeds the attention horizon of a typical ten-year-old by an order of magnitude or two. But in chunks it could work, and for an adult it's fantastic.

It does assume a fair bit of historical context knowledge, though, much of which probably exceeds 5th grade. Probably 9th graders would have it easier as far as, e.g., familiarity with WWII, etc.

▲mike_richards 11 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks. Yeah, I'll have to flip through it. I might try Cracking Codes with Python by Al Sweigart first.

▲helph67 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There was a television series (British?) featuring some of the tales mentioned in David Kahn's book. The TV series could be a good introduction for children. Another book of interest may be Crypto by Stephen Levy - Viking Penguin 2001. Which relates how "rebels beat the (U.S.) government - saving privacy in the Digital Age".

▲mike_richards 10 minutes ago | parent [-]

Nice, I'll look that up he love Nova like science programs.

▲nephihaha 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Simon Singh is a very entertaining writer, I'll give him that. (Also a pleasant person, I've met him once or twice.)

▲throwaway81523 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Alvin's Secret Code by Clifford B. Hicks. That's the one that got me started. I think I read it in 3rd grade (age 8).

▲mike_richards 23 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Thanks for the recommendation, always great to hear of books begin the journey.

▲myself248 41 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Came here to mention this. It's not too applicable to modern/useful cryptography, but introduces a bunch of related hidden-information concepts like product date codes, which I think I actually use far more often.

▲dustfinger an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Title: Can You Crack the Code?: A Fascinating History of Ciphers and Cryptography

ISBN-10 ‏ : ‎ 1681195143 ISBN-13 ‏ : ‎ 978-1681195148

Title: Top Secret: A Handbook of Codes, Ciphers and Secret Writing

ISBN-10 ‏ : ‎ 0763629723 ISBN-13 ‏ : ‎ 978-0763629724

▲mike_richards 20 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks for the recommendations, Top Secret was just recommended elsewhere so we'll check them out.

▲jszymborski 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Maybe The Gold-Bug by Edgar Allen Poe? Although the language might be a bit baroque.

▲mike_richards 19 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Thanks. We just finished Gulliver's Travels with him, so I bet he can handle it.

▲buredoranna an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I very much remember this, from when I was ten or so.

In the same vein, is the "The Adventure of the Dancing Men" [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventure_of_the_Dancing_M...

▲lazystar an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

this, but for a 10 year old consider getting the Great Illustrated Classics abridged version. i read it when i was 10, and it kinda blew my mind.

▲whalesalad an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Not a cryptography book but highly recommended for the young curious mind: The Cuckoo's Egg

▲mike_richards 17 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks, I've read it awhile ago, you're right he would probably enjoy the "story".

▲nukular 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Work with your llms and figure out a “zero knowledge proof” game that can be played on paper.

Something like that would be practical.

▲mike_richards 2 days ago | parent [-]

OK, Thanks for the suggestion for a practical exercise.

▲nukular 2 days ago | parent [-]

Oops and that’s “zero knowledge proof”!