I'm very pro-union but I feel like at this point attempting to organize will just speed up the process of replacing as many people as possible with machines, not slow it down. It's too little, too late.

I don't understand what kind of society we're building right now. Anthropic and other AI labs at $20T valuations, the 1% monopolizing all the wealth and the rest of us out of a job and fighting for the scraps?

There seems to be some sort of magical thinking within the AI crowd at the moment, that it'll all work itself out in the end.

- Build the God Machine

- ??????

- POST-SCARCITY UTOPIA!

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iugtmkbdfil834 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Maybe, but from simple game theory perspective assuming one assumes this is the end product, union gives at least a chance at favorable outcome.

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Ar-Curunir an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The middle part is most likely that many will die. (This is not an endorsement!)

	▲	NoidFonsense 2 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		billions must die?

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10111001 23 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> I'm very pro-union but I feel like at this point attempting to organize will just speed up the process of replacing as many people as possible with machines, not slow it down. It's too little, too late.

Honestly, I think the only shot workers have is unionization plus really aggressive political action.

The problem is successful action will require setting aside pretty much all the culture war issues that are used to divide the working class, and I don't really see that happening. If anything culture-war polarization is getting worse. It will also require some formally-privileged groups like software engineers to jettison their self-deceptive libertarian delusions, and properly understand their true role in society (software engineers should have unionized pre-2022 when we had more economic power, but economic comfort and those delusions prevented it).

	▲	rayiner 4 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		[delayed]
	▲	smallmancontrov 14 minutes ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		The trouble with unionization is that it doesn't really address supply and demand, just bargaining. There are a dozen un-pulled levers available to bring aggregate labor supply and demand in balance. Overtime law, vacation policy, retirement policy, education funding, tax law (this is a big one -- taxes are obscenely lopsided on the labor/consumption economy vs the capital/investment economy), and so on. We need to pull those levers instead. Yep, it's going to be a helluva fight.

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redwood an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No one is giving them a 20T valuation. That's an order of magnitude larger than the market is currently targeting

	▲	npc99 33 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		They are probably adding up Anthropic + a number of other companies

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donbox an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

But but but... organizing.. be it in form of democractic/market processes (non-violent or otherwise) can act as a speed breaker.

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pixl97 an hour ago | parent [-]

Hopefully we're not too late.

Large companies have been spending millions in propaganda and attacks to ensure that people in the US think that unions are pure communism. By the time we get enough people to make a difference there may be T100's stepping on our bones at this point.

	▲	solyin 30 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		The problem is everyone's financial cliff is different. If I lost my job today, I have enough saved up to last me X months. Yours is Y, someone else's is Z. I'm going to go hungry at the end of X plus whatever. But since you're going to go hungry at Y plus whatever, we aren't forced to agree on what the right time to stop and stand up is. Z over there has rich parents so they've got longer. Nevermind poor W over there who doesn't, and has shorter. What a convenient little trap we've set for ourselves. If everyone's money was set to run out at the same time, there'd be problems.

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lkey 14 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

> I'm very pro-union BUT

You are 'pro' an abstract, unrealized union, which is not 'pro union' at all.

You have abdicated your obligation to align your actions with your stated beliefs.

Do not give up before trying. Do not believe the hype that your labour power doesn't matter. Even Amazon couldn't stop their most exploited workers from unionizing, is your company bigger that that? Is your position weaker than theirs?

Worse that can happen is that you started talking with your fellow workers and they aren't interested.

Just because SV is run by several millenarian cults doesn't mean you should take their delusions about neo slavery and feudalism (Thiel/Yarvin; your doomerism stems from here) or apotheosis (anthropic, EA) as inevitable. You should assume they believe their own hype, but not assume they understand material reality outside their insular social bubbles.

Thiel's last 3 or 4? attempts at building his techo-utopia collapsed before even starting; They have no motion outside of what they can purchase.