> The problem is that these refrigerator cases are not as simple as your refrigerator at home. As a simple example, many systems allow you have control over the deadband: the exact low temperature at which the compressor turns off and the high temperature at which the compressor turns back on. You also have control over defrost cycles, compressor pressure and many other things (I worked with this a long while ago, and I don't remember all the details). … This is not something that a non-expert supermarket employee would be able to handle well.

I still don't see why the expert has to be remote, or why an integrated computer can't do the optimization. Or why it needs to be fiddled with at any significant frequency.

▲ dotancohen 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

  > I still don't see why the expert has to be remote

Because there are 1000 store locations. You're either then paying for 1000 mostly idle engineers, or somebody not really qualified has to don that hat, or you're flying your engineers around constantly. Or just connect the devices to the Wild Wild Web and be done with it.

▲

toss1 2 hours ago | parent [-]

>>just connect the devices to the Wild Wild Web and be done with it.

Yup, they're done with it, all right. "It" being all the food being cooled for sale this week. Done.

They do not need engineers at every location to turn every knob. They need to define procedures and limits, and the ability to call the engineers when things go out of those limits. Even putting only remote MONITORING online, but requiring the local person to check and turn the knobs/press the buttons. That also adds an extra set of real eyes on the situation — when the engineer calls the local dept manager to start the defrost because the hacked line says it is now time to defrost, the local manager —with eyes on the freezer— can tell him "NO!" because this was not on their schedule and the freezers are all stocked, not emptied for the defrost.

Instead, the defrost cycle just turned on in the middle of the night, and neither the now-remote engineers nor the local managers knew until it was too late. ——Again.

Security is always a trade-off against convenience. And the idiot human managers almost always all pick convenience because their managers incentivize profit, and security costs and convenience appears to save up front. They nevermind the later costs because they'll already be promoted up or job-hopped out.

	▲	dotancohen 44 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		It's an obvious decision in hindsight. Not so beforehand.
	▲	kulahan 36 minutes ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		Security and convenience are diametrically opposed and stores are specifically built around convenience. I’m not sure it’s obvious at all what the right cutoff level is.

▲ michaelt 28 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> I still don't see why the expert has to be remote, or why an integrated computer can't do the optimization. Or why it needs to be fiddled with at any significant frequency.

Well, it doesn't. The retailer has a team of techs (or an outsourced vendor) rotating between stores, who are cleaning and replacing air filers, checking lubricants, and so on. They could certainly apply occasional changes to settings.

But to the product manufacturer - the remote management feature literally requires less than $2 of hardware. Hell, it might even save money, by removing screens and buttons.

And the person buying the refrigerator wants something that logs and monitors temperatures, for food safety. And they don't know anything about cybersecurity.

So when the manufacturer says that for just a little more they have a remote monitoring option, which not only provides the monitoring needed for food safety but also reduces maintenance costs - it sounds good to them. They don't realise they're signing up for a multi-million-dollar loss when they get hacked and have to throw out a load of products.

▲ InexSquirrel 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That's my thought too.

These fridges may need more complex control for a variety of reasons, but that doesn't mean they have to be connected to _the internet_. To a local network for control, sure.

Put your security measures into the network itself, but I really do feel fridges are another thing which do not need to be IoT devices.

▲ chromaton an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> why it needs to be fiddled with at any significant frequency

Weather changes, equipment performs differently as it wears, changes in customer behavior, different items being stocked, electricity cost updates...

▲ chrisjj 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> I still don't see why the expert has to be remote

Because then he can get paid more.